F-You Colorado! more emission headaches, I may loose my registration Options

[MBowman325]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) That about got me fired here, but then again, I work for a certain state agency.

(Texas tags on vehicles in OK - officially I was still under the 60 day limit, but was told it didn't matter for me.)

[r_towle]

advancing timing makes the car run lean.
Ice shield is pure alcohol...4-5 bottles in very little fuel makes it close to pure alcohol.

E85 has alot of additives.
Brew your own.

Rich

"Lean"? I doubt it. What it does is make the HC readings go through the roof. BAD idea. It also increases the CH temps dramatically, so NOX readings go up, too.

The answers? First, get a pretest to determine what you have and what you have to correct. Then do the following:
In a near empty tank, add 1/2 tank of low octane fuel
Set the valves to .016"
Set the timing to precisely where it's supposed to be, or maybe a degree or 2 retarded (after making sure the retard function of the vacuum can works properly)
Set the idle speed to 1000 RPM

Get another pretest and report back to us for further advice.

The Cap'n

Without being an ass....please explain.
Just the timing piece...I got the rest (though I dont agree with the fuel mix...)

Seriously...why would it run lean retarded?

Rich

[SUNAB914]

You'll can keep that stuff. Here in NC if your car is 35 years or older it doesn't even require a safety inspection. Heck, SC doesn't have it at all last I heard. Send your cars east once their not legal anymore. Man, that is rough. I guess I'll get busted one day for removing my 928 cats..
good luck, pretty soon all our cars will be going to the scrapper. Good gosh.

[Shade Tree]

Is this a show car? If not, why not put on older vin plates? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/stirthepot.gif) Isn't a '74 and older exempt? In Oregon, there are only certain counties that have these laws. You can register your car in a different county and get away with it. You just need a trusted friend/relative to let you use their address.

[banger]

Does the "No Nothing!" include jobs as well? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

Move to Michigan:
Lots of water for fishing.
No sun to crack your dash or fade your paint.
You only need to have the car out from May through October.
No front license plates.
No requirements for emissions, no sniffers, no inspections, no nothing!

Paul

[DBCooper]

It would seem that Cap & Trade has caught up with you. Buy some green credits and go on your way..... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/barf.gif)

What on earth are you talking about? Cap and Trade is still being debated.... oh, I get it, that's a POLITICAL comment so it doesn't HAVE to make sense. Nevermind.

Anyone want a super solid(rust wise) 914. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

Yes. How much?

[A&PGirl]

I don't think this has been said yet, but don't mess with your emissions on the car until you call the guys up and explain to them that your car is exempt from this nonsense.

They'll probably give you some cock 'n' bull story about how it doesn't matter, etc. Give them a second call a day or two later and talk to someone else. If it still comes out to be, "well because we say so" inform them that "your sorry it had to come to this because (fill in with conversion details)" and hang up. Go get a lawyer and explain to them exactly what has transpired and inquire what would it take to get this mess caused by some lowly bureaucrat cleaned up in your favor. Heck, it might just be a simple letter typed on a lawyers letterhead that makes it go away.

It's not your fault, it's some departments fault in the government.

You don't have to put up with this attempt because your CAR IS OLD (and exempt)!

My $.02

[Zundfolge]

I'm glad that down here in El Paso county we're not in the stupid AIR program anymore ... however if it comes back I'll have to just sell the Porsche, no way I'm getting it to pass easily or cheaply.

I've already decided that if my fellow Coloradoans are stupid enough to re-elect Ritter, I'm leaving ... you can enjoy your Californicated Colorado without me.


I'd start out trying A&PGirl's idea first.

Disclaimer: i donno nothin' 'bout Colorado...

But most collector plate requirements I am aware of exempt you from INSPECTIONS - not requirements, which are a Federal matter and do not change.

Nothing "federal" about any of this. The Federal government only sets standards for the manufacturers ... this is all Colorado nonsense.

[Elliot Cannon]

If I thought these laws really did any good I would feel different about them BUT there a so few older cars on the road now, passing more draconian emissions laws only serves to make politicians look good.

Cheers, Elliot

[ghuff]

You really need to fight this. More than likely it is some private company being contracted to do this for the state, and they will say you have to pay it because they probably get a cut.

Like red light cameras, follow the money.

More than likely, you will find you are in the right and you just have to waste your time to fight it.

