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> Flat fan again..., found this today online
turboman808
post Sep 23 2008, 04:05 PM
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I really like the looks of a air cooled motor with a flat fan and ITBs. Just looks so right!!!

Anyways came across this today.

(IMG:http://backup.trinityhome.org/~harakiri/pics/porsche/4porsches021-640x480.jpg)

http://backup.trinityhome.org/~harakiri/car/

Looks like they did it more out of necessity to get the motor to fit. But I think someday I would like to do this on my car.
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ruddyboys
post Sep 23 2008, 04:18 PM
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It does look great, but would you loose HP's with that fanbelt setup?
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melnyk
post Sep 23 2008, 05:04 PM
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corvair style. hope you invest alot of money in belts.
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turboman808
post Sep 23 2008, 05:08 PM
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QUOTE(ruddyboys @ Sep 23 2008, 02:18 PM) *

It does look great, but would you loose HP's with that fanbelt setup?



I am not sure but I imagine you could also argue that trying to force the air in at an angle instead of straight down causes you hp.

But I really don't have any idea. If it does it's got to be less then 1 hp.
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melnyk
post Sep 23 2008, 05:08 PM
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p.s. i dont care what that site says my buddy's corvair needed a new belt at almost every 3000 miles
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turboman808
post Sep 23 2008, 05:15 PM
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QUOTE(melnyk @ Sep 23 2008, 03:08 PM) *

p.s. i dont care what that site says my buddy's corvair needed a new belt at almost every 3000 miles



seems you have to put just the right amount of tension on the belt. To much and it gets broken pretty easy. Seems they run them pretty loose.
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jd74914
post Sep 23 2008, 05:34 PM
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I've worked a lot on one of my friend's Corvairs. Its his daily driver, and we broke a few belts before getting the setup right (3 guys put together the car from a pipe of parts without a manual (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) ). Their belts do get run relatively loose. You also really need to align the pulleys well; then they work great. They do loose a bunch of hp though. There is a page somewhere online with the hp loss specs.


Back to the discussion at hand, horizontal fans are wicked cool. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
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JeffBowlsby
post Sep 23 2008, 05:55 PM
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Here is another set-up you might consider...an electric fan. No HP loss, but probably best left for just AX cars.


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BarberDave
post Sep 23 2008, 06:01 PM
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(IMG:style_emoticons/default/smilie_pokal.gif)

The whole secret is the spot on alinement of the belt , I had a 63, in the day,

carried 3 all the time. when you get the alinement sorted out , then tension is

critical. Should be good to go then. All ways wondered why someone didn't put a

63 Turbo in a 914? I believe 150 hp, then the turbo comes on. In 63 , 64 I drag

raced a Max Performance 426 Wedge, a guy from Mich. would come down to Ohio

with a modified 63 Corvar And hand us all our Ass.

Dave (IMG:style_emoticons/default/slap.gif)
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Rand
post Sep 23 2008, 06:09 PM
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I think Jake used to do that with his DTM, but not sure if he still does.
(Jake, if these are yours and you don't want them posted here, just tell me and I'll delete them. I got these pics off the web a while back.)


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number6
post Sep 23 2008, 06:16 PM
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QUOTE(Jeff Bowlsby @ Sep 23 2008, 04:55 PM) *

Here is another set-up you might consider...an electric fan. No HP loss, but probably best left for just AX cars.


Jeff, is that the electric fan setup from Air Cooled Classicss? -->

http://www.aircooledclassics.biz/parts1.shtml

I recently contacted them and was told that it is no longer available, that they don't even have the mold for it any more. Not enough demand, I guess. Bummer.

If not from Air Cooled Classics, can you tell me where?

Has anyone here run this system? Could it be adapted to for street/daily driving duties?
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JeffBowlsby
post Sep 23 2008, 06:22 PM
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QUOTE(number6 @ Sep 23 2008, 05:16 PM) *

QUOTE(Jeff Bowlsby @ Sep 23 2008, 04:55 PM) *

Here is another set-up you might consider...an electric fan. No HP loss, but probably best left for just AX cars.


Jeff, is that the electric fan setup from Air Cooled Classicss? -->

http://www.aircooledclassics.biz/parts1.shtml

I recently contacted them and was told that it is no longer available, that they don't even have the mold for it any more. Not enough demand, I guess. Bummer.

If not from Air Cooled Classics, can you tell me where?

Has anyone here run this system? Could it be adapted to for street/daily driving duties?


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/thumb3d.gif) thats the one. Don Ramsay at Air Cooled Classics. Its been a few years since I spoke to him about them.
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number6
post Sep 23 2008, 06:22 PM
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QUOTE(Rand @ Sep 23 2008, 05:09 PM) *

I think Jake used to do that with his DTM, but not sure if he still does.
(Jake, if these are yours and you don't want them posted here, just tell me and I'll delete them. I got these pics off the web a while back.)


That looks like a Riechert I've seen...

And on the topic of vendors... I just read that Tangerine will be coming out with a horizontal fan in the near future (~summer '09):

http://www.tangerineracing.com/Engine.htm

Cool!
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Rand
post Sep 23 2008, 06:23 PM
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Turning a fan fast enough to cool a street car takes hp from the motor no matter what. There's no free lunch. Driving the fan with an electric motor instead off the crank just moves the drag to the alternator (and you may need a bigger alternator). Again - talking street car.

I like the looks of that electric setup, but unfortunately I have only heard bad things about it. I suspect that's why you don't see more of them.
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URY914
post Sep 23 2008, 07:01 PM
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Talk to RacerChris about top fans and belts.
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plymouth37
post Sep 23 2008, 08:10 PM
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I have always loved the look of the horizontal fans.
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif) I wonder if I could rig up a vintage looking belt driven fan on top of my top mount intercooler...
Maybe cut out a giant finger eating hole between the speedster humps ala 804...
Oh yeah! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif)
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davep
post Sep 23 2008, 10:14 PM
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QUOTE(Rand @ Sep 23 2008, 04:23 PM) *

Turning a fan fast enough to cool a street car takes hp from the motor no matter what. There's no free lunch. Driving the fan with an electric motor instead off the crank just moves the drag to the alternator (and you may need a bigger alternator).

Exactly. Running an electric fan will transfer the HP loss through the alternator, and with dual losses the HP loss may be greater than the belt losses. As you say, an upgraded alternator would also be required. There is no free lunch.
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Richard Casto
post Sep 23 2008, 11:18 PM
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I like the look. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Porsche made this arrangement work on the early '60s F1 flat 8 engine as well as the 917 engines. But they didn't use belts. They used a direct shaft drive system. According to "Excellence was Expected" for the GP engine it only used about 9 HP to run the fan.
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Type 4 Unleashed
post Sep 24 2008, 01:02 AM
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Yes this is the Riechert setup, that I believe is no longer made.

(IMG:http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/Type4Unleashed/REICHERT1.jpg)

Here is a 235 RWHP Turbo Powered Type lV with a Riechert Horizontal fan and the owner say's he is happy with the cooling. And hasn't had belt issues, even when the Turbo spools.

(IMG:http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/Type4Unleashed/68897.jpg)

This is also a Reichert setup, that was made for the military hence the O.D. Green. It was used on a self propelled Type lV powered 70mm Field Howitzer's, used by most of the NATO Armies.

(IMG:http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/Type4Unleashed/Flat01.jpg)

This one is made by http://www.laperformance.co.uk/ and they are still available

(IMG:http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i134/Type4Unleashed/horizontal.jpg)
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turboman808
post Sep 24 2008, 10:42 AM
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Dam all these kits are for the flat 4 motors. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)
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