Are We Stifling Creativity? Options

[Jake Raby]

Remember:
Nothing ever stays the same and thats certainly been the case with the 914/ TIV world in the past 4-5 years.

Without the efforts of the network that I started a decade ago things like Nickies would only be available to the 911 and 356 crowd, the same would hold true with exhaust as guys would still be trying to make headers good for 135 HP function on 200 HP engines and roller cam equipped twin plug engines would still be a pipe dream...

None of this has been done by any one individual, but I will take the credit as the guys that got everyone working together to create the developments that we have today and I consider that my biggest accomplishment.

Five short years ago it was impossible for someone to bolt together a real 200 HP engine from off the shelf parts...

I was never here to make friends, because a guy like me pretty much only appreciates results.. I have made lots of friends and a few enemies along the way and have loved every minute of it!

[scotty b]

How did this turn into another Jake thread? He wasn't the only one referenced in the beginning but it seems alot here think he was the source of the thread. Only Mark knows for sure but I imagine his intent was about the bashing in general. We all know who here has a rep for being a dick and who doesn't. Problem is the new guy or the guy who only checks in from time to time doesn't know. It is therefore up to the rest of us to inform him.her and to give him/her support and help that some won't.

Eric I am with you 100 % Nuff said

As for myself I think my statement about not replying to threads was misunderstood. I have NO problem advising anyone who contacts me directly on a paint,bodywork or even welding subject. I have no problem sharing my experience, I just quit replying to threads on the subjects because they were overrun with less than stellar info. I used to try and straighten some aspects out but it seemed completely futile so I stopped. I have seen time and time again the same questions, ( looking to buy a welder, which one ? ) the same answers most of which are based on said posters personal experience ( I got a Mller 125 and love it...I got a Miller 125 and it's a P.O.S.) etc. etc. etc .......

Hell when it all blows up we can still blame Canada

[Jake Raby]

This became a Jake thread after several emails and even a phone call that interrupted my weekend on the subject. Yep- that pissed me off.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see who is being targeted by most of the smart assed comments on the thread. There isn't much I can't stand more than someone making snide remarks that doesn't have the balls to direct them at who they want to.

[r_towle]

I still will build a whopper while using Djet.
Did you know that Mercedes made a 4.8 liter 8 cylinder Djet motor...
What is half of 4.8 liter???
cool injectors, same size....

I will also build a flat eight..out or two fours..and I may turbo it just cause.

I think, and I commented, that the guy who did the lambo doors has real skills.
Awesome work.
Titanium rods...I love that idea...not something I could afford though.
Titanium is used all the time in Aerospace, so its certainly the right material.
I cant remember all the shit I forgot...

Oh, I personally like Sir Andy's car...molded bumpers are cool.
Now it has a 3.6 liter...
No bashing allowed. Get out of your chair, DO SOMETHING, then share it so we can bash it..its only fair.
Bash away.

Do all you guys remember how inspirational it was to watch Rick build his 918 with the 928 motor...if you have not read his amazing saga....go look it up..search for Alien..
We were all inspired to do something, to create..
Now we just bitch...
Get back to supporting each other.
I read a comment earlier in this thread by someone who likes to bash peoples ideas...it said "I have never even opened a motor"
I just shake my head wondering who is really making these bashing comments.
When (if it bothered me) it happens, just ask the person who is bashing or stifling creativity to take a few pics of their car and prove it...show us your creativity or dont comment negatively...

Rick and Boxer said it the right way.
If you have nothing good to say, shut up.

Some of the comments and tone of this place are being driven by a select few people that really need to walk away from the computer, BUY a welder, LEARN how a set of calipers works. SET UP valve geometry...with YOUR HANDS...and stop reading about it..
Trust me, we will help, we will advise, hell we will even COME OVER and help for real, no charge...just like we used to do!!!!

I went over a buds house the other night, why....he asked.
I made him try first...then we all coached him...in the end, he just needed someone to push him along the learning curve...I just happen to be a little bit further down the road of learning than him on this particular thing...

That is what we do here..we support, we learn, we help, we eat, we drink..we burp.. and for some of us...pink bunny ears are donned as a sign of respect for the world...
Rich

[orange914]

This forum is a great place to share ideas and get some feedback.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

I'm just worried that people are afraid to post about their new ideas, for fear of being told why it won't work, why they should have done something else, etc.

i've received nothing BUT good info. and feedback that has been a great help. i've attempted to contribute to the articles as many of you all have. i was once told the only dumb question you could ask is the one not asked. trust me if you guys can handle the "stupid" questions i've been asking, (with grace and maybe a snicker) then no one should worry about asking questions!!

What's the 914World like from your perspective?

not siding but i spend most of my 914 info. time here verses the "other site" becouse i find a more established and knowlegable crowd. (not dissin' the other 914 site at all)

[Pat Garvey]

Why share if people are going to put down your hard work that your proud of that the point of posting it!

You "really" need to understand the clown that slammed you. Ask him to post some of his handy work... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/jerkit.gif)

Take some time to search his drivel. Zero substance and some flatout bragadocious lies.

Congrats on all the "VERY" hard work getting those done right. True talent.

