Length from the bell housing flange on the block to the front of the balancer/serpetine pulley: 25.5 inches
from bottom rail of block to highest point on the valve cover 21 inches.
I might be sticking this into a stock chassis if it looks possible.
Full Version: Four Cam V8 dimensions
That's a cool looking motor.
THis motor is SO tiny. but has the potential for HUGE power. I kinda want to build one more bad ass four just for my blue street car but damn it is hard to argue with 250hp and 260lbft from a stock V8. THAT weighs less than a fully dressed out small block.
I need some one with a fully dressed V8 to measure the length for me.
I need some one with a fully dressed V8 to measure the length for me.
that length is pretty close to the SBC, maybe a half inch longer or so.
Should be able to stuff it in.
Should be able to stuff it in.
I have the iron block version of that motor in my Sequoia. It doesn't look any smaller than a SBC, plus it has some big cam belt covers on the front of it.
I have the same engine in my tundra. it's slightly longer than a SBC.
Does anyone have a verified weight figure for that lexus engine? (no guessing or estimating allowed)
I'm interested in seeing how much lighter it is.
Does anyone have a verified weight figure for that lexus engine? (no guessing or estimating allowed)
I'm interested in seeing how much lighter it is.
One word----Northstar----Somebody do it!
FWD and RWD versions are now manufactured. I don't know which one would be easier to swap. At 300 HP and about the same torque, it sounds like the perfect motor for the 914. I don't have the dimensions, but if it fits transversely under a Cadillac hood, it can't be too big. The sand rail crowd use this engine in their buggies, so I don't see why it couldn't be adapted to a 914.
Replace that Cadillac crest with a Porsche crest!
FWD and RWD versions are now manufactured. I don't know which one would be easier to swap. At 300 HP and about the same torque, it sounds like the perfect motor for the 914. I don't have the dimensions, but if it fits transversely under a Cadillac hood, it can't be too big. The sand rail crowd use this engine in their buggies, so I don't see why it couldn't be adapted to a 914.
Replace that Cadillac crest with a Porsche crest!
OK the Length was measured to the Harmonic balancer, which is the farthest forward point on the motor. The timing belts run off the back side of the balancer.
As far as weight goes, I have seen a quoted ship weight of 390lbs for a complete motor. INtake down to oil pan. That was probably with the stock exhaust manifolds. I don't have a scale that will measure that high but let me see what I can come up with.
The Lexus motor is far superior to the northstar POS. This is an all aluminum, 6 bolt steel main caps block. This motor is used to power the Tundra except it is a 5+ litre cast iron block.
check out the pics here:
http://www.lextreme.com/Shortblock.htm
check out some of the other articles for more options with this motor:
http://www.lextreme.com/fi.htm
As far as weight goes, I have seen a quoted ship weight of 390lbs for a complete motor. INtake down to oil pan. That was probably with the stock exhaust manifolds. I don't have a scale that will measure that high but let me see what I can come up with.
The Lexus motor is far superior to the northstar POS. This is an all aluminum, 6 bolt steel main caps block. This motor is used to power the Tundra except it is a 5+ litre cast iron block.
check out the pics here:
http://www.lextreme.com/Shortblock.htm
check out some of the other articles for more options with this motor:
http://www.lextreme.com/fi.htm
QUOTE(Brett W @ Sep 11 2004, 07:56 PM)
The Lexus motor is far superior to the northstar POS.
The Northstar isn't a POS, but if you install one you are obligated to have vinyl sail panels and drive around with your turn signal on all the time. And once a month you have to hit your garbage cans when you back out of the driveway.
-Ben M.
QUOTE
The Northstar isn't a POS, but if you install one you are obligated to have vinyl sail panels and drive around with your turn signal on all the time. And once a month you have to hit your garbage cans when you back out of the driveway.
Since when did the Caddy represent white trash?
Here's a MR2 Northstar Also Fiero NorthstarRick,
Do you know the difference between the 928 V8's and the Cayenne V8's?
