OT Who do you side with?, Campus Police Offer Shoots Intoxicated.. Options

[Hawktel]

Police work is a dangerous job.

My Pop gave me the "Do what the Cop tells you cause he/she has a Gun, and is under paid, and is compensating for years of High School abuse, and is more likely than any other profession to get a divorce, and is under-trained for the job he/she does"

I consider getting pulled over the second most dangerous thing that happens to me.

Either way, The kid was stupid. I agree with the suicide by cop part. On the other hand, I don't get emotional when a cop buys a farm. I think its assumed risk, and if you don't want to play the game, get some other job.

[mikester]

Having been on the wrong side of a cop a number of times - I used to work for the cable company as an engineer. I'd have to go to hub sites to do fiber planning and such. They'd change the alarm code on me and by the time I got through to dispatch to get the right code the cop would be there pointing a gun at me every time.

Do what the cop says. Hands at 10 and 2, only do what he asks you to do and when you want to reach for somehting - ask him first. Anything else is a threat you don't need to make. Do 'em a favor and don't do anything. they'll be a lot nicer to you in the long run.

This guy didn't really have it coming - it's just a tragic thing. 100M isn't going to bring him back. There is currently legislation against the medical system that would limit payouts on malpractice suits - maybe we should have something like that here.

On dateline last night I think I saw that an Iraqi father was killed mistakenly and his family only got $2000 US. In Iraq that's probably a lot...but...whatever...

[campbellcj]

Here in L.A. even the traffic cops have nervous trigger fingers -- and I can't blame 'em one bit. I have a ton of respect for (most of) the folks in law enforcement, and my ears perk up when I am spoken to. Being drunk or stoned or whatever does not change that...it's basic survival instinct.

It sounds basically like a terrible accident to me. The only question in my mind is whether use of lethal force was really justified/necessary as opposed to a "disabling" shot; but it was apparently dark so the officer could not verify whether the kid was armed, and/or may not have been able to aim precisely enough for a non-lethal shot.

[Pnambic]

Another thing....the department said they couldn't afford to train their officers on how to use chemicals (pepper spray and the like) . That's one of the changes to the training proceedures I think. I don't know if he had a batton or not. I think its absolutely absurd that a university trains their officers to use guns, but not pepper spray.

From what I remember of the inquest last year, the officer acted as trained and was cleared of criminal charges. I agree with that.

---

I HATE the "I was drunk and didn't know what I was doing." excuse!

Everybody knows that when you drink alcohol, especially enough to get you blood alcohol level up to 4 times legal driving limit, you get drunk. And I'm pretty sure that it hasn't escaped anyone's notice that drunk people do stupid shit. I don't care if you're drunk or not, you should be held accountable for your actions. If I lunge at a cop who's pointing a gun at me, whether I'm drunk or not, I should be shot.

Really sorry about the kid. Maybe a real nice guy. But he's dead b/c he threatened an armed officer of the law (sobriety should make no difference).

[/rant]

Ideal circumstances....officer pulled pepper spray or a tazer(sp?) instead of the gun and Porsche's are rust proof, but we all know things very rarely happen idealy.

[rhodyguy]

a moving leg attached to a wobbling drunk is pretty hard to hit in the dark andy. .34?the cop did him a favor sparing him from a hangover (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) . if he was banging on my door i'd let him in and give him a couple of new exclimation marks also.

kevin

[need4speed]

. . .
This guy didn't really have it coming - it's just a tragic thing. 100M isn't going to bring him back. There is currently legislation against the medical system that would limit payouts on malpractice suits - maybe we should have something like that here.
. . .

I agree about the $100M not bringing the kid back.

But I also strongly disagree with legislation on damage caps.

Such legislation won't take into consideration, cases where, say the kid was paralyzed or severely brain damaged. His medical bills for the rest of his life would be in the tens of millions. Just to vegetate in a hospital bed for the next 30 years. I don't think that such expensive burdens should just be thrust on his parents like that, when the cop could just have used tear gas or a taser.

In that regard - the kid was VERY lucky.

I know it's a very popular concept in this nation that greedy trial lawyers have driven up the cost of medical care due to malpractice suits. But the real issue here is that these suits, despite their multi million dollar payouts, don't actually punish the guilty parties. If a doctor is sued for malpractice, his insurance company pays, and he keeps right on doing what he was doing, and his patience pay for the increased insurance rate. The only real winner is the insurance company, and often, the lawyer.
Worse still - the cost of medical treatment alone - without malpractice factored in, is similary skewed by major abuse of our patent system.
I'm all for capitalism and free enterprise - and making a buck. But these companies are obviously VERY profitable, even with their skanky accounting practices hiding the money so they look like they're not. When marketing budgets are 5 times R&D budgets, and their CEO's make 4000 times what their scientists and engineers make, you know there's no real profitability problem going on. A company making life-saving drugs or equipment should not need marketing. Life saving just doesn't need to be pushed. I'm not saying we should get rid of drug patents, I'm saying that the extensions and wrangling that goes on to prevent competitors from producing low-cost generic alternatives has gone way too far.

Sorry this is straying so far off topic. I just feel quite strongly about this issue - that the main reason why medical care in this country is so unaffordable, is because of the situation with the industry lobbyists writing laws that make competition in the drug industry impossible. Remeber that what makes Capitalism great, is FREE enterprise, Competition breeds excellence. A Patent, is, at it's root, a government-sanctioned Monopoly. The Constitution says "Limited" and ". . . to promote the useful arts and sciences" - NOT to guarantee a certain profit margin, etc.

The whole point of this is: the argument that malpractice suits are why medical care costs too much is a lie. And the rationale for lawsuit caps is crap.

That's not to say that some of these lawsuits haven't gotten way out of hand.
The woman who recently was awarded $1,600,000,000 (that's 1.6 with a capital B-billion dollars) for being defrauded $4800 on a $25,000 life insurance policy. . . well those jurors should just be shot (and the fraudulent insurance salesman should just go to jail, period - the fine here, is pure crap).

And if this kid's dead - maybe a few hundred thou - a reasonable, nomal, average life-insurance policy. But $100 Million? Absurd - he's dead. There's no expensive medical care required here. Just some sad parents who, unfortunately, are going to have to learn to go on after a tragic accident.

[fiid]

Well said.

[anthony]

His medical bills for the rest of his life would be in the tens of millions. Just to vegetate in a hospital bed for the next 30 years. I don't think that such expensive burdens should just be thrust on his parents like that, when the cop could just have used tear gas or a taser.

Someone's parents won't end up paying that kind of bill unless they already have big money and can afford the best private care and doctors. We, the taxpayers pay the bill. Someone like that goes on state disability and receives medicare.

[Joe Bob]

Extremely drunk....out on the town....pounding on the wrong door....lunge at a cop....how many holes do YOU want?

He's lucky he wasn't pounding on MY door, I woulda filled him so full a holes they woulda needed corks......

[red914]

interesting thread.
all in all, it ends up being just one less bad drunk.
aiming a handgun, at 0330, under pressure, in strange surroundings, with more unknown variables that i can list quickly, is a bad situation, regardless of training; the security officer now has to live with the realization that he took a life. the parents have to live with the realization that their son displayed poor judgement, to the extent of threatening others. they should all have compassion for each other, and hope it doesn't happen to anyone else they know. oh, and they should not try to enrich an ambulance chaser in the process.