Thinking Megasquirt again, on the /6, Blame Excellence Options

[Dr Evil]

Scotty B let me read his copy of the latest Excellence where they put a MS derived injection system and put it on a 6cyl motor. The kit was from Bitz Racing, cost $1600 and requires some CIS parts. Looking at the kit I am thinking that I can do it for much less. I already have 2 full CIS systems, I can build a MS, and I can buy the fuel system parts independently.
So you figure, $1600 for an install and run kit --> http://www.bitzracing.com/products/index.html

Parts cost:
- Fuel rail = $10/ft
- Their recommended fuel pressure regulator, MSD-2222 = $75
- Their recommended injectors, ACC-150630 = $230 for 6
- MS v.3.0 kit with everything = $200 --> http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/megasqu...case-p-108.html
- Injector adapter bungs = $120

Total = about $650

I have not priced an O2 sensor just yet, though.


Hummm (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

[RJMII]

Why MS-I ? (as opposed to MS-II or micro)

[Dr Evil]

MS-I with the 3.0 board is great for just fuel. The other versions you mention, IIRC, all have spark management which I dont need. But, MS-II could be done as well for about $50 more.

[ws91420]

You got the engine all sorted out w/ CIS and your ignition system working. Why take a chance having to go through that again w/ a new injection system? my .02

[RJMII]

Doc, I've got the MS-II, and I did chose it for the spark control. =o)

I see why the MS-I now.

[jd74914]

Do it!


Note: That was a very selfish request. I agree with Welby but would like to see a /6 megasquirt install thread. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)

[Dr Evil]

Welby is wrong, my system was not completely sorted out (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) Starting sucked, and it was a bitch to tune...I know the MS system having already built one and promptly selling it since I had CIS. I like to tinker. It will be a while before this comes to fruition, but the $1000 saving for ding it yourself is pretty nice (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[type11969]

Doc -

I have a MS1 or 2 sitting on a shelf here that I don't forsee using anytime soon so if you want to borrow it for a while feel free.

-Chris

[Dr Evil]

Ooooo, thats not good. Now I am getting more obligated to do it (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[smdubovsky]

Mike, Im going to microsquirt my 6 (I like the pkg and especially the weatherproof connector.) I machined my own fuel rail for a 3.2 intake I fixed. More importantly, I have the proper AN port contour cutter. Check it out (click on the EFI conversion link):

http://www.salazar-racing.com/users/Stephen_Dubovsky/

I already have almost everything to complete it except the ECU, hoses, and injectors (which btw, I hear the newer ford racing ones have a better spray pattern then the accels.) Replumbing the fuel system & adding the stainless lines is going to take the most time.

Since I've got carbs, Im also going to leave the spark alone for now. But, no point in buying an ECU that can't do it in the future though. It'll help tweak the power, mpg, & driveability later.

BTW, buy an 8-pack of injectors. They're not much more expensive and if/when you have a problem w/ one you have a matched backup.

[toon1]

You can buy the MS-I and run MS&SE code.

i have been running it on mine for about 4k miles with no prob. It's easy to install and easy to use. It's basically like the MS-II, some of the tables are a little different.

You will also nee a wire harness (50$), TPS and I highly recommend a relay board. It makes the install easier.

Keith

[rfuerst911sc]

If any of you guys need a heated O2 sensor for your FI conversions I have at least two if not 3 of the Innovate sensors from a failed MS conversion just hanging in the garage. These were $100.00 + each when I bought them I'll let them go for $45.00 shipped each or better if you take more than one.

[mightyohm]

Mike, awesome, go for it. You might consider Microsquirt if you want to mount the ECU in the engine bay, but Microsquirt has limitations on the # of injectors you can drive depending on the impedance of the injectors.

MSII is evolutionarily way ahead of MSI, I'd recommend getting one of the most up to date Megasquirt boxes with an MSII if possible, even if you aren't going to use spark. Remember MSI is almost 10 year old technology now.

With that said Megasquirt will never be "easy" so be ready for some serious tinkering/tuning time no matter what you choose. Mark and I can speak from experience. It can be very frustrating when things don't work.

And please, no CIS parts, you know what I think of CIS (the equivalent of a $0.99 lawn sprinkler on your fuel injection). Just kidding... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[turboman808]

Dr Evil I was just reading the same article a few days ago and it really peaked my interest.

I would like to convert my 6 into a twin plug monster in another year. The haltek ecu seems a bit outdated and I would like to get something new that I can learn and use myself. TWM fuel injection is already there and ready to go.

Figured I would get the engine work done over the next winter and then tackle the programing in the spring.

I was also looking at the AEM coils that sit on the plugs. http://www.aempower.com/ViewCategory.aspx?CategoryID=123



I can't say I have looked into it much to see what all if fully involved but it seems possible to accomplish. 350 hp would be alot of fun. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[smdubovsky]

I would like to convert my 6 into a twin plug monster in another year.

My 911 is a 3.3L twin plug TWM-itb 'monster' w/ Haltech E11v2. A great unit for sure, but the Microsquirt gets my vote today for 95+% of the usability at 25% of the price:) The uS can drive 4inj/bank(hi imped) so it can easily do batch fire like the 3.2 carrera motronics do.

The AEM CoP is interesting. Will they fit? You only need ~4.5" to clear the valve cover and they look to come long enough... Wonder if the boxster/996 CoPs will work. Those are pretty long too. The AEMs look to be ~$60ea but don't include the CDI ignition drivers:( The boxsters are self contained and only ~$55ea. Though a twin-plug carb/itb motor just doesn't look right w/o a big 12-plug dizzy;)

Edit: Mike, make sure you install a TPS. The bitz kit doesn't use one and I've talked to at least one person who had driveability issues that it probably would have solved IMO.

[yarin]

Go with the latest, you can always disable features you don't need. It's a bitch to add features down the road.

Also, get the relay board, it's a must. Get at least one innovative LC-1 wideband O2s. can be had for $199ea or less.

It's a hell of a learning experience, expect headaches and a fair amount of troubleshooting. There are a number of fixes that have poped up over the past few years that are must haves depending on your configuration.

However.. i say go for it! As long as you know what you are getting into, it's a really rewarding project once it's all tuned and running.

Keep us posted! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[Dr Evil]

I am gonna have to look into the uS (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) I built a version one board, my own programmer and the stimulator a while ago and it was much more difficult than the new stuff. Now you can get kits that have chips programmed, with assembled parts bags, etc. I am not too interested in getting extra bells and whistles. If I want them in the future, I will just build the latest iteration available. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

I'll have to get you to build me some rails, Stephen (IMG:style_emoticons/default/thumb3d.gif)

[Dr Evil]

uS is about $400, right? I can build a MS-I 3.0 for 50%. Also, they are currently unavailable so far as I know.

[Gary]

Yes on both accounts, although another run should be ready soon.

If you check this thread: DIY microsquirt, I asked about a board-only microsquirt where the signals are available on a 2x18 header for low $200's. Availability looks to be weeks to months. One of my long-term projects is to do a daughter card that would plug into this board when available and a 911 DME harness.

[smdubovsky]

Mike, thats right. *BUT* you get a small, waterproof, already built & tested unit, w/ an external map sensor. Thats all worth the extra $200 to me. You're saving lots of money elsewhere, splurge on the complicated part;) FWIW, I really like the external map. There is no problem running to a FLAPS to buy a GM sensor vs the motorola one built into the megasquirt.

I like Garys idea of putting a bare board in a 911 ECU;)