Guys:
I want to be sure everyone understands my objective is to promote 914s so don't kill the messenger. I may be not be long term here but have owned a six since 1981....(and I'm only 39 ) but I see something on this site that bewilders me and I have also been guilty of it.
I just sold a 914 conversion and didn't do well although the car was nicely done.
While the market is not great due to the economy, I feel we are helping drive down our values and that does not seem right nor in our best interest. People here are selling cars for far less than you could build them but then coming on here and spilling their guts! I feel we are poisoning the well.
So many circumstances come into play that should not effect the value, but maybe we should suffer in silence. I know some may disagree but thats just my 2 cents.
Thanks
TOT

If you're talking about the cars for sale here among experienced 914 owners, you have to take into account that this market here is not reflective of the entire car buying market because people here really know these cars and are significantly pickier.

I'm thinking about putting my 914 up for sale, but I won't be putting it here because frankly none of the real 914 guys will give me what I want for it because they KNOW how much work goes into these cars and they're picker about the condition.

If I decide to sell it, I'd probably ask $3000 for the car on Craigslist when a true 914-o-phile probably wouldn't give me more than $1500 for it (if they'd buy it at all)



I just wish the value estimates Excellence magazine comes out with were even remotely related to reality

As we talked about in eMails the Market is soft for Conversions right now - guys that build them are not flush with Cash & the economy forces sales.

I do wish that our Classifieds Policy on Cars For Sale was like Pelican's where only the Seller can Post - it eliminates picking apart cars. I get a lot more response on Pelican than I do here.

CraigList is for Losers - I've got my Roller listed there and am going to pull the Ad. I get calls like; Does it have A/C, How does it run, is it a Real -6 - it's a Friggin 76 Roller

Throughout the car "hobby" it's pretty well known that you are ALWAYS better off buying someone else's project, as the price will nearly invariably be less than you it would be to replicate the result Usually much less. Facts of life.

The Cap'n

You owned a six when you were what??? Nine years old???

Well yes, Craigslist can be a PITA with lots of people pestering you with stupid questions (no, I will not take payments, no you can't test drive the car for a weekend, no I will not trade you for 3 X-Boxes and a faux Rolex) but it is about the best place to get the car in front of a large number of local buyers.

Well there was a lot of wisdom but the laughs were even more cathartic which is needed when you part with an old friend.

i 'd be fine if I would just quit finding "deals" (right TC) or drinking wine while surfing ebay !

Must have shifted like a dream..

I'm kidding... my Dad bought my car when I was 6.

With /6s going for $40M and going overseas. With clean /4s going for $10-12M and going overseas. I think the last value you can get with these cars are a Subi conversion or /6 conversion. Neither seem to be sought with foreign money (yet) and are each better drivers than the "originals" (IMHO).

The Cap'n is correct as usual. If you paid someone to build the car the builder will make the money. If you built the car yourself you'll never make back the labor. This market is specially soft. The last time the US market went tits up the Japanese and europeans were buying. This time their economys are mush too. If your buying and selling classic cars to make money you really need to look for the giveaways.

The value that you never loose is the good feeling and stories that you gain during ownership.

If you take a beater mustang and turn it into a clone Shelby, it will bring 25-30. I think we need to start raising the bar

sorry [expecting the flames to fly] but when these cars climb to the scale that the other cars types have gotten [muscle cars, tri fives, harleys] i'll ditch the teener and go buy some thighing that is affordable like i thought i was getting when i got my teener [i know! little did i know!] i'll go out and get an old rx 7 or a miata! parts are available and cheap!

At least it's not like an MG. Here is a photo of a completely rust free Oregon car for sale here for $ 5500. OBO. It is clean and tight in very way. I may buy it just to store and sell later. But for now that's all the money even in a good market.. Very sad.

Exactly!!! These cars are amazing fun and I think they look great too but part of that is the affordability.

rule #1, NEVER sell if you HAVE to.
rule #2, organize & advertise well. Hemmings ect...
rule #3, It only takes 1 buyer... don't rush. Your both better off in the end




Many American cars values have really fallen off in the last couple years, great buying deals out there. I think the 914 has never seen it's full potential, not sure why, maybe too many 914 sellers aren't sticking to rule 1,2&3.

Mike

I think thats a big part of all sales in this bad economy, in my business I'm a General Contrator, houses are selling for far less than you could build them. Until the economy turns around, things don't look good.

Pristine original cars will always sell better than conversions. So better restore the car than convert it.

People pay the big money for their high school dream cars. For the Americans that wanted European cars over American muscle in the 70s and 80s the were looking at the 911, not the 914. The 914 was the "I'll settle" car, and it still has a bad rep for much of the population.

Even at an AX where there were as many 914s as Miatas, the announcer still referred to them as rust tubs.

The 914 is a niche car. I agree the value still has more potential but you have to be able to hold the car for sale a while to maximize it's worth.

Almost every 914 on the east coast needs rust repair and then you are quickly upside down in cost vs. value

You are referring to original 6 vs conversion, right? I would agree.

Nice pristine original 2.0 4 cylinder isn't outselling a nice 3.2 conversion, at least not in the world I live in

Dion

The potential return on investment for the stock 4 is usually more the the ROI on the 3.2 conversion. You can sell the conversion for more but it costs a lot to do the conversion in the first place.

You do it cause you want to, not due to the dollar value when you sell it. If you are flipping the best you can do is get a decent stock car, clean it up and sell it.

Zach

Cry me a river. I bought my car to drive, not to sell, meaning I'm doing just fine. Also means my car will maintain every bit of its high (lotta fun) value no matter if the economy's good or bad.

Hobby cars are terrible investments, which shouldn't be news to anyone, so why on earth would you try to to see them that way? Like marrying a lesbian to enjoy the benefits of all those good things she might be some day. You're dreaming. For an investment go buy gold or something else equally boring.

I have a very nice original 74 2.0 that I'd like to sell someday and I've been watching what these cars have been selling for. It's really sad that few cars sell for more than $3000 no matter how nice they are. There just isn't a lot or demand for 914s and that keeps the value down. Guess I'll keep my cars and drive them into the ground then part them out!

If you have a nice original 2.0, its going to sell for a lot more then 3K.

$3500 easy.


Unless the car is in poor shape you should expect somewhere between 5K and 15K.

Zach

Part of my message was if your giving it away,,,,be like the like the girls in Jr. High used to be ....keep it to yourself ! You may have had a reason you need to sell now......but no sense in poisoning the market.

That's a different argument. ROI was never mentioned, but I would agree for the most part. I could probably break even on my 3.2 conversion, but I also did it over a number of years, not all at once.

I'm getting ready to sell my /6 conversion race car, fully knowing it will be worth more parted out. I think I could easily get $15K out of it in parts, but its worth more to me to see it driven for $10K. Now that I've said that, perhaps I should part it out....

That sentiment is often echoed in Keith Martins' "Sports Car Market" and "Hemmings Sports & Exotic". I think the operative phrase here is "sell better".
The OEM configuration will appeal to a broader audience that might remember, or have knowledge of, the vehicle when it was new, i.e. appearance, color, engine options, trim levels. The "conversion", the "resto-mod" or "personal interpretation" carries with it the individual builders' idea of what his ideal car would look like and be equipped as. That individuals' choice of what pleases him will limit his market as his selections will generally "improve" the appearance and performance in his opinion but will also typically drive up the eventual asking price to exclude the broader market.

Paul