So back to the motor mount. I used some .25" 4" prefab plates ( $1.99ea) as the base plates and drilled them to match the factory mounts. For the stand offs I used some Proto Fab tabs ($3.