Brett,
I'd like to see you build a TOYOTA powered aluminum V8 built. I would also like to see a Northstar transverse V8, all aluminum Donovan or Brodix V8, a NSX V6/transaxle and a boxster/transaxle engined 914...the later is in progress...
Felix
QUOTE(Jaiderenegadesimpson V8 914 @ Sep 12 2004, 12:21 AM)
QUOTE
The Northstar isn't a POS, but if you install one you are obligated to have vinyl sail panels and drive around with your turn signal on all the time. And once a month you have to hit your garbage cans when you back out of the driveway.
Since when did the Caddy represent white trash?
Vinyl top and perpetual blinking turn signal? I wasn't talking about white trash - I was talking about the average Caddy driver.
-Ben M.
QUOTE
Vinyl top and perpetual blinking turn signal? I wasn't talking about white trash - I was talking about the average Caddy driver.
-Ben M.
-Ben M.
I don't know if you've noticed but there's a revival of the Caddy products and it's image. Maybe you should be more specific as to the age of car and "average" age of driver.
Brett,
I'd like to hear some real facts that make the NS engine a "POS". If there are some real reliability or design issues let's be specific.
Felix
here are some of the problems with these engines:
"In researching this engine, we discovered that few rebuilders are overhauling Northstar V8s - not because these engines are lasting forever (they're not) but because the Northstar V8s are such expensive and complex engines. Cadillac has no reman program for Northstar V8s (if one fails, replace it with a new one). None of the major production engine rebuilders are doing Northstar V8s, and some rebuilders told us certain critical internal parts are unavailable (such as oversize crankshaft bearings). Add to this the fact that the cylinder liners can't be replaced or overbored and it doesn't leave much to rebuild.
Even the heads are throw-aways, according to Cadillac. If the valve guides are worn, Cadillac says the cylinder heads need to be replaced. The heads have hard powder metal valve guides, but we don't see any reason why the guides can't be replaced with new ones or repaired with bronze or cast iron guide liners."
"No oil pressure on a 1993-'94 engine? Debris between the oil pressure relief valve and its seat will prevent oil pressure buildup. The cure here is to clean or replace the pump (P/N 3543258), which is located on the front of the engine."
"If an engine has failed and is being rebuilt or replaced, the Engine Rebuilders Association (AERA) says the plastic intake manifold also should be replaced. The reason? Because of the complex shape of the manifold, it's impossible to tell if any engine debris has been blown back inside it. If the debris works loose and is ingested into the new engine, it will cause a repeat failure. That you don't want."
"As well-engineered as Northstar V8s are, like other engines they've had some problems. According to various sources, head gasket failures are not uncommon. Nor is oil burning or oil leaks."
check out:
http://www.caddyinfo.com/northstaroil.htm
General dimensions - 28"W, 26"H, 31"L
Weight - Ready to run...
appx 413lbs
Engine Weight Variables...
Bare - about 400lbs
w/ all accessories - about 470lbs
I personally don't beleive that the GM engine is anywhere near the quality of the Lexus motor. IF it were as good then Cadiallac would be in the same league as Lexus, Infinity or Acura. We all know that is not the case.
"In researching this engine, we discovered that few rebuilders are overhauling Northstar V8s - not because these engines are lasting forever (they're not) but because the Northstar V8s are such expensive and complex engines. Cadillac has no reman program for Northstar V8s (if one fails, replace it with a new one). None of the major production engine rebuilders are doing Northstar V8s, and some rebuilders told us certain critical internal parts are unavailable (such as oversize crankshaft bearings). Add to this the fact that the cylinder liners can't be replaced or overbored and it doesn't leave much to rebuild.
Even the heads are throw-aways, according to Cadillac. If the valve guides are worn, Cadillac says the cylinder heads need to be replaced. The heads have hard powder metal valve guides, but we don't see any reason why the guides can't be replaced with new ones or repaired with bronze or cast iron guide liners."