[Mikey914]

This is BS. You should be able to fight it. What is the accuracy of the system used, was the system properly callibrated, was the technicial certified to operatethe system?

Given all these questions, it was not a controlled environment, who's to say that a 1970 caddy wasn't blasting down the freeway and the winds picked up some if it's exhaust and blew it into the path of the laser and your car?

It is a freeway and your not the only car around.

Automated law enforcement you got to love it. What happend to the good old days when a offer of the law would ust pull you over and give you a ticket. I can respect that.

well, enough rambling, I would fight it.

[Zundfolge]

I gotta wonder about the accuracy of these things as well.

If this roadside truck is good enough, than why should we have to take half a day off work to take the car down to some Jiffy Lube where some high school dropout can put grease stains on the carpet when all we should have to do is whiz by one of these trucks at 60mph and get our reading instantly?


Another thought on this ... most of us here keep our 914s as toys. What if you relied on an old car to get to work every day?

More government elite pricks making life harder on the poor [insert various Jefferson and de Tocqueville quotes here]

[mharrison]

It would seem that Cap & Trade has caught up with you. Buy some green credits and go on your way..... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/barf.gif)

What on earth are you talking about? Cap and Trade is still being debated.... oh, I get it, that's a POLITICAL comment so it doesn't HAVE to make sense. Nevermind.

joke (noun)
1. Something said, written, or done to evoke laughter or amusement, especially an amusing story with a punch line.
2. An amusing or ludicrous incident or situation.

Your comment was pretty close though. Very little about politics (on either side of the aisle) does make sense!
++++++++++++

I agree with the comments on fighting this. I would work first to determine if I HAD to make changes to my car to pass this test.

[newto914s]

Anyone want a super solid(rust wise) 914. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)


Yes. How much?

I'd only consider selling it if it doesn't pass. I'd like $3k for it, it would come with all my spare parts(the state would effectively end my affair with 914s) and I'd even drive it to you in TX, for the cost of gas(it runs that good)

I have no intention of fighting this. I'd end up spending way more money on a lawyer than I would buying parts and I'd still end up loosing the case.

My appointment is set for the july 13th. I'm going to do the same thing I did the last time. Different MPS, some e-85, and a few degree retarded timing. If I fail, I get another free retest, I can get the car through the sniff test(i did it before). It's the guy looking for my smog pump and cat that will dam me.

the letter from the state read as such

FIRST NOTICE
IMPORTANT INFORMATION REGARDING: Make/Year/License/VIN
Dear Motorist,
A vehicle registered to you recently was identified as potentially high-polluting by roadside emissions testing
equipment. Roadside testing units located along Denver-metropolitan area roadways measure pollutants from vehicles
as they are driven. Pursuant to 5 CCR 1001-13, Part G, Section IV.A, a vehicle’s emissions as measured by roadside
testing units shall not exceed 3.0% carbon monoxide or 550 parts per million (ppm) hydrocarbons as hexane (1,075
ppm hydrocarbons as propane). The identified vehicle exceeded one or both of these limits within the past 30 days.
Documentation of these test results is enclosed with this notice.
DO NOT DISREGARD THIS LETTER - it is legal notification of your responsibilities under Colorado Law.
Failure to comply with these instructions WILL result in suspension of this vehicle’s registration and a $100
fine, pursuant to 5 CCR 1001-13, Part G, Section VIII.A; and 1 CCR 204-11, Rule X, Section 1001.0((IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)(1).
This letter is to inform you that you MUST contact the Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment to
schedule a free emissions compliance inspection. If you fail to do so within 30 days of the date listed above, the
vehicle’s registration will be suspended and you will be subject to a monetary fine pursuant to 5 CCR 1001-13, Part
G, Section VIII.A; and 1 CCR 204-11, Rule X, Section 1001.0((IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)(1).
Call 303-692-xxxx immediately to schedule an appointment for a free compliance inspection. Do not take this vehicle
to an Air Care Colorado station. This vehicle must be inspected by state of Colorado personnel.
If you no longer own the identified vehicle, you still must contact the state of Colorado at 303-692-xxxx to provide
information on this vehicle’s status. This is a mandatory program. If you do not comply with the requirements of
the program, you will be subject to penalties.
Compliance is simple – just follow these steps:
1) CALL: State Hotline at 303-692-xxxx. We will help you set up an appointment.
2) TEST: Receive a FREE inspection at a state Emissions Technical Center.
3) REPAIR: If repairs are needed, you may be eligible for financial assistance.
4) PASS: RECEIVE and PASS a FREE final emissions compliance inspection.
Call now to schedule a free compliance inspection. To learn more about the program and the technology used to
identify this vehicle, go to http://www.cdphe.state.co.us/ap/highpolluter.html .

