I've had a lot of success racing 914-4's in PCA "K" and "J" Class but as soon as I purchased a 914-6 which put me in "I" Class, I immediately became a back marker. In fact, in the longer races on the high speed tracks, I eventually get lapped by the Class winning 944. Are any of you aware of a 914-6 being competitive in "I" Class. Part of the problem is that I mainly race at Road Atlanta and Sebring which are high speed tracks where horsepower has the advantage. The 944's out pull me by a few hundred yards down the long straights. With only 110 hp, I just can't keep up. And I ain't havin' any fun.

Go race in vintage with that car !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I've done some HSR but I can tell you that 110 hp in the 2 Liter and under class is not going to be competitive. HSR has turned into big bucks racing. Most of the people I know have $20,000 ++++ 2 Liter engines. That is why I've been doing the PCA racing thing. At least they have stock classes for stock cars. Unfortunately, I'm usually the only stock 914-6 in attendance.

If I remember correctly, Porsche did not go racing with the 110 HP engines, more like 180 to 200 HP I think? Sounds like it's time to beef things up some? Good luck

I ran in PCA class "I" for about 10 years with a prepared -4

Two friends of mine ran 914/6's and about 6 people I know ran -4's

Luckily colorado is more of a 914 group than a 944 group...

this way we always had people to play with.

but it is and has always been a HUGE gripe of mine that both the 4's and 6's are totally out classed by the 944s. We would go to topeka or other regions where there was a heavy 924S and 944 contingent and get blown away...

It was never worth fighting with national as the 914 is under represented and a rule change was unlikely.

I Almost bought a 924S and started over to build a new car, as I did want to be more competetive... but luckily I came to my senses and decided to spend 3times as much money rebuilding my 914 to jump into vintage racing instead... (huh?)

but I feel your pain.
the car is honestly not classed competetively and it sucks!

brant

Steve,

Yesterday I'm driving west of SR 54 and I see coming at me... yes it's a 914,.... wow, it looks nice, an early model, and a -6!!!.

Oh, it's just Steve playing with one of his 914 toys.

Paul

That's funny Paul. Sure enough, that was me. I decided to go for a cruise in the six and the smile is still on my face.

Brant,

Thanks for the expressing your experience with an I class 914. The club races here in the south east get over 20 924's and 944's in I class. A few years ago I talked to Harry Hall (chief scrutineer at the time) and he agreed with me that the 914's are not competive in I class. In fact he said that no 914 has ever been competive in I class. But he said there was nowhere else to put them. The J class people don't want them so the only other place is to move them up to I. I guess that is why I'm the only 914 in the south east racing in I class. I actually haven't raced since the 48 Hours at Sebring in February because I'm just not having fun anymore. It's a little disheartning being lapped by other cars in you class in a 16 lap race. That sucks!

I honestly believe the solution is to move the 944/924S up to H class.

They look to be a decent match on paper with power to weight.. and I LOVE 914s, and people are going to yell at me... but honestly on a big track the 944 is just more advanced in suspension and Actually can handle as well (not in autox) as a stockish 914 4 or 6..

let the yelling begin.
I base this statement not only on my own driving skills (which I'll admit could always improve) but also on watching people that I know are truly talented and they still are beaten by 44s.

I was reserved that I would not beat the 44's but was still having fun playing with some of the slow SC's or other teeners.... Like I said, I even seriously tried to buy a 924S "If you can't beat them join them"...

but decided to jump ship into a different sanctioning body instead...

my plan now is to 1x/year take my gutted 914 2.0 to a club race and get blown away in GT5, but still have fun playing with some of the traffic... Heck this is no different than not being competetive in "I".... and then I can go to vintage events the rest of the time and play there...

brant

I hear ya brother.

Man, have you seen the size of the tires on those 944's? I seem to remember seeing something like a 245-55-16. Dam that's a lot of tire compared to my 205-50-15's. I remember one time at Road Atlanta an I class 944 in front of me going into the last turn before the long straight, lost control and the car went completely sideways. I dove in the inside and passed him and excellerated as hard as my 110 hp would do and before the braking point for the next turn the same 944 passed me.

I'm thinking about doing the improvements (example: larger brakes, trans ratio, wheels & tires) that would bump me up to H class. Maybe it would at least help me to be competitive with some of the I class cars.

What's to yell about? 944's have great suspensions comparitively. The 968 is rumored to be the high water mark that suspension engineers strive for. One of the first things in Vic Elfords book is the optimal weight distribution given with a front engine rear transmission car. (still doesn't make me wanna buy one)

Only thing I can see to yell about is how PCA ignores 914's

Steve, you're pissing me off with your "driving the 6" stories...