I'm with Pat (what have you done with Pat BTW?) create until your hearts content. I'm creating a GT clone... that's "my way".

No one's done anything with me! I still maintain my "purist" viewpoint, but also realize that there are others who's abominations I lust for! My 914 is NOT going to this year's Parade because of some personal problems. It will be put back on the road for pleasure, with some non-purist attachments. Colorado next year - maybe, but unlikely.

I'm planning on marketing my '73 CIS T this year, which will allow me to buy a 914 that is, shall we say, less than pure! I'm still a purist, but fully understand the pleasures out there for something unique, if not original.

There have been many times that I've naysay'd particular, umm, derivations of 914's. But, I still abide by creativity. Don't quite understand or condone some iterations, but that's just me. I still respect the engineering involved (in most cases)!

I have my purist 914. Time to have some fun! Don't expect me to go nuts though. No clones. No Raby motors. Maybe a conversion - probably a conversion.

Remember, I'm a retired accountant. Conservatism is the only thing I know.

Pat

[dw914er]

scott, that picture is priceless (IMG:style_emoticons/default/av-943.gif)



hey, it is almost spring
(in california, it is gorgeous)


i think it is time to quit bickering

i will remind everyone, we are all here for the 914, either as a hobby (Like most of us), to a job (liker raby or the dr from aa), but its still for the 914

we love our car, even if they dont seem to love us all the time (i think my car is stubborn)


so, lets quit the fuss, take of the tops (unless you have a steel roof) and go back to some fun (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

and afterwards, don't forget the (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer3.gif)

[championgt1]

I became a member here at the end of January 07. I had owned my first 914 for about only 3 days, and I knew nothing about it other than I had always wanted one and I finally had it.

I joined this site to learn more about my car and come here for questions when I needed some answers. Not only have my questions been answered when asked but I have also met some great people along the way. I have been able to purchase parts from local guys that not only gave me a great deal but also said,"just call me if you need anything else." Hell rhodyguy(kevin) spent an entire saturday over at my house in the cold ass garage to help me with my car, and I would do the same. Again I am a so called "newbie" to the entire 914 thing but I learn something everytime I log on.

Looking at peoples creations and projects is one of the best parts about this site, and I say if those people get flung crap about it just shrug it off and continue on as you were.

I believe a truely creative person can not be stopped just because someone does not agree with or like what they are doing.

Now lets all have a (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beer3.gif)

[Rand]

Dammit Jack, be careful or you will ruin Kevin's reputation.

Crap, I still need to post my front air-dam/spoiler project. It's killer and I owe major kudos to the rhodyguy. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[Rand]

You know, another perspective is... Let the bitches expose themselves. I mean, you post what you are doing - they post their meaningless dribble.... YOU WIN! The majority will always encourage the creativity of the doers. Geez, I'm sounding like a broken record.

[pffft]

Paul is one of the nicest and smartest guys out there. His stuff has only been shown once and he got bashed for doing it. Yes it's radical, Paul is a full blown custom guy, doesn't matter what he owns it still would be over the top custom. There are many things he does that could easily be adapted to the "norm" but he doesn't post for fear of being bashed.
Our loss.

And you should see his new dash board!!!

patrick

[marks914]

Remember, input is one thing and being downright mean is another.
If I had listened to others, I would not have done several production cars, SEMA Cars, had my own car in Hot Rod magazines and had worked on a contender for the Riddeler this year.
Do what you want, and take what you need form the input, you are doing it for you

Mark

[championgt1]

Dammit Jack, be careful or you will ruin Kevin's reputation.

Crap, I still need to post my front air-dam/spoiler project. It's killer and I owe major kudos to the rhodyguy. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

I also owe rhodyguy big.

You know, another perspective is... Let the bitches expose themselves. I mean, you post what you are doing - they post their meaningless dribble.... YOU WIN! The majority will always encourage the creativity of the doers. Geez, I'm sounding like a broken record.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) Well said!

[Spoke]

To the title: Are We Stifling Creativity; From my point of view, creativity may not be stifled by critical responses, just open communication stifled. This has been my experience on 914 boards.

One of my first posts was a tongue-in-cheek solution to my leaky 1.7L tired POS in my 71.

Skid Plate

In 2004 I had no interest in fixing leaks in an engine I knew I didn't want to work on so I did the skid plate to catch oil drips. Took quite a beating with comments. Got a few laughs which was the goal of the thread. The negative comments from this thread kept me from posting for a long time.

BTW, fast forward to 2008, the same engine is still there, still running good, hasn't dripped a single drop of oil anywhere, and hasn't blown up. Actually a blow up would have been welcome: What better reason to put a new engine in than the old one blew up.

On last note to Jake: Please don't stop posting on this site. I enjoy seeing the magic you do with these engines and one day I hope to have one of your engines in my car.

