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Full Version: Catastrophic starter damage from an Axle,
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wallys914
Today I lined up with a 350Z; I let the clutch go at 2K, good launch, and shake, shake, bang, grind, and grind. Axle adapter breaks, shears the starter from the Trans, and proceeds to lodge itself on the shift linkage, and leaving me with my pride back at the light, and my car stalled in the 3rd lane from the right on PCH, with no gears available... Considering that the power for the entire fuse box goes to the starter, and that it fell off,I am lucky I didnt fry any wiring and/or watch my car burst into flames.

Good day, Shot to post-2-1117899824.gif

Now looking at this I am learning a valuable lesson, that it is valuable to undo your CV and retightening the Axle adapter after 2k miles, and how can I make sure this never happens again...? I know someone thought of this, but has any one welded the adapter to the Trans axle snub? Just a thought....

BTW: I only make 216hp/ 276 ft-lb at the wheel...and am using the renegade hybrids axles... Not that it is their fault I did not do proper maintenance...but WTF!

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sww914
Don't drag race a Porsche. If you do this sort of thing will happen a lot. I promise.
wallys914
I thought I was gently enough, 2k with the clutch slippin. Didnt even chirp... unsure.gif

Like I said lesson learned... biggrin.gif
joefri187
QUOTE(wallys914 @ May 23 2010, 05:51 PM) *

I know someone thought of this, but has any one welded the adapter to the Trans axle snub? Just a thought....


The guy who made my adapters has a 914 drag car, and yes.... he welded on his adapters among other things to hold everything together.... welder.gif
budman5201
hmmm, thats wierd. I had a 252hp, 272 ft lb subaru motor in mine, and i put patches everywhere and didnt blow my stock axels. Although my torque comes on after your rolling quite a bit....

Guess i better be careful with my new one....
wallys914
Like I said, I hadn't gonE back to make sure the axle adapter's were tightened, I will be welding up the adapter's on the transmission side and the wheel side.
RJMII
Ouch! So do you have to get a new adaptor, or did it shear off at the bolts?
wallys914
2 of the 4 bolts for the adapter came loose (im guessing since there was no signs of the bolts being stripped out of the transaxle snub) 2 sheared off...

Luckily I have a 911 starter that I can use for the interim. Sucks though that was a 200$ starter....
Mike Bellis
When I bought my car in Irvine and drove it home to NorCal all 8 adapter bolts were loose when I got home. The only thing that held them on were the CV's. I have the exact same setup as you. Now I check them every couple of weeks.

I also suggest you dont rev to 2K and drop the clutch. You will catch him in a few yards.

Oh yah, racing is bad, n'k... It's really tough for us V8 guys to go slow...
computers4kids
It's better to give a guy a few yards off the start than to hand him your pride in a basket. Sorry about your mishap...it could have been much worse.

Number 1 rule: Never dump the clutch on a 901 with a V8, you may get away with it a handful of times and make some really cool burnouts, but eventually you'll destroy your transmission, tear a console ear etc. Not worth it. smash.gif

Also noticed you do not have your outer cv bolts wired with safety wire. Not sure what you can do to the RH adapter bolts, never had them.
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plymouth37
Same thing happened to me a week or two after I got my conversion running, just driving down the road minding my own business and bam! Thank god it was the outside adapter or I would have had a yard sale like yours. After a good re-torque they held fine but safety wire looks like good insurance.
Cap'n Krusty
That's a drag ............ Or maybe that's what you get when you drag. Whatever. Drag racing in the street is bad news; maybe you haven't heard that yet ................

Think of this as a sign from whatever higher authority you recognize that you should move it to the track.

Rant over. You're lucky it didn't rip the corner of your tranny off. We've seen that happen.

The Cap'n
GeorgeRud
I wonder if anyone has tried to make a "cage" to fit around the cv joint that would contain it in case of a failure. These are pretty standard on lots of cars to contain driveshafts, so it probably would not be a bad idea. It should be easy enough to fabricate one to fit on the passenger side, attaching to the differential bolts holes, but I can't think of a good attachment point on the driver's side. A starter bolt and rear transmission mount are the closest things I can come up with.
wallys914
I will start tear down tonight, I just am worried about what happened to the roll pins! I didnt even think about it until I started looking at threads on removing the rear hubs. I am sure they were not in the trans snub, maybe still in the adapter... Hopefully... unsure.gif

Thanks for all the tips, I honestly think this would have eventually broke, without me getting on it like I did, I'm glad it broke from a start rather than a 70mph roll... ohmy.gif
SirAndy
QUOTE(GeorgeRud @ May 24 2010, 07:20 AM) *

I wonder if anyone has tried to make a "cage" to fit around the cv joint that would contain it in case of a failure. These are pretty standard on lots of cars to contain driveshafts, so it probably would not be a bad idea. It should be easy enough to fabricate one to fit on the passenger side, attaching to the differential bolts holes, but I can't think of a good attachment point on the driver's side. A starter bolt and rear transmission mount are the closest things I can come up with.

Use longer CV bolts and attach the cage to the back of the output flange on the tranny using locknuts.

That way, if the CV comes lose on the tranny side, it'll just bounce around inside the cage.
It sould even hold long enough if you shear off the bolts and adapter as the flange itself is threaded.

idea.gif Andy
Mike Bellis
Drive shaft loops are $30-40 at Summit Racing. I think I'll try to use two and see what happens. I'll post a thread if it works.
wallys914
I got the trans out and checked everything, adapter roll pins are missing, looks like they cam loose along with 3 bolts that broke inside the trans axle snub. when the axle came undone, it struck the rear shift bar putting a dent and bending the end to a 45 degree angle, big hammer fixed that, the starter looks repairable. I am hoping IMI sells just the plate to bolt the start to the trans.

New brake pads on the way, some welding to do and it should be on the road by next weekend stronger than before.
Crazyhippy
QUOTE(wallys914 @ May 31 2010, 12:01 PM) *

I am hoping IMI sells just the plate to bolt the start to the trans.




If not, take the starter to them, and they can re-build it. They are in Whittier.

Need to be sure to check the outer adapters as well. I have always used red loctite on the adapter to stub bolts (since they are a PITA to check torque on after the car is running)
pcar916
Your 914 transmission mainshaft is in danger in drag mode too. 7/31 (4.43) R&P with a small ring... you got off cheap!

and... agree.gif wire the bolts.

Good luck.
underthetire
A guy at the Bug O Ramma on Sunday was on the starting gate for the 1/4 mile. Looks like he blew first gear off too. We were kinda excited to watch him, what a bummer.
wallys914
Thanks for the tip on IMI, I havent even had a chance to look them up.

I used Red locktite, on all the axle pieces, the car has had about almost 2000 hard miles. I admit I am not easy on my cars... I believe this was a mix of me abusing a bruised and beaten part, and it FAILED. So welding the adapters is my soultion for the time being.

As for the wiring of the bolts, I will wire the axle bolts, but for the adapter bolts (that failed) it cant be done the clearances are to tight between the axle and adapters. Has anyone else wired them?
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