I was reading Excellence magazine the other day with the 914 value chart and they value our cars at from 12K to 18K. Why do we sale our cars so cheap and place such low value on them when Excellence themselves think our cars are worth more. The value and price of these cars would rise to the level they should be if everyone stuck to their guns and when selling a 914. When I insured mine it was for an agreed value which I put at 12K, I had to provide pictures and when I submitted evrything the insurance company had no problem with the value I put on the car. I think just as much of my Porsche 914 as a 911 owner and I believe that is how most of us feel. Apologies for the long rant but I see guys on here asking what they should ask for their cars when they sale them and all I here is 4K to 6K and ocasionally I see someone asking what the true value should be.

because that is what the market sets the price at. Excellence can claim they are worth $50k all day...doesn't make a difference if no one will pay that much.

You want to hold out for better prices? Form sort of a 914 cartel? I began my career in commodities markets, where as they say: Bulls make money, Bears make money, Pigs get butchered.

Look, markets are markets, buyers meeting sellers. Nobody here is so stupid that they give their cars away for a fraction of their value, and to infer that is insulting. If you don't see cars being sold for $12-18K it's for a Real Simple Reason: They aren't worth that.

such articles are great when we need to make an insurance claim!

Wow didn't mean to pop your cork, I just see other Porsches holding great value and was wondering why the 914 hasn't received it's due respect.

The other thing that brings the value down is the varying condition of our cars.

You see people doing stupid things to their cars, some people restore them perfectly. You also see people giving away good rollers in CA and people buying rust-buckets in the NE.

I'm sure that smg914 would not sell his Sahara Beige 914 for less than $50,000 or his M-471 for less than $150,000, but that doesn't define the value of everyone else's cars.

Sooner or later we will reach the point of 356's, when we will get real value for our cars.

Also some people think our cars are Ugly as Shit, while I happen to LOVE the styling ( I guess that is why I have owned so many)

T.C.

Cork's not popped... I save that for special occasions.

Market worth is perception, and perceptions of the 914 in the broader market may be affected by that "Volkswagenwerke AG" sticker on the door. Or the looks, it's true. But perception isn't VALUE. Any transaction has two sides. Your complaint is that the cars aren't worth that much when you go to sell them. Fine. That means they also aren't that expensive when you go to BUY them either, are they? So a great value.

But investments are boring, and why would you buy a sports car to be boring? So if you forget the investment part and instead talk about the fun quotient is there any better value around? Buying and selling with heaps of Cheap Thrills in between!! How can you beat that?

Unless you sell the parts not many people make money on old cars, or many other hobbies. If you want investments try the stock market, a much better bet.

I'll sell my 914 for 12K no problem. I can buy two more in better shape ! I wouldn't pay 12K for mine though. It's all dependent on the actual car IMO. Seen some real perfect LE's, might pay 12K for that.

Before the market and banking crash, they were bringing in high dollars. They seemed to of suffered at least a 30% hit. I seen several low milage original cars in very nice condition go between 8-9K this past summer. Early and later model cars. You would really need a collector level car like Steve's, to bring in the higher dollars at this point. Might take some time for the value to go back to where it was. Hopefully it will.

I think your right, one day, 914's and especially 914-6's will be worth quite a bit more. But, look at the holding cost of a car used as an investment. Storage, insurance, maintenance, registration, replacement of rubber seals and tires, engine, transmission and brake caliper overhaul when seals and gaskets shrink, your time, RUST, ect. I’m not sure many people actually “make” money even when they sell a car for multiples of the purchase price 10, 20, 30 years later. I think it’s much like real estate, that is, you make your money on the deal when you buy, not on the appreciation before the sale. Appreciation just keeps you even with everything else.

Sir, I have been on this site as long as you and would never say anything to intentionally offend anyone. If I did I apoligize but I believe you provided your opinion as I and I do believe thats how the world goes around.

I think your right about the appreciation. If it was 18k for a 4 I'd just be appreciating the car when it was in someone elses garage.