"No oil pressure on a 1993-'94 engine? Debris between the oil pressure relief valve and its seat will prevent oil pressure buildup. The cure here is to clean or replace the pump (P/N 3543258), which is located on the front of the engine."
"If an engine has failed and is being rebuilt or replaced, the Engine Rebuilders Association (AERA) says the plastic intake manifold also should be replaced. The reason? Because of the complex shape of the manifold, it's impossible to tell if any engine debris has been blown back inside it. If the debris works loose and is ingested into the new engine, it will cause a repeat failure. That you don't want."
"As well-engineered as Northstar V8s are, like other engines they've had some problems. According to various sources, head gasket failures are not uncommon. Nor is oil burning or oil leaks."
check out:
http://www.caddyinfo.com/northstaroil.htm
General dimensions - 28"W, 26"H, 31"L
Weight - Ready to run...
appx 413lbs
Engine Weight Variables...
Bare - about 400lbs
w/ all accessories - about 470lbs
I personally don't beleive that the GM engine is anywhere near the quality of the Lexus motor. IF it were as good then Cadiallac would be in the same league as Lexus, Infinity or Acura. We all know that is not the case.
Brett,
I don't disagree with your conclusion but I believe it still boils down to personal taste or we'd all be driving Japanese cars for the sheer sense of it. This is a hot topic in many auto forums (Mercedes for one). The Japanese tend to overengineer many of their products. It has prompted better american (and European) engineering. Unfortunately losing many customers since the 70's and the difficulty to compete in operation costs has kept US manufacturers at a disadvantage. The Japanese government also subsidize their car companies and has limited importation. With higher cost of living, the american market demands cheaper and more reliable products typically available from off shore. My primary issue is that Japan it is more of a copier/developer and not an innovator (with Honda being an exception).
30 yr old american engines have been the choice in 914 conversions because they are relatively inexpensive and easy to maintain. They also fit without major surgery and are a great value for the performance. New american engines appear to have better engineering but less durability and as with all new engines very little DIY maintainability. The FI, aluminum material and newer technology is desired as you'll soon see GM LS engined 914's.
There are many sites that favor the Northstar even if it is a "disposable" engine. One site shows a new engine for $2500 which would be well worth replacing every 5 years. This is the age of disposable design. The one real problem with Japanese engines are designed to outlast the rest of the car.
Install the Toyota engine and show us the results, I'm anxious to see it. SHOW us why your conversion is superior and others are POS.
Felix
I don't disagree with your conclusion but I believe it still boils down to personal taste or we'd all be driving Japanese cars for the sheer sense of it. This is a hot topic in many auto forums (Mercedes for one). The Japanese tend to overengineer many of their products. It has prompted better american (and European) engineering. Unfortunately losing many customers since the 70's and the difficulty to compete in operation costs has kept US manufacturers at a disadvantage. The Japanese government also subsidize their car companies and has limited importation. With higher cost of living, the american market demands cheaper and more reliable products typically available from off shore. My primary issue is that Japan it is more of a copier/developer and not an innovator (with Honda being an exception).
30 yr old american engines have been the choice in 914 conversions because they are relatively inexpensive and easy to maintain. They also fit without major surgery and are a great value for the performance. New american engines appear to have better engineering but less durability and as with all new engines very little DIY maintainability. The FI, aluminum material and newer technology is desired as you'll soon see GM LS engined 914's.
There are many sites that favor the Northstar even if it is a "disposable" engine. One site shows a new engine for $2500 which would be well worth replacing every 5 years. This is the age of disposable design. The one real problem with Japanese engines are designed to outlast the rest of the car.
Install the Toyota engine and show us the results, I'm anxious to see it. SHOW us why your conversion is superior and others are POS.
Felix
Jaide
You mistake my criticism as a total disregard for any thing other than my own personal choices. I started my life with small block chevys and never gave a thought to anything foreign. I would stick an LS1,2,6 in a 914. I have looked at the SHO 3.0 V6, the Olds Aurora, the standard small block chevy, Ford 302, Nissan 3.5 V8, BMW V12, Porsche 928 V8, etc.
