I've seen some anodized aluminum fuel rails for sale before on e-bay for 914's. They had a fuel pressure guage attached. Did anybody else see these? I'm wondering who makes them and if anybody has seen them in person. They looked pretty cool. Any info would be appreciated.
Tom

I have seen them for the Weber carbs (triple throat) but not for 4cyl injected cars. Do you have pics ??


B

you mean these?
you can find 'em at www.9xauto.com

cheers,

jeroen

I have to bite my tongue here... but who is buying this stuff from these guy's ??

I would like to meet the person responsible for their new products division. I have some idea's for him/her.

B

This is great:

"Our aluminum products are designed in Auto Cad and laser cut for precision."

A square block with brass fittings needed Auto cad ?? LOL

Sorry. He is supporting the 914 community.

B

Yeah Jeroen,
those are the ones. Pretty sweet but $175.00 ouch! Anybody seen 'em in person?

This sh** should be on the front page of the JC Whitney catalog along with the magnetic fuel molecule aligner and the dash compasses. I'd say they're doing something that starts with an "S" to the 914 community but I don't think I'd call it supporting.

Have fun,
Kevin

I've got mixed views on these guy's.....mostly I see them taking advantage of the mis-informed or persons that don't have access to a knowledge base such as this. BUT, they have just as much right to make a buck as the next fella....people do not have to buy what they are selling....

Is there stuff junk, no, not really, but it is advertised wrongly and deviously if you ask me.

Basicly what I see them as is a machine shop that while looking for extra income saw what is available for all these Hondas and such and started to look at their own cars to see what kind of parts they can have produced in shiney anodized colors....

I've never seen anyone that works for them post on any of the multiple lists I am on, heck, they may not even own a 914, but as Brad mentioned, they are supporting the car, I just don't like the way they do it since they are really making cosmetic upgrades verses performance as they claim....

See dude, here's my issue: the car hobby is full of shysters and hucksters selling absolute crap and making claims that have no basis in fact. Now these fuel rail people skillfully skirt making any real claims in their ad about improving anything. I think devious advertising (like most) is an appropriate description. I don't buy the "supporting the 914" thing period

Oh well, I guess I'm kinda cranky today anyway. I woke up with a cold.

Have fun,
Kevin

I just HAVE to be neutral now. Thats all. I'll let you know how I really feel in person.

B

While I have to admit the price is out of line for what it is, it does look nice and a fuel rail with greater internal volume would decrease the amount of flucuations in fuel pressures which I think would help driveability if not horspower. I have a friend in a machine shop I'd like to show these pics to and see what kind if a price he could give me for something like this.

I don't think that anyone has ever had a problem with the amount of fuel and how it is delivered with the standard fuel rails. If you want to install this on your engine because it is shiney, good for you. If you want to install this for better performance, I have a bridge you may be interested in. Other than bling, bling it is just snake oil.

And I don't think that the VDO gauge that they are using is meant for high heat, high vibration environments.

Even though he hasn't said anything, I'm with Brad.

hey! what's wrong with honda stuff!



These are completely useless and just looks "cool" and No, I don't have them on my Honda(s).

RICE

Paul,
Tell me more about this bridge you have. Could you post some pics? Do you take paypal?

I totally agree with Brad!

Brad must think that it’s funny that people agree with him, even when he keeps his mouth shut, LOL.

In the bug world the ‘trick set up’ for aftermarket PEFI is, you guessed it, OEM stock fuel rails. If you need a gauge, I would put one on the firewall because of the vibration issue.

Liquid filled gauge mounted anywhere you want. Tom, one of the fuel rails in your car has a port used for the cold start valve. I install a second fuel rail with this port so I can mount a liquid filled gauge on a short piece of hose (and leave it there)

Tom, you do need to check your fuel pressure. You car may have had it turned down to help pass smog.

B

Since we're talking about 9xauto, what do you guys think of http://www.9xauto.com/914filter.html
There theory looks right, but im thinking maybe 2-3 more hp not 8-15, im thinking of doing something like this.. ?????????

Maybe 2-3 HP. I like it. Expensive and you could dupe it for half... 8-15 is total lies. NOTHING available for our stock engines will make a 8-15 HP increase (except nitrous/turbo/supercharger.) The biggest gain I have seen is putting a header on them.

B

so, do you really need the cold start valve? I asume it's only to help the car rev higher during a "cold start". Curious... I want to eliminate as much crap in the engine bay as i can


EDIT somehow, I thought about this, and it sounds like a stupid question. Please feel free to make fun of me.

Most of use dont run a cold start valve. It only works up too a certain temp (forgot what this was) but you get the idea. Remove it. You just have to keep the car running until It warms up. It is there to compensate for the amount of air the AUX is letting through during the cold start.