For what it's worth, I'm one of those that does not find the 914 styling to be aesthetically beautiful, if one considers simply the visual aspect of the car. When one considers the engineering and performance capabilities of the 914, it becomes not just beautiful, but iconoclastic. I think that has a lot to do with its varying value, along with what others have said in here already.

I doubt that I will ever see a monetary return on the investment I plan to put into the car, but that's not my goal. My goal is to drive the scheisse out of her and have enough fun to justify the expense of dropping in a /6 and repainting and doing the interior ... yes, I have some aesthetic dreams for her, but bottom line is she's going to be that really cute (but not a knockout model) girl next door that you love to be with all the time, and that gets you into trouble ... and you still love her.

Heh, why is it all car analogies inevitably involve women? (That's rhetorical by the way)

- Nelson

Jmill, now that was funny. I don't know how this became what it did but it was not intentional. I was just setting at my computer and the thought popped in my head and I started typing. The last 914 was made in 1976 and they will never make them again just like a 550 a 356 will never be made again even an old bug in nice condition is going for 10-12K I just thoiught our cars deserved the sameand I didn't mean any disrespect to anyone by just a passing thought.

I know 914-6s have taken a hit in value in the last couple of years. As late as 2007, 914-6s were selling high 20s to over 40. Today the low end aren't selling because the owners don't want to take a bath and the the cars that were selling for $40k are mid to high $20k cars. I really don't keep up with the 914-4 pricing even though I do take a peek in the classifieds every once in a while.

You should not look at cars as investments ( heck I Instructed a guy at a DE a couple of months ago, who lost $20k on a 2008 Boxster when he traded it in on a 2009 Boxster (( he had to have a PDK))). But as the original poster asked, I would like to see the values higher. One thing that does not help is when people on this and other Forums rip other owners cars.

In the meantime, work on your cars this Winter, get them off their jackstands in the Spring and drive em like you stole em

T.C.

Yup - I agree with you that it is all about the purchase price and how it relates to the cars value in todays market. Speculation on where a cars value may end up in 10 years is a total crap shoot and not worth the headache. There are some spectaular deals out there right now due to the the bad economy combined with some that have speculated on a cars future value and shoved a pile of money into restoring/over restoring a car - only to find they now need whatever money they can get back out of the car right now.

The storage/insurance/maintenance etc can all be made significantly less if spread accross mutiple investment cars. Registration is not really an issue (at least in Colorado) as it drastically goes down over time. I think by far the biggest issue with investment cars is getting them to pass whatever emission regulation happens to be in place at the time you go to sell them.

I have been watching lots of Porsches over the past 2-3 years. They are not good investment cars (no margins). That makes me think that most p-car owners are a bit smarter/conservative about how they put money into them. Putting a 10k paint job on a 911 Turbo (or 914) is done more so out of ones passion for the car that they plan to keep, vs just to flip the thing. A really nice aircooled $25K 911 seems to have been a really nice 25K 911 for several years - and they buyer would be in dire straits to even listen to an offer of much less.

I love discussions on value. It’s similar to the back and forth of carbs vs. FI, or “should I keep the /4 or put in a /6?”.

Here’s my biased .02

The design is stunning. The proportions are beautiful. Plus the driving experience exceeds the car’s looks. It’s an amazing package. Eventually the design will come back in vogue and appeal to a broader audience. Right now, we’re ahead of the curve. We love the car. Once the appeal begins to come around, more people are going to want one. That’s demand.

As long as people continue to give away rollers and/or sell cars for chump change, and we continue to part out cars for the crusher, value won’t rise. That is until, there’s no more to give away, no more hulks for the crusher, no more parts cars. The supply becomes tighter as demand goes up.

Then when a beater 914 costs $10K all of us will say “I remember when…”. Right now it’s fun. Sure, it costs real money but a basket case won’t cost me $20K like the 356 market. I drove a stock 356B recently. It was a nice, clean, well-made car, but my 914 could literally drive circles around it. Hold ‘em if you can. As long as we can get out of the ‘depression’ they should go up in value.

