I have the head off and noticed that one of the valve spring I can push down with my fingers. I order a new one and when I take the old one off I get a little surprise. There is a thinner, longer spring inside the larger spring. The larger spring has some kind of metal fastener on the inside. It seems all my spring have the same set up. I installed the new spring and need to know if this is OK. Also has anyone ever seen this two spring setup.

It is a set of dual springs, aftermarket T1 I believe. You will have to replace them as a set, although some places do sell them as singles.

Measure the boss on the valve guide, as it's cut down (99.9% sure of this), so I would replace it with another dual spring or the T4 spring will float around.

Also measure the OD of the outer spring and the ID of the inner.

Show me a pic of the head where the spring sits.

Looking at your pic again...does it have three springs????

Three springs (round inner/outer with a flat middle) are T1 race springs, they tend to break. Bug drag racers use them and their life span is measured in 1/4 mile passes.

Mark,
What is the advantages/disadvantages of:
Dual Spring setup
Heavy duty single spring setup
When do you even need to go to an alternate of the stock springs.
L. McChesney

Looking at it more closely, there are three springs, the center of the fatter spring is a flat spring. I allready replaced this spring with a regular T4 spring. I really dont want to have to pull all the others and remove the head from the other side and replce them, getting those locking pieces on are a pain in the ass. Will I have any problems with one T4 spring and these other T1. If so were would you get a replacement 3 piece spring?

Miss-matching springs is not a good plan.

Gene Berg, 1-714-998-7500, part # GB 269-1 for a single triple spring.

You should check these springs almost weekly...like I said these are racing springs. 180lbs at 1.5" and around 320-340lbs at 1"

The other springs are most likely pooched, I would replace them all with dual springs. They are around 125lbs at 1.5" and 225lbs at 1"
If one spring has gone flat what are the others like? "I" would have the other springs checked for poundage.



Valve float at high RPM's and dropped seats...this is a heated debate and there are two camps of thought on this one.
One side says more spring =less float is better for the seats. More spring does take more hp to run them.
The other side is less total valve train weight, less spring frees up hp.

I've been checking into this as I've used the dual on the T1's for years with great success. On the 2.0 heads with the T1 dual there will not be much meat left on the exhaust guide boss, once you cut for the duals. On the T1's use the duals on any hipo cam always.

In T1 land the rule of thumb is HD singles for up to 6000rpm, 7500 for duals and above that it's triple or chevy style springs.

If you are doing a hipo T4 I would use the HD T4 spring at least.

I would like to have the stock 1 spring set up, so I don't have to keep worrying and checking for broken springs. Would I have to replace anything else (valves or seats) to have the stock springs back on/ or can I just swap out the dual for the single? I think this sounds like a winter project though.

If your heads are cut for duals or triples I would replace with duals, unless you want to weld up your bosses and recut the spring seating surface.

Show me some pic's

Something is wrong with those springs if they don't have much life. Chevy runs a spring just like that with a flat damper as a production item.

Springs do not beat up valve seats. All springs do is keep the valve in contact with the camshaft. Closing and opening ramps determine how hard a valve hits the seat, unless you float the valves and then it doesn't matter what kinda of springs you have you will break the spring and valve. Yes going to lighter springs will free up quiet a bit of HP if you design the rest of the engine to take advantage of that.

My duals are running 150 on the seat and 375 on the nose @.500 lift and have over 17k on them with no problems. Sounds like the triples are having a friction, harmonic problem. If you don't have a major camshaft why bother with triple springs. GO with a true dual and be done with it.

Thats a lot of spring!

OK I give...what kind of duals do you have? are they type 1 or 4, Chevy type? what brand? OD/ID?

Mark I'm not sure the brand they came on the heads 4 years ago when MSHP did them. I will have to go over to the shop to measure them. I'll get back to you with that info. They are not chevy springs.

Mark, here are two pictures without the spring. The new original spring fits nicely in the round slot at the bottom, so I am guessing they haven't been cut. The middle spring fits into the new original spring, can't I just use the new spring with the old inner spring together? maybe replace all the old triples with this setup.

another view

Yep…they are cut for duals. Just get a new set of duals from a bug shop, ask for Bugpack, CB’s are most likely OK, and the best are the Gene Bergs. About $40-60.

The stock T4 OD is 1.315 and the T1 duals are 1.240 so not a big difference in size. Most likely your retainers are T1. The springs should actually rub together as this stops harmonics.
You should also get steel spring shims so the springs don't cut into the head.