B

I'm pretty sure the cold start injector only works when the key is in the "start" position, and then only below a set temp. The AUX air valve stays open quite a bit longer - like 6-8 minutes - to keep the rpms up while the motor warms up. All of this, though is dependant on the temp being below whatever it's set at. They both operate using a bi-metal strip that bends as it changes temp. The cold start bi-metal strip bends and breaks electrical contact above a certain temp, disabling it, and the aux air bi-metal strip closes an open air passage to the manifold as it heats up. This is my understanding of how these work.

anodized fuel rail post becomes cold starting post. hehe.

Anyways, what about the aux air regulartor. Could I cap that off also?

I could see getting rid of the cold start valve, especially considering it only operates when the car is started in temps below freezing (according to Brad Anders' site), but why would you want to plug the aux air regulator? It remains closed in temps when it's not needed and prevents you from having to keep your foot on the throttle while your car warms up when it IS cold enough to need it.

One less vaccuum leak. It actually works all the time. It has power all the time I should say. The injection brain has nothing to do with it.. They can be stuck open and be a source for constant air leaks. Lose it if you dont need it.

B

But it's a vacuum leak when you need a vacuum leak... It keeps the idle from being very low the first few minutes the engine is running. Unless yours is f***ed up, why bother ditching it?

Hell, if you want a fuel system that requires you to keep your foot on the throttle when the engine is cold, just go to carbs. You get the "added benefits" of poorer fuel metering and worse atomization, to boot! Of course, there is less restriction there...

--DD

Exactly! Even if it fails electrically, it will still work, just not as fast. The heat of the engine will eventually bend the bimetal strip enough to close off the aux air coming in, just not as fast. If mine didn't work, either because it was stuck open or stuck closed, I'd sure try to unstick it before just removing it.

"Hell, if you want a fuel system that requires you to keep your foot on the throttle ..."

I used to drive an old scrapheap while working on my VW Scirocco project.
It would die if I didn't do exactly that (cold or warm).

It really helped my heel & toe technique

cheers,

Jeroen

On the passenger side fuel rail on my 2.0, there is a third port that is bolted closed because it is not in use. Its right in the middle, in the top side, opposide of the nipples that feed fuel into the injectors. Coul I rig up a fuel pressure gauge with this? Just curious

Yup, that's exactly what I did.

Warning: The fuel line coming up from that can rub on the MPS and its bracket. Did on mine--so I got tired of that and swapped for a fuel rail without the center fitting. (Couldn't find the bolt any more.)

I now have the pressure gauge plumbed into where the cold-start valve "should" go. I hardly ever started the car when it was cold enough to activate the CSV anyway...

--DD

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but do any of you have pictures of your fuel pressure guage set-ups? I am still trying to diagnose/tune my 74 2.0, and haven't checked fuel pressure yet. I like the idea of having a guage permanently installed. Does it matter where the guage is tied in (obviously after the fuel pressure reg.).

Actually the guage goes between the fuel pump and the before fuel pressure regulator. After the regulator is non-pressurized.

After the regulator is non-pressurized. [QUOTE]


WTF????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yup. The fuel pump supplies way too much fuel--that's the way it is designed. The regulator is a spring-loaded valve. When the pressure "upstream" of it gets higher than the spring pressure, it opens up and lets fuel out until the pressure drops. So you have a source of fuel on the one end of the high-pressure loop, and you have a variable outlet on the other end. The section in between those is what is kept at the particular pressure.

--DD

OK guys, I thought Bowlsby was fucking with this newbie big time, but with a second to his motion, I have to believe. Sooooo, the fuel loop goes:Fuel pump to end of fuel pressure reg., then out the side of the reg. to the rail on the drivers side, then through the rail on the pass. side, then through the return line to the tank, right? So, assuming I have the routing correct, you are saying that the guage would go between the pump and reg.? How is the reg. adjustable - where do you need to have the 29 psi at, between the reg. and the driver's side fuel rail, or prior to the reg. I thought I understood the whole deal, it would make sense to me that the fuel pump puts the fuel out at whatever pressure, then the pressure is adjusted at the regulator prior to flowing to the driver's, then the passenger's side fuel rails, with the residual returning to the tank, and that the guage should go between the reg and first rail to guarantee that the fuel is being delivered at 29 psi to the injectors. PLEASE HELP ME, I'm totally lost now.
Thanks..........

Wait - maybe I do have this whole thing reversed. Does the fuel flow from the pump to the fuel rail on the passenger side, then to the rail on the drivers side, then into the side of the regulator and return to the tank. Yeah, and the reg controls the flow by reducing or increasing the flow out of the system.I was hung up thinking that it had to go inline prior to the injectors. Ok, I got that, but I still would like to see some pics of people's guages that they have plumbed in.
Thanks.....

You got it in your second note.

Tank to filter, filter to pump. Pump to RHS fuel rail, RHS rail to LHS rail. LHS rail to regulator, regulator back to tank. (On 70-74 cars the 'R' port on the fuel pump tees into that "regulator back to tank" line.)

Pics tomorrow.

--DD

The way I keep everything strait:

Think of it this way, the regulator bleeds off what is doesnt use. This is why a restriction in your return line can cause high fuel pressure readings.

B

B and I both added pics of the parts we're talking about to the following thread:
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=419

--DD