On a 911 the ring needs to stay, the dust seal goes inside the hub and seals up to the ring. The inner wheel bearing sits inside the hub and slides on to the stub axle.

There is a very thin plastic washer under the collar as well that confuses people when looking at the diagram.

Any chance the stub lock nut is the same on the 3.5" struts as the 3"? I have 3" now and will be upgrading them shortly, and I already have fresh bearings. Just trying to figure out what I need to buy.

Spindle nut?

They have changed over the years. They could be the same, try them.

The spindle nut on a 914/4 is threaded different than its 911/914/6 counterpart.

The 16mm spindle nuts are NLA, for 911 struts to '73.

The available 18mm spindle nuts fit later '74 to '89 911 struts.

Yup. 914 spindles are smaller all around. Smaller inner and outer bearings etc.

911 had the 16mm early and the 18mm later. Now re-reading Doug's post, it sounds like he meant stock 914, to which Clay is correct. Sorry, I thought you were talking about the 3" and 3.5" 911 spindles.

FYI... a few years ago I did some digging with a local bearing seller. We found two tapered roller bearings with the proper OD for a 911 hub, and the proper ID for a 914/4 spindle. We also found the proper seal.

I was going to buy a couple dozen sets and offer them for sale on world for easy 5 lug conversions. Just bolt on the rotor and an 3" M caliper.

When I went back a few months later, the manufacture had discontinued the inner bearing.

The kit was only about 60 bucks for both sides.

No, you were right Eric.

I have 911 "A" struts and M calipers on there now. I'm going home now to wrench for the rest of the day and I'll see what I've got. Either way, I can order new spindle nuts and make sure that I have the right thing.

As soon as I get the car stripped and off to the sandblaster, I'll start working on the suspension in earnest. I've got time to see what I need to order to make sure it's done right.

On the subject of front wheel bearings, can someone confirm that these are the WRONG bearings for 911SC struts? The came with the car. I have no clue what they go to.

That would be hard to do.

3.5" struts 3" calipers.

I was able to get "The Google" working on my computer. Those are the correct inner (larger) and outer (smaller) bearings.

I have 3" on there now, and will be putting 3.5" on. So I think these bearings are for the 3", and not the 3.5" that I have. Right?

I couldn't find these bearings listed on any of the parts websites we all use. When I pulled the hubs off of the 3" struts, they slit right off. I couldn't get these bearings on the 3".

If anyone can follow all of that...I'll be impressed!

The spindles themselves are all the same on the 911's. Just the threaded end changes so those are good for either.

Totally untrue. The 911 and 914 spindle diameters where the bearings ride are IDENTICAL in diameter.


There are no special bearings. To put 911 hubs on a 914, you need the 911 bearings, seals and possibly the inner collar that the seal rides on. I've had two sets of 914 struts with 911 hubs and just confirmed that the bearings are an exact fit between 914 and 911 spindles.

So, all you need to convert a four lug 914 strut to 5 lug is a 911 hub with bearings that fit the 914 spindle?

Seriously? Read my post above again. The answer is in RED.

Seriously? Then the classic thread needs to be revised to inform potential converters to this option. Instead of everyone replacing their entire front suspension with a 911 one?

Exactly. This "classic" thread was wrong from the start. Eric will need to update the first post of this thread. If I were an admin, I would have done it by now.

What is this? Amateur hour?

Ummm put'th thy crack'th pipe down'th.

It "was" an otherwise "accurate" "classic" thread.

Smallish 914 inner bearing measurement:


Not as smallish 911 inner bearing race measurement:

Good luck with that.

Perhaps a video will help. 911 inner wheel bearing on a 914 spindle:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Xu_7J58IEU

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bufTna0WArc

There you go dealing in facts again!

Well the jury is still out

First off : Mrs. Hea didn't measure the inside of the 914 race. He measured the midside diameter of the bearing, ( see pic for poof ) but then the inside of the 911 race. suspicious ? yes !

Second : Mrs. Hea did not post his " factual " findings in red, therefore it is still unfounded and more research needs to be done. I'll patiently await some REAL results from Woody or Jake

Poorly

Measured

Bearings




But hey! feel free to delete any of my posts to return this thread to classic status. Your "how to" threads are a blessing!

I would not have posted my findings without verification first.

I took the inner and outer bearings off the 914 model numbered strut/spindle and transferred them directly to the late 911 strut/spindle and they fit exactly with no play. Did 914/6 struts have a 914 part number to them? If so then that explains what I have. The car is not an original 6.

A few wraps of duct tape will take care of the mismatched diameters. Or grease. Just pack the gap with grease. Problem solved.

Dearest Mudslinger, measurements are from the same sections. The 914 bearing is so much smaller the calipers are resting on the "box" (not the bearing like the 911 bearing) skewing the view. If it were as yee suspected, that 914 bearing would be even smaller.

Back to yer paint huffing.

Hey, this used to be a useful thread

914-6 struts are the same as 911T struts yet have a 914.341.xxx.xx part number.