Amen Brother

I have never thought the prices listed in Excellence were even close to being correct. When I am reading the market value for the 924's and say a 78 in good condition should be worth $4800.00 something just isn't right. Market values should be based on what real cars are selling for. IMO

and KBB lists my 200k mile plymouth minivan as being worth $2500 LMAO

As much as we hate to admit it, 914s are just the red-headed step-children of Porsche. They will *never* be as valuable as 356s or their contemporary 911s. Their styling and heritage is questionable, at best, to the non-enthusiast... and it's those non-enthusiasts that drive car prices up with "impulse" purchases.

One thing to understand, is that as folks come into money, they buy cars they thought were cool when they were young. Barrett Jackson proves that out. BUT, eventually those people age, the demand actually goes down, the cars deteriorate. For instance; 356s were built 5-15 years before the 914, which means the people that lust after them are typically 5-15 years older than many of us. I won't ever own a 356 because they don't appeal to me, neither do Packards, DeSotos, etc.

And to the non-enthusiast, everyone I talk to about 914s, always tells me about their Uncle, Best-Friend, the guy that lived at the end of the block that used to own a 914. They may not be the Best looking car, but they are not the typical cookie-cutter car out there and people remember them.

Also I can see where a 914 could catch and pass a 1974-75 911.

T.C.

Yeah, I suspect that there are lots of people with closets full of those wide-lapel Armani suits from thirty yeas ago, too. Patiently waiting for their time. And you remember growing up, driving in the country and seeing that oddball with like six Edsels in his yard? Hope never dies.

I think the fundamental problem with the investment logic is thinking that the general public will eventually wake up and want these cars. Why? Where you see the big jumps in value are with the cars that the now rich pre-retirement and just retired guys lusted for but couldn't afford when they were young. Thirty years ago it was 30's and 40's classics. Last 15-20 years it was '50's hot rods. That group of guys is older and finished buying toys, so with the current group it's '60s muscle cars and 356's. This isn't news, you knew that already. So in that context there's a sad note: no one ever lusted for a 914 when they were young. You lusted for the 911, you could afford the 914. Or a few years later the 924. So now that I'm older with some disposable income I'm going to finally get that 914? Sorry, but I don't believe the 914 will ever have legs like the 356 and early 911's.

You know how much it costs to buy a thrill at Disneyland? Drive your car. The thrills come much cheaper and they're real and guaranteed. Driving it is the car's real value, so stick with reality. Don't think about investment values, those are just hopes and dreams.

Oh yeah, and carbs suck.


EDIT: TC, interesting overlap, you posted as I was writing. Yeah, lots of folks remember someone who owned a 914, but they all lusted after a 356 or 911 themselves. Big difference. I doubt the 914 will ever catch the 911, but I suppose we'll eventually find out.

One 914 that I think is REALLY under valued is the Limited Edition cars. The total made is not really known. One thing certain is that a little over 200 are left. They are rarer than the 914-6 yet they are not in the price range they should be.

NADA is finally headed in the right direction.

NADA value 73 2.0

You know I looked at NADA value for the 914 a couple of weeks ago after our annual assesment with our insurance agent. I was pretty surprised when I found out the value placed on them currently by NADA.

I bought my 914 to drive it, not as an investment. But I will say this: I think that a number of factors are going to continue to drive up the value of these cars.

For one, I think there will be an entry-level Porsche roadster announced soon. Maybe it'll even be called 914. That will drum up renewed interest in the original, and interest inevitably creates buyers.

Even something like the Matchbox 914 helps create interest in the model.

Plus, the green crowd has found the 914 to be a good candidate for EV conversions. That helps values too.

We're barely out of a recession, technically speaking - and for many, it feels like we're still in one. Spending on luxuries like a fun car will recover as the economy does.

(Contrary to what I just said... I justified the purchase of my 914 last fall, in part, because I figured it will hold value as well or better than my 401K of late!)

