How to prevent oil leaks?, Surely it must be possible! Options

[ThinAir]

I've always believed that it is POSSIBLE to build a Type IV that does not leak, with either synthetic or natural oils. The question I've had is "how?"

This gets to "where do Type IVs leak from"? Now there are obvious places like oil pressure senders that can be problems from time to time when something malfunctions, but that's not the issue. It's more an issue of the kind of oil "seep" that results in the bottom of the engine being moist with oil, but you can't tell where it's coming from. It makes me wonder what kind of sealant (if any) should be used in places like
Case halves
Push rod tubes
Cylinder-to-case
Cylinder-to-head
etc.

Since I'm in the middle of a rebuild, I'd really like to do this right. When I got my training on overhauling Type 1s the sealant of choice was "GaskaCinch", but it's not 1980 anymore and there have been lots of advancements. What is available now, and where should it be used, to achieve a Type IV that does not seep oil?

[ChrisReale]

Taco Plate. Many people (including myself) fail to include all the washers that help prevent leaks from this god forsaken part of the engine. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/fighting19.gif)

[Jake Raby]

If I get a single drop in the dyno tray after 8 hours I'm pissed!

Its not the sealants, its the prep work and surfaces combined with 13-14 different sealannts for each engine..

Most of all its experience- took ME 10 years to get a bone dry TIV... You won't do it after just 1-2 engines, if you do go buy a lottery ticket immediately-

[type47]

aircraft engine rebuilders put a string in the mating faces, i think it's a silk thread, to stop/prevent leaks. maybe there's an application with type IV

[Jake Raby]

I use waxed dental floss dipped in curul K2 for weeks at a time before installation...

Case halves seldom leak unless an idiot pried the halves apart like a Medieval craftsman.

I have built engines with nothing between the halves and they didn't leak.

Its the rest of the engine thats a challenge

[need4speed]

I always figured if you've got a Porsche/VW engine that doesn't leak oil, you're doing something wrong. . . I thought they were *supposed* to leak oil.

[914ghost]

I've built a bunch that dont leak for a looong time...and on my personal cars I steam clean the engine a couple times a month all year long. I think they eventually a leak a little or 'sweat' oil, but if you keep them clean you'll never know.
Air cooled engines may look like they leak more than they do because you're blowing dirty air all over the engine every second it runs so a little teeny oil film makes the dirt stick.
PowderCoat it and keep it clean.
Bob O

LOL. I think this will be a long battle. Or you can put duralube in it, drain the oil, and drive it like that. That's what they did on the commercial! I've seen the bottoms of 993's and they leak oil also!

[tat2dphreak]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) switch to a v8... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif)

[ThinAir]

I use waxed dental floss dipped in curul K2 for weeks at a  time before installation...

Other than Dental Floss, I have no idea what this stuff is. Is this for real or are you pulling my chain?

I've not finished watching the Type IV overhaul video, but so far all you've talked about is Permatex Form-a-Gasket and the Teflon stuff. (I'm only as far as putting in the oil pump.) Is there anything about case assembly & sealants from the video that you would now recommend changing?

[adam912]

Having just done mine over Christmas I'm an expert (yah right....). I took Jake's and John's suggestions and used mostly Kuril, bought from John @Aircooled.net. Wierd stuff, truly non-hardening it seems and does not dissolve in oil. I used Kuril K2 on the case halves and Kuril T (really wierd-it's sort of fluorescent green and has a strange consistency sort of like grape jelly)) under the barrels, oil pump gasket, filter gasket etc etc. I went for Jake's suggestion and used Permatex teflon on the pushrod tube O-rings. Oh--and find the thread on Shoptalk Forums about making sure your tubes and Orings fit properly. I think Ray Greenwood was the author of the thread. The pushrod tube Orings at the case end were WAY loose on my motor! No wonder I was losing so much oil before.

Result after a few thousand miles--NO LEAKS!!!! Just a little weeping I find under the case. Ain't technology grand????

Adam
66 912, 2.2L T4

[need4speed]

Is there any chance that this K2 junk could break down and little chunks lodge in the engine where one wouldn't want it lodged?

The local dune-buggy shop seals their engines with Gorilla Snot (3m Super Weather Strip Adhesive) - (which is why I don't let them work on my car! But I gladly buy parts from them - local source; open on Saturdays), they swear by it. But if little yellow rubber balls of that stuff clog up the passages where oil is supposed to be flowing, I'd say that's not a good thing. . .

[Air_Cooled_Nut]

...
Most of all its experience- took ME 10 years to get a bone dry TIV... You won't do it after just 1-2 engines, if you do go buy a lottery ticket immediately-

Huh?

Yeah, it took you years of experience to finally figure out how to get one not to leak. Now basically every engine you seal the same way isn't gonna leak...right? If true, then you know how to make 'em so they don't leak...right? And if you know how to do that then you can tell other people how to do it so every engine they seal as per your instruction won't leak as well...right?

If you don't want to give away anything you consider a trade secret then say so but don't pussy foot around the subject. If you are willing to help then do so otherwise your comment isn't much help to the average joe who doesn't do it for a living. Sheesh!

[ThinAir]

I noticed in a thread over on STF that Jake said he was gonna start selling a "kit" of the sealants he uses. I'm wondering if that is available. Jake has also mentioned selling modified Type 1 oil pumps. The Massive Type IV store isn't open online, are these things available for phone order?

[Air_Cooled_Nut]

That'd be cool, as long as directions are provided (where to use what, how thick/thin, etc.) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[steve@ottosvenice.com]

Use top Bond on the case halfs, Curil K2 ont the gasket sealing areas. Clean all mating surfaces with M E K . Steve

http://www6.instantestore.net/merchant5605..._rebuilding.cfm

[ThinAir]

This weekend I discovered a leaking valve cover gasket so I tried something new. I put Permatex Teflon Thread Sealant on the surface of the gasket so that this material was between the gasket and the head. It looks like the leak is fixed, but the real test will be when I take the cover off for the next 3,000 mile maintenance. (As in, how easily will it come off and how tough will it be to clean up.)

I had never heard of this stuff until I watched Jake's Type IV overhaul video. When I researched it and found that it handles oil, remains pliable, and cleans up with alcohol it seemed like just the the thing to try in this situation. This was a fairly recent gasket installation so I figured I needed to do more than my usual on this gasket. Usually I glue the gasket to the cover with Permatex Form-a-Gasket, then coat the head side of the gasket with wheel bearing grease.

Thanks to all who have replied to this topic. The thoughts that have been shared have been very helpful. I'd still like to hear again from Jake on whether he has changed anything from what he showed in the video and whether he's started offering the sealant kits and oil pumps.