You should have verified what an actual 914 strut looks like as well. They are quite different.

Love the comments though, caps, quotation marks, red text and all.

So wait...now I am confused. Is this thread incorrect from the get-go as stated in post 67 or was it right all along? And should have I put this in RED?

The actual 914/6 strut part number would be great information to have in this "Classic" thread under option 2. It is not listed on PET. While they look like 911T struts, they aren't.


I did and apparently only have 914/6 strut housings in my stash. I also used your thread for verification which was missing the information above.


I love the childish behavior on your part. Keep up the good work.

Sorry my bad

Speaking of classic...you post this without even so much as a polite question to the OP as to the accuracy of the thread. It turns out he was dead on and don't even offer an apology? Then you complain about the way he treats you. That is awesome.

oh and speaking of childish. Unfounded accusations, and demands of correction, based on ones assumptions would classify as childish ( or egotistic ) in my book any day


Exactly. This "classic" thread was wrong from the start. Eric will need to update the first post of this thread. If I were an admin, I would have done it by now.

pretty brash statement for someone in the wrong eh ?

914 341 091 00 and 914 341 092 00 are the numbers on the struts I'll be using. They came off a 911T but that is the 914/6 part number.

One question I know these take the early balljoints (which I have), but does it it use a special bolt?
Kind of looks like an ordinary bolt to me....

No your absolutely right, my apologies to Eric.

What are the chances that the all of struts I own are 914/6 when I don't own a real 6? Adding the 914/6 strut housing part numbers to the beginning of the thread would be a helpful addition to this classic thread.

No worries Tom. Thanks.

I'll grab the part number that Mark posted and include them.

Just a thought - could you not have a custom race made that would fit the larger diameter of the 911 with an inner diameter that would match the bearing portion of the 914 bearing (and thus match up with std 914 struts)?

Not sure this would be cheaper than the 911T strut option, but if made in quantity...

Clay was looking for such a bearing and, with so many bearing options, you would think it already exists. That's what he mentioned on the previous page... it doesn't seem to exist. The solution there would be to have a machinist spin up the "outer" race so it would fit the 911 hub with a 914 bearing in it. Then it has to be hardened. Costs are now mounting in the face of a proper strut.

Then you would have to deal with caliper and rotor offsets. The "early" 914 struts would probably be your only option but, it probably would line up properly for a vented rotor (which is the main advantage of a -6 over a -4 in terms of front braking). Add up machining adapters etc. and again... I believe we're back to the proper strut being a less expensive and less "kludged" option.

Eric, my next race car will be a historic 4 which will stay 4 lug. It will have more than 140 hp, so what is the best option for the CV's? I suspect it might be drill the dowell pin holes and use extra bolts, or will they just detonate the same.

Cheers,

This is my favorite system:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=91963

Not only do you get the largest CV's available, you get the real benefit of the free floating axles which allow the CV's to find their natural torque band and no adapters.

Wow great read, thanks for putting this together!

I have a older GT clone that came to me with a few issues. Car is rust free (pretty much), and was a race car/track car on the west coast, I am converting it back to a street car- I figured it easier to civilize a race car than fix rust.
One of the PO related problems is someone forgot to tighten the axle nut on one side which trashed the Hub's inner face.
What I have is Porsche P/N 901-331-605-06
I'm not sure what year 911 hub to look for.
Any help appreciated.
Thanks

Excellent info.
Thank you

Eric,

Great article and technical info...Really like the way you used the Pro and Con format, and took the time to explain these to the reader. As a relative new comer to the 914, your information is very valuable to me.

Thanks again

I did that Click to view attachment914-6 GT!

If this isn't already a "Classic" thread, it should be. Nicely done, Eric!

@Eric_Shea so adding to this informative & lively thread, I re-read it since Pete bumped it to the top & noticed that you left off "EARLY-early" front struts IE: -> 1968 available on 911/912's SWB as an option ?
Is that because they cant be used?

It's because the ball joints for such a strut are insanely expensive. They're also solid rotor only systems (for the most part) and overall, not a really worth while install.

Thanks for this wonderful topic about 5 lugs conversion. Very inspiring.

I have questions though, about rear axles in case of a 915 swap.

My 915 (from a 911 SC) comes with it's own flanges, and I happen to have 911 SC axles in stock, including their stub-axles.

Could I use these SC axles or shall I look for 911 65-73 axles and stub-axles ?

Could I use a 911 65-73 wheel hub with this setup ?

Thanks all for your help !

Now you need to read this thread -Easy 5-Lug Conversion - 911 Running Gear, For High Power Applications... - http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=91963
@ManuFromParis

* if you use SC or any later 5 lug hub centric hub, you need a 5mm spacer in between the hub and the bearing. Early, lug centric hubs do not require a spacer.

I did, but I wasn't sure to understand if the SC axles were usable instead of classic axles.
I read it again, but I'm still not sure.



No harm to the rotor position vs caliper ?
I'm leaving these stock.