lifter question, which ones? Options

[tat2dphreak]

I know there have been some advancements in lifters, and I didn't think I'd be shopping for them so soon. I don't want to go overkill on them, nor do I want to spend too much, so what lifters are good now?

engine will be a 2056, about 9.2-9.5 CR, 163 webcam. heads are ported, but I'm not sure on the size. 44x36 maybe, 10lb lightened flywheel. that's the plan on the napkin right now anyway.

[r_towle]

Lifters and camshafts are purchased together typically so you get the correct hardness.
Buy webcam lifters with the camshaft.

Rich

[gregrobbins]

Lifters and camshafts are purchased together typically so you get the correct hardness.
Buy webcam lifters with the camshaft.

Rich

What he said, buy them as a set.

[ME733]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif) I DISAGREE COMPLETELY..with the previous comments....Do you think the camgrinders, have lifters, camfollowers, made exclusively to THEIR SPECIFICATIONS.?.,and THEIR CAMCORES are manufactured just for them with a specific hardness?....camcores,and lifters are made by a VERY few companies., very few indeed....."the buy my cam and lifters as a set or else"(no warrenty) is just a way to increase their total dollar sale. typically eighter the cam or the lifters are OVER PRICED...(.some also insist you use their valve springs )..NOW if you do not build engines very often go ahead and get all the stuff you need at one source, It could be cost effective in you particular case. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

[tat2dphreak]

I thought ceramic lifters or other such lifters were deemed better regardless? I remember Jake and others mentioning lifter failure from using the "packaged" lifters? did they get better? I know some people have also treated the lifters in some way to ensure they do not fail...

[VaccaRabite]

I thought ceramic lifters or other such lifters were deemed better regardless? I remember Jake and others mentioning lifter failure from using the "packaged" lifters? did they get better? I know some people have also treated the lifters in some way to ensure they do not fail...

If you can get Ceramic, use them. But I think that they are unobtanium these days, unless you find them used.

Zach

[tat2dphreak]

I thought ceramic lifters or other such lifters were deemed better regardless? I remember Jake and others mentioning lifter failure from using the "packaged" lifters? did they get better? I know some people have also treated the lifters in some way to ensure they do not fail...

If you can get Ceramic, use them. But I think that they are unobtanium these days, unless you find them used.

Zach

figures (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) like I said I've been out of the loop... last time I was looking at engine components, ceramic was new and shiny...

[Jake Raby]

Ceramic lifters now sell for 1-1.5K/set... Thank god I held on to 4 sets as we now use them as tools for work hardening cams in our turnkey engines.

Cam and lifters don't just need to be matched by hardness, in fact hardness is just one of the 3 characteristics that make for a successful lifter/ cam combination.

Do some searches dating back to 2004 when we were doing the evaluations of our lifter and cam packages after the industry went through a period of huge engines losses due to cams and lifters failing. One of my competitors lost 30 engines, while I only lost three because of these evaluations.

What you'll find is my results found in direct comparisons in a lifter/ camshaft testing device that we built (spintron) that the dimensions of lobe taper and lifter crown radius were critical to the compatibility of the components over EXTENDED durations of time.
(IMG:http://www.aircooledtechnology.com/galleries/Lifter%20Testing/spintron/mid_size/DSCN1292.JPG)

Many people were experiencing what they thought was normal operation, until lifters were pulled periodically only to find extreme accelerated wear that was not just measurable, but also visual.
(IMG:http://www.aircooledtechnology.com/galleries/Lifter%20Testing/single_hd/small_size/DSCN1709.JPG)

When the details of lifter radius, cam lobe taper and hardness were all addressed the issues were eliminated. In the past 4.5 years we have sold hundreds of cams (400 of just one grind!) and have had ONE arrangement fail, which occurred in one of our turn key engines, on the dyno.

More at this link on my R&D pages.
http://www.aircooledtechnology.com/lifters.htm#Spintron

There are 3 manufacturers of cam blanks for these engines. One of them is the industry standard for those who want quality, the other two are made in India and are total junk with porosity cast into them. Just because most good cams are ground on the better CWC (engine power) cam blanks doesn't mean that all cams are created equally.

Web Cam grinds the majority of my cams, but that doesn't mean that you can buy that same cam from Web, because of the alterations that I have made to these grinds to work best with my combinations of components. I also do not sell my lifters to anyone else, because they would not be compatible with other cams... I won't even sell them to Web, because NO ONE assisted me with my 18 month evaluation of cams and lifters, so I keep the tricks under my belt- its only fair.

What matters most is:
-You end up with a cam grind that is complimentary for your engine combination.
- All other valvetrain components are matched to this cam to include pushrods, rocker arms, rocker spacers, valve adjusters, springs and valves
-The camshaft and lifters are properly configured both materials wise and specification wise.

Before I only offered my cams as 100% complete camshaft kits we had all sorts of issues with compliance when people would buy parts from 7 sources and expect them to be effective....

Its more than just altering lifters or cams, doing so means you add even more variables that could cause a failure. It took my team 18 months and 20,000 bucks to work through these issues.. A portion of that was donated by members of forums- Thanks Guys.

And now for the ultimate answer.... Something that took me 5 years to perfect and will be included in all 2010 MassIVe engines.
ROLLER-Z