[Scott S]

Hmm.... I think I need to find out what Ritter's wifes license plate number is, order a replica on line, and then go search out those road side emissions testing stations in my neigbors early 70's station wagon - that is running a 950 CFM carb, headers and smokes "just a little" .....

[Gint]

Here's a thought...

Why not call the number and explain that the car is a 1976 model year vehicle with collector plates? That may end the situation. Especially given the fact that I'm pretty sure the limits listed in that letter are *more* restrictive than the limits for a 1988 Jeep Cherokee, let alone a 1976 model year vehicle.

[jhadler]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) with Gint.

It would seem to me that someone didn't notice that the car was running collector tags. There is NO specification for the 914 under load at rpm. So there is NO way to confirm that the car isn't running as it was designed...

-Josh2

[Gint]

Although I just looked at the bottom of the pic and the numbers you're blowing are sky high. But it's worth a phone call.

[Scott S]

I just called - the year does not matter.
First of all, this is a state program, with state employees (no subcontractors). The inspection guys that will be looking at your car are master techs. The guy I spoke to was a Lotus and flat head V8 specialist. The guy who does the air cooled stuff has supposably been a PCA guy "forever" - he even asked me if this conversation came up while we were at the Parade. The limits set are passable by any correctly running car - at any RPM - from any era as far back as you can go. What they are doing is trying to keep us from doing what alot of us do - get the classic plate and then modify the motor into what they deem a gross polluter. If anyone falls outside of these limits, they must go get an inspection. If anything has been modified from stock - including the removal of airpumps and cats, we could be screwed. I asked him how he was sure that these inspectors know what they are looking at. He said they "we are not the minimum wage employees that work for the usual emissions testing stations". I did forget to ask about unobtainable/obsolete parts (like the airpumps). He was nice enough - but it was like talking to a cop.
Gints philosophy is what I will be adopting - turn around and go the other way. I am running a euro rear plate with my real one in the rear window. I may just pull it down if I ever get trapped.
I did ask him when they were going to start putting these testing stations at the entrances of car shows, that way they could both kill the hobby and make a pile of money all at once. He didn't find it funny.

One last thing, these machines are taking readings in a way that if you have a lawn mower or a gas can in the bed of a truck, or if your missing your gas cap (or even have a poorly sealing one) you will most likely get that letter. He said he has seen that on several occasions - but you will still need to get the inspection.

[ghuff]

I just called - the year does not matter.
First of all, this is a state program, with state employees (no subcontractors). The inspection guys that will be looking at your car are master techs. The guy I spoke to was a Lotus and flat head V8 specialists. The guy who does the air cooled stuff has supposably been a PCA guy "forever" - he even asked me if this conversation came up while we were at the Parade. The limits set are passable by any correctly running car - at any RPM - from any era as far back as you can go. What they are doing is trying to keep us from doing what alot of us do - get the classic plate and then modify the motor into what they deem a gross polluter. If anyone falls outside of these limits, they must go get an inspection. If anything has been modified from stock - including the removal of airpumps and cats, we could be screwed. I asked him how he was sure that these inspectors know what they are looking at. He said they "we are not the minimum wage employees that work for the usual emissions testing stations). I did forget to ask about unobtainable/obsolete parts (like the airpumps). He was nice enough - but it was like talking to a cop.
Gints philosophy is what I will be adopting - turn around and go the other way. I am running a euro rear plate with my real one in the rear window. I may just pull it down if I ever get trapped.
I did ask him when they were going to start putting these testing stations at the entrances of car shows, that way they could both kill the hobby and make a pile of money all at once. He didn't find it funny.

One last thing, these machines are taking readings in a way that if you have a lown mower or a gas can in the bed of a truck, or if your missing you gas cap (or even have a poorly sealing one) you will most likely get that letter. He said he has seen that on several occasions - but you will still need to get the inspection.

The simple solution is to poison them all in their sleep.

(IMG:http://marissalouie.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/09/revolt.jpg)