Some were discarded because they wouldn't fit easily (302, V12)
Some because of cost (LS-X 3k-6k just for motor)
Some because they could not deliver power for bucks (928 V8, Olds 4.0)
Other engines are not all POS. I personally don't see some of them as feasible or desireable. The LS1 falls in my list of one of the worlds best engines, but the caddy motor is not a performance engine in my opinion. (key word My opinion) I like German Engines, Japanese engines, and American Engines. Hell If I could find onf for a reasonble price I would stick a Carrera GT V10 in there but that ain't gonna happen.
I went with the Lexus motor because it was cheap (I paid less than 300 delivered), It is compact, It has 4 cams, 4 valves per cylinders, All aluminum, Way overbuilt (stock block and stock crank can handle 2000+hp). It is a V8, I can rev it to 9 grand without a bunch or trouble, it is very l;ight weight and it resemebles some of the V8 Formula/LMP/GTP V8s.
My complaints about this motor follow: Fairly complicated timing control, limited aftermarket.
My whole plan for this car is something very one off. A tube chassis, dual a-arms, one peice front and rear bodies. I want to create a Very race insprired Street car. 4-valve, multi-cam, 8-10-12 cylinder engines populate the starting grids on race day.
Could I have done it with less, yes, but that is not what I am trying to accomplish. My main hold up will be Money. AS a student my income is extremely limited. I do have the fabrication capabilties so that is not an issue, I have plenty of spare time, but Cash is the hardest thing for me to come by. I am going to start this project (hopefullly ) in the spring or next summer. I have to finish my turbocharged Civic, My street four cylinder 914, and get the suspension designed for the V-8 914. then I can start on it. Above all I have to pass this coming semester so I can get closer to graduating (1-1.5 years). The sooner I get out of school the sooner I can have a reliable, consistent, above average income.
You mistake my criticism as a total disregard for any thing other than my own personal choices. I started my life with small block chevys and never gave a thought to anything foreign. I would stick an LS1,2,6 in a 914. I have looked at the SHO 3.0 V6, the Olds Aurora, the standard small block chevy, Ford 302, Nissan 3.5 V8, BMW V12, Porsche 928 V8, etc.
Some were discarded because they wouldn't fit easily (302, V12)
Some because of cost (LS-X 3k-6k just for motor)
Some because they could not deliver power for bucks (928 V8, Olds 4.0)
Other engines are not all POS. I personally don't see some of them as feasible or desireable. The LS1 falls in my list of one of the worlds best engines, but the caddy motor is not a performance engine in my opinion. (key word My opinion) I like German Engines, Japanese engines, and American Engines. Hell If I could find onf for a reasonble price I would stick a Carrera GT V10 in there but that ain't gonna happen.
I went with the Lexus motor because it was cheap (I paid less than 300 delivered), It is compact, It has 4 cams, 4 valves per cylinders, All aluminum, Way overbuilt (stock block and stock crank can handle 2000+hp). It is a V8, I can rev it to 9 grand without a bunch or trouble, it is very l;ight weight and it resemebles some of the V8 Formula/LMP/GTP V8s.
My complaints about this motor follow: Fairly complicated timing control, limited aftermarket.
My whole plan for this car is something very one off. A tube chassis, dual a-arms, one peice front and rear bodies. I want to create a Very race insprired Street car. 4-valve, multi-cam, 8-10-12 cylinder engines populate the starting grids on race day.
Could I have done it with less, yes, but that is not what I am trying to accomplish. My main hold up will be Money. AS a student my income is extremely limited. I do have the fabrication capabilties so that is not an issue, I have plenty of spare time, but Cash is the hardest thing for me to come by. I am going to start this project (hopefullly ) in the spring or next summer. I have to finish my turbocharged Civic, My street four cylinder 914, and get the suspension designed for the V-8 914. then I can start on it. Above all I have to pass this coming semester so I can get closer to graduating (1-1.5 years). The sooner I get out of school the sooner I can have a reliable, consistent, above average income.