(soon, soon...)

(Steve, psssssssssssssssssssst... 2.4S, 904 cams, 39mm intakes. Konis', 18mm 76 turbo front bar. Looks stock to me!)

Steve,

locally there is a very experienced mechanic who is also a national Steward (so is his live in girlfriend) who bumped his stock 6 from I to H... just to gain the venturi and carb flexibility...

I think you can pick up 10hp by tinkering with the carbs (euro set up)...

but technically this mod, bumps you to H class..
I don't know if the bigger brakes would matter.... You'd best not use the brakes if you want to be more competetive... ha.

The trans gearing also bumps you but into GT technically and not just H. The same person I mentioned above (pat moyle and vicki earnshaw) changed the ring and pinion because that is legal although gears are not legal.

brant

Eric,

I helped a friend build up an 89turbo (S)...
driving it on the track did kinda make me want to buy one... I went to PPIR locally (and oval with an infield) and ran top 5 times at a DE against hank godfriedsen and the likes... after only 20 minutes of track time to accumulate myself to a 944...

damnn... those turbos are fast...
and talk about brakes.. You could come off the oval and stomp on the pagid/big reds and let the ABS do the work... WOW....

brant

I respect them especially the turbos. I think they're great but they never did it for me. Guess I'm stuck in the 70's

I agree with you actually...
I often talk the big talk about 944's but I've never bought one...

(however if you know of any good teeners for sale, I'm always interested... lol)

brant

I actually know Pat ane Vicki. I was chairman of the 48 Hours at Sebring for 5 years and got to know them. I didn't realize they raced 914-6's. I have another friend from South Carolina (Allen and Marcia Roof) that also improved their 914-6 which bumped them from I class to H class. They never won their class but at least they could race with some of the I cars. Seems to me that Venturies, ring and pinion and possibly brakes is the way to go.

If money wasn't an object, I would do the 2.4 liter/908 brakes thing but unfortunitely money is a big object. But it is something to conisder if and when the time come when the 2 liter engine gets tired. Believe it or not, my race car only has 27,000 original miles.

I can tell you, win or loose, I'm racing the car I love. I will not sell this car to purchase a 944. I'm happy and proud to be a 914 guy. My Light Ivory race car is a quite nice original 6 and you wouldn't believe the attention it gets everywhere I take it.

the stock 6 will not make it in I class, however I have a 2.7 liter 89 944 the will kick ass in I. Just add suspension and go, other wise go 2.5 liter 6 and fight in HSR 250hp and a lot of fun. PCA go 2.2 and gt5.

Greg,
this kinda brings it back around the the beginning...
At least I think we all agree.
PCA needs to balance the field in I and H!

so how do we request this?

brant

Steve, from what I hear ALL your cars get quite a bit of attention wherever you go

My old 3.0 914/6 used to be is "H" Improved class....as is my 3.6 powered 911 SC.....both were competitive.....

Manfred is an "S" powered 2.0 with 180hp.....haven't ran the numbers yet to see what class it will be in.....but it looks like regions vary in class placement of the 914....

Mike Z,

I don't think your 3.0-6, or your SC were in H class in PCA club racing... It must have been H class in POC or maybe PCA DE in your region (or NASA or something else)...

Your 3.0/6 would of bumped into gt3 In pca club racing. Kinda a whole different planet from class H where they are very strict about NO displacement changes from stock and Pretty darn stock over all.

Carl Feghali's old GT-3 914/6 for example recently changed hands for 45K with a 3.3L motor, electromotive, all composite body, full monoball suspension, custom geared and LSD 915 with cooler and a power to weight ratio somewhere around: 350hp/1850lbs....

b

Eric

Yeah, I have been accused to be somewhat anal when it comes to my 914's. Even with the race car. It's very difficult being an anal purest. But somehow I've been able to achieve it.

All

I've really enjoyed everyones input to the PCA club racing I class 914 issue. Although I don't think it's right to have to do it but I believe that either going the prepared route or the GT5 route is probably the only answer. I don't think PCA is interested in changing the rules for a couple of 914's.

Club racing,,,,no. Never went that way as I was turned off by the people and the lack of venues on the west coast....

Like I said, in the regions that I DID do DE and TT, I was always in H class and did not seem to be uncompetitive....now SCCA....that's another matter.....I never went to a POC meet and did the points.....all I can say is that once you get with the big(ger) boys they probably DO unfairley class the 30 year old 914...of course I'm low budget....