Just came back from Firebird Raceway, Not a happy camper... Options

[Derek Seymour]

First off I would like to say Thank You to the AZPCA, Mark, and Steve for the excellent DE ground school! Also a HUGE thank you to my instructor Dave R for a wonderful ride in his 914/6, I can only hope to one day have the skill that he has!
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)

This was the first outing for my Dad and I in his freshly converted 914/6. He has spent gobs of time, energy, and $$$ to change a really well peforming 74 914/4 into what he hopes will be a well performing 914/6. Because it is a 74 he had two ideas in mind with the conversion.
1. Do a 914 LE "tribute" with the paint scheme but go a few extra steps and lighten it up with a fiberglass hood and decklid. GT fenders are sitting in the garage and will be the next step.

2. If Porsche had made the LE in the 6 configuration then it probably would have been a 2.7... so that is what is now in the engine bay.

That's where the fun just stopped... literally.

The motor had so much blow by that it vomited about 1.5 quarts into the catch can after 2 laps. We also probably filled the oil tank up a little high so we drained about 4 quarts out to hit the 10-12 quart mark. With some excellent advice from James Patrick we re-routed the hose for the catch can so exces oil wouldn't pool in the line and then vomit launch itself into the can when you hit the power.

Trial number 2 lasted 3 laps, all seemed well so my Dad headed pack to the pits to check everything out and make sure we were good to go... the motor then died turning on to pit row... and wouldn't re-fire. So it was pushed back to the pits. I cam eback in from my awesome shotgun seat ride in Dave's 6 to check on progress. The look on my Dad's face said it all... done for the day. I checked the catch can to see if at least that had been solved... full to the brim... oil was all over the engine bay since he catch can was probably full after lap 2.

Now this is a freshly built motor... so my Dad made sure not to go over 5K on the tach. A little blow by is to be expected with a new motor because the rings have yet to fully seat, but 3-4 quarts in less than 5 miles? Seems suspect to me.

So here is the kicker...
This is an engine from Motor Meister!!!!!

I had heard/read the bad reports but I have also heard just the opposite. So when my Dad mentioned he was going to get a turn key form Motor Meister I thought to myself "Well... don't be negative, there are "good" stories out there about Motor Meister, so be positive and maybe this will be one of those experiences."

Now I am wondering if I should have offered to kick in some $$$ to go to another builder. I probably would not have had the $$$ to buy my 76 914 that I just got if I had... but then I also would have had piece of mind... and I would have actually driven the car today and planned for future events. Now... I don't know what the future holds (IMG:style_emoticons/default/WTF.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/headbang.gif)

Maybe the rings will seat... maybe they won't. Might not be the rings at all. Maybe the damn thing will blow up next time. Hell we haven't even tried starting it again so it might be shot now.

My Dad is going to follow up with Motor Meister...

I'll update this as things progress... or regress (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stromberg.gif)

[J P Stein]

This is a sad tale. The punch line at the end made it worse.
You will find few good words about MM on any Porsche forum....if any.

You should post this on the Pelican engine rebuild forum.....but be prepared for some unkind words. Some one there may be able to point you in the proper direction for getting this resolved.

[grantsfo]

It sounds like sypmtoms of an overfilled oil tank. How are you checking oil levels? Basic question are you checking levels with motor running? You lowered level to 10 to 12 quarts after puking 1.5 quarts and draining 4? Total of 15.5 to 17.5 quarts? What oil tank are you using? I probably ran somthing close to 9 quarts in mine if I went higher I could expect oil bath

However if its a MM motor it could be just the beginnnings of your worries.

[john rogers]

I agree with the oil tank question, what type are you running? If it is in the stock location then the oil level is checked as per the stocj 914-6 with the engine hot and idling and the car level. If it is a custom remote tank such as the round one I have in my race car, the oil level is checked slightly different. The car is idleing, hot or regular temp and level but the oil level has to be below the top baffle when looking in the fill hole. Any more oil than that and it will puke like crazy.

I would pull the plugs to see if they are oil soaked possibly but if you are getting blow by then I think the engine would have been smoking so badly you would have been black flagged.

[Derek Seymour]

I agree with the oil tank question, what type are you running? If it is in the stock location then the oil level is checked as per the stocj 914-6 with the engine hot and idling and the car level. If it is a custom remote tank such as the round one I have in my race car, the oil level is checked slightly different. The car is idleing, hot or regular temp and level but the oil level has to be below the top baffle when looking in the fill hole. Any more oil than that and it will puke like crazy.

I would pull the plugs to see if they are oil soaked possibly but if you are getting blow by then I think the engine would have been smoking so badly you would have been black flagged.

Yes we for sure put to much oil in. It is a remote tank that holds 16 quarts. Also yes my Dad was black flagged on his first time out due to the copious black smoke. The last time areound, no smoke, which led him to believe it was fixed. being cautious he wanted to check that it was really okay and that is when it died.

After doing fuel and ignition checks we have come to the conclusion that it probably has oil built up in the combustion chamber. The plugs seemed okay, but it wasn't run long enough to get much carbon buildup on the plugs so symptons still point in that direction.

After digging a bit more into it it seems that my Dad has already been given the run-around from MM prior to this experience. This was after putting down the deposit but prior to receiving the motor. In order to avoid any unpleasentness he is just going to work through it a step at a time. James Patrick of Patrick Motorsports has been very helpful throughout the year and a half that it has taken to do the engine swap so he will be confering with them.

Right now the plan is to run the breather tube back up into the remote oil tank that is located in the front trunk instead of in to the catch tank. If James gives a thumbs up on this that will be the next step.

I'm optomistic that the Gremlins will be worked out soon enough.

[john rogers]

Jim puts his oil yanks in the front a lot with his race cars. The folks in San Diego tend to mount them in the rear trunk, a bit closer to the oil pump suction. Either location will work if it is plumbed correctly. Basically the engine vent hose on the top usually vents to the oil tank and then the oil tank has a vent or puke tank that will catch any over flow if the tank is too full. If the engine case is just vented to the puke tank, you'll end up pumping the oil out quickly.

[sww914]

I was about to explain that is just how trips to the track are sometims, then I read the Motor Meister part.
I am truly sorry. No fun from here on out as far as that engine is concerned. If you read between the lines the MM site basically tells you that they build engines with the shit that other people throw away.

[mudfoot76]

I was about to explain that is just how trips to the track are sometims, then I read the Motor Meister part.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

There are so many tales of woe and the rightly earned moniker "Motor Sheister" that I have trouble understanding how they are still in business. Hopefully your troubles are simply overfilled oil tank and not the stereotypical botch-job that MM engines are. Search here, pelican, etc and you'll quickly find photographic evidence that MM == (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stromberg.gif)

Here is a good example:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread....ghlight=Meister

[dw914er]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

I've never heard a positive thing about MM's motors


hopefully things work out on the car Derek

[9146racing]

sooooo, why (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) are they still in business? not the first time i hear this!!

[SirAndy]

sooooo, why (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif) are they still in business? not the first time i hear this!!

There's a sucker born every minute. Their Panorama Ads look nice.

And not everybody is spending most of their day on the Interwebs reading Porsche related forums ...
(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) Andy

[9146racing]

just shows how important these forums are, (IMG:style_emoticons/default/aktion035.gif)