Bah! I think stuff like the NADA and collectors' marketing is the reason some previous owner took the 1.7 DJet out of my 73 and dropped in a 2.0 bus motor with major life sustaining issues, even after putting on a new carburetor (sacrilege to some, yes I know).

Hey, I know it's my own fault for not taking Howard up on a PBI (or anyone else out there in the Thousand Oaks area) and becoming blinded by the e*bay light, and I *do* have a great car with no rust that I only drove for a few months before ol' bus motor died ... but I still think one of the evils of car collecting is the destruction of a perfectly good car in an attempt to make it more valuable, even if real collectors are rarely fooled by this and more often the opposite occurs (a beautiful car is restored, but hardly ever driven). Only second to that is the destruction of a perfectly good car in the name of performance that falls on its face due to ignorance or arrogance, but at least those ignorance instances can be corrected with practice. Or using someone who knows what they're doing, heh.

- Nelson

NADA says $12600 is low retail for a daily driver? That's just plain loopy. So I agree, Bah Hunbug (pun intended). I just used a Craigslist search program to search the entire U.S., and didn't find one four banger getting to $10,000. A hundred 914's for sale, not one with an asking price exceeding $10,000. Five sixes, no surprise, but not one four. There is one on e-Bay right now that's over $10,000 with one bid. Poor sucker probably consulted NADA and thinks it's a bargain. It is a nice car, though.

While for my own selfish reasons I appreciate having those high values for insurance valuations, I hate to think about those poor folks who will consult NADA and get all excited to think that slightly rusty $10,000 barn find is a real screaming deal. That's just plain wrong.
.

I just last week put insurance on my new to me 74 1.8 and asked my agent what the value of a total loss would be. she said the adjusters right now would simply go from NADA values. I looked it up and was surprised to see the #'s so high. 8-10k for a74 1.8. the car I just bought is a very nice signal orange bone stock car that I just paid $2700 for. In the same conversation I asked about coverage on my 65 356 C coupe. same deal. nada says 51-68k for a car that realistically would sell for maybe 35k. cost to have the same coverage on each car? the same.
Randy

Randy,
I want the name of your insurance co.
John

Another thing is that 914's don't make very good daily drivers for most people. 2 seats, finicky, tiring to drive distance, won't fit a family, no a/c and melt when they get wet. Most 914 owners I know have a dd other than the 'teener. My wife's Honda minivan with 115,000 miles on it would sell for more than the average 'teener. Why? Because of the demand. I could sell it in a week end. The buyers are there. Many of the other model Porsches are driven by Doctors, Lawyers, ect. every day. How many of us would keep the 914 if it was our only car. I used mine as a dd for years but now couldn't make it work if it was my only car.

Farmers Insurance. If I could buy a 914 and total one every few weeks I could retire.
Randy

I know there are many like me that have feet in other worlds. There are quite a few 911 owners that are picking up 914's and are putting serious money in them to get them right, in their minds. Most are not restorations, but more towards the " Outlaw" or "R" type builds. They know the 914 is one of the best handling Porsches made and with the right mods, they are a very exciting car. They don't show up too much at the vintage car races now but at Porsche events, they are pretty much king of the autocross. I have noticed over the years that cars go through a wave, where their values will increase during the time of their demographics popularity. Only the truly unique cars in pristine condition will get the big dollars in the long haul. The 356 guys are just about at the end of their wave, ie. guys that remember when the were new and were hot at the races. When the 356's were 10 to 12 years old you could buy the average car for $1500 to $2000 bucks. I sold my perfect '73 2.0 appearance group car with factory sway bars and fog lights for $3000 in 1989. That was the low point of our wave, 13 years after new. Heck, most of the young people that see my car, don't even know what it is, but I get a thumbs up. Al.

Funny...I've always been an "R" type and outlaw kinda guy. Been into 914s for over 30 years. My last four rebuilds have been Concour Weenie types.

Now MY 911 hasn't been stock since the day I bought it....

2 Excellent points Al.

In 88-94, 914s were Really Cheap