[749142]

for those any of us on either side,

i say stop your bitchin. if you dont like it thats cool just say you dont but dont be an ass about it. and if somebody wants to do something creative just for the hell of let em. im planning on setting up a custom made blower out of the type 4 cooling fan. maybe it wont work maybe it will be good for more hp who knows. but for the hell of creative im doing it. come on you haters bring on your stupid bitchin. but for those who dont do anything or just take the beaten path shut the hell up. i want to do it my way. now if you have had a bad experience doing something that i may be embarking on tell me and i will consider the problem and then i will figure how to get around it. but we all need to be more supportive in creativity. theres always a chance of failing but its always worth the shot. if those of us want to take that chance then dont nay say dammit. now let the creativness begin. and for those who are afraid of posting for fear of bashing screw the bashers post anyways and piss them off.
steven garis

[PeeGreen 914]

How did this turn into another Jake thread? He wasn't the only one referenced in the beginning but it seems alot here think he was the source of the thread. Only Mark knows for sure but I imagine his intent was about the bashing in general. We all know who here has a rep for being a dick and who doesn't. Problem is the new guy or the guy who only checks in from time to time doesn't know. It is therefore up to the rest of us to inform him.her and to give him/her support and help that some won't.

Eric I am with you 100 % Nuff said

As for myself I think my statement about not replying to threads was misunderstood. I have NO problem advising anyone who contacts me directly on a paint,bodywork or even welding subject. I have no problem sharing my experience, I just quit replying to threads on the subjects because they were overrun with less than stellar info. I used to try and straighten some aspects out but it seemed completely futile so I stopped. I have seen time and time again the same questions, ( looking to buy a welder, which one ? ) the same answers most of which are based on said posters personal experience ( I got a Mller 125 and love it...I got a Miller 125 and it's a P.O.S.) etc. etc. etc .......

Hell when it all blows up we can still blame Canada

Shoot, I just wish you were within a 100 miles of me. I know engines fair and people who know them very well. Body work and such I would love to learn from someone that is as knowledgable as you.

[chris914]

In general an open forum is a great tool for fostering creativity. It allows for a place where people can exchange ideas and gain insight to others viewpoints. Just having this thread is a very good example of that.

Exchanging ideas and understanding others allows us to form new thoughts that we may have not considered before.

Take the following example: One person sees a 914 and says it’s orange and another person sees it and says it’s red. Now you can say that one person is right or wrong. But another view might be is why does each person see it as a certain color (I’m always surprised when people say my 72 914 is red when it is orange).

Just like this thread, everyone may see it as one way or another, and right or wrong, just the exchange of ideas and thoughts is good and helps foster a more creative environment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity#Cr...arious_contexts

And from Bill Murray in "Meatballs"

“That’s just the attitude we don’t need, Phil. Sure, Mohawk has beaten us 12 years in a row. Sure, they’re terrific athletes. They’ve got the best equipment that money can buy. Hell, every team they’re sending over here has their own personal masseuse. Not masseur. Masseuse. But, it doesn’t matter. Do you know that every Mohawk competitor has electrocardiogram, blood and urine tests every 48 hours to see if there’s any change in his physical condition. Do you know that they use the most sophisticated training methods from the Soviet Union, East and West Germany, and the newest Olympic power, Trinidad Tobago. But, it doesn’t matter. It just doesn’t matter. It just doesn’t matter! I tell you it just doesn’t matter! It just doesn’t matter! Even...and even if we win...if we win... Ha! Even if we win. Even if we play so far over our heads that our noses bleed for a week to ten days. Even if God in Heaven above comes down and points His hand at our side of the field. Even if everyman woman and child held hands together and prayed for us to win. It just wouldn’t matter because all the really good looking girls would still go out with the guy from Mohawk cause they’ve got all the money. It just doesn’t matter if we win or we lose. It just doesn’t matter! It just doesn’t matter! It just doesn't matter!”

[ThinAir]

I've been pretty quiet here for a long time. It's not because I've been the victim of any of the things described, but just life being busy. But I have noticed a change in tone over time since the big "split" and it seems to me that there are far fewer technical discussions than I used to see.

I really appreciate that Mark asked the question because it is so critically important that we make everyone feel welcome here and that we all share as much as we can. I understand those with business interests who feel they must be somewhat restrictive, but even so we're all better off the more we share.

While the last 5 pages of debate was going on, I was having a blast on the Route 66 Ramble... driving my 2.0L 914/4 at 100 a couple of times and cruising at 95 on some great roads. The smile on my face was possible because the folks on this board were willing to answer my dumb questions with patience so that I could build a reliable "stock" Type IV that is serving my needs very well.

Build it or buy it, I don't care. Just drive the thing and enjoy it!

[euro911]

... Build it or buy it, I don't care. Just drive the thing and enjoy it!

Yaaaah (IMG:style_emoticons/default/mad.gif)

[Jake Raby]

Think about this:
When someone posts something with an engine that I know is heading them in the wrong direction (from my experience) it would be unfair for me NOT to say something to them. Sure it might embarass them or piss them off, but it might save an engine and a few thousand bucks... Does anyone know how many times I have seen pics of heads posted here that were just rebuilt and noted cracks in them that no one saw with their own eyes in person??? Thats just one example...

When one of these engines fails, no matter why or how it gives the opposition and TIV critics one more thing to bitch about. I'l do anything to keep those things from occuring and if that means pissing someone off- so be it.