What about a Renault Fuego engine?
Or one from a Le Car?
I wonder if replacement gerbils are still available....
Or one from a Le Car?
I wonder if replacement gerbils are still available....
The SHO engine was one of the finest engines I've ever owned. I saw one mated up to a 901 and stuck mid-engine into some sort of platform back in 1990.
Smoother than silk with progressive intake runners. Mine had over 198k on it with 0 problems (other than the original clutchs)
Smoother than silk with progressive intake runners. Mine had over 198k on it with 0 problems (other than the original clutchs)
Looks like someone has already done a street legal car with the Lexus V8. Check it out:
http://www.f40.co.nz/f40/index.htm
The videos look pretty good too. Scroll down the page to see the links.
http://www.f40.co.nz/f40/index.htm
The videos look pretty good too. Scroll down the page to see the links.
The Yamaha/Ford V6 is an incredible engine. Variable length intake runners, full Sequential EFI. Too bad it is a cast iron block. Rumor has that the engine could turn 10k in stock form if it weren't for the accesories. Supposedly the alternators die above 7500 (i think). You can get a brand new one for something like 4000$ complete. I have a feeling it will be too tall for the 914 engine bay.
QUOTE
I went with the Lexus motor because it was cheap (I paid less than 300 delivered), It is compact, It has 4 cams, 4 valves per cylinders, All aluminum, Way overbuilt (stock block and stock crank can handle 2000+hp). It is a V8, I can rev it to 9 grand without a bunch or trouble, it is very l;ight weight and it resemebles some of the V8 Formula/LMP/GTP V8s.
Now $300 is a DEAL and makes perfect financial sense. Which tranny are you using? Don't get me wrong I DO respect your opinion and appreciate your research. I just question choices because I've been down one road many years ago and am considering another. My next project will be a "modern" version of the 914. IMHO we are hooked on our 914's because they are relatively inexpensive and have the potential to be better, sort of a underdog complex. We tend to have a chip on our shoulders because of the relative lack of respect even with the Porsche label. There are many 914 engine options being explored today and you have chosen a unique alternative. Here's Rod Millen IS 430. My best advice is to do whatever it takes to get it running as soon as possible and sort it out over time...
Good luck,
Felix
The tundra and sequoia engines are 4.7 liter.
Oh, and as far as aftermarket, TRD makes a bolt on supercharger that's goode for at least 100 additional HP
Oh, and as far as aftermarket, TRD makes a bolt on supercharger that's goode for at least 100 additional HP
Jaide I am going to go with the Audi transaxle. I am shooting for about 500+600 HP NA. I want a motor that will rev high. Should be able to make about 400lb-ft somewhere in the upper rev range, thus keeping the shock loads low on the tranny. I don't know that the Porsche trans axles is the way to go, Hell for 10K I could just start looking for a used LMP/GTP transaxel. I figure I can pick up Audi gear boxes for really cheap, cheap enough to pop a few in the learning curve.
Sammy
That bolt on Supercharger is 4000$. You want to know what kind of twin turbo Kit I can put together for 4000$. Custom stainless headers, dual intercoolers, all custom charge piping, Two ball bearing turbos. I can easily get 500+ extra HP from that little upgrade.
Sammy
That bolt on Supercharger is 4000$. You want to know what kind of twin turbo Kit I can put together for 4000$. Custom stainless headers, dual intercoolers, all custom charge piping, Two ball bearing turbos. I can easily get 500+ extra HP from that little upgrade.
QUOTE(Brett W @ Sep 12 2004, 09:02 PM)
Sammy
That bolt on Supercharger is 4000$. You want to know what kind of twin turbo Kit I can put together for 4000$. Custom stainless headers, dual intercoolers, all custom charge piping, Two ball bearing turbos. I can easily get 500+ extra HP from that little upgrade.
Sure but everyone knows that you can't turbo a 914.
Sorry, I had to.
Good luck with it. I am sure you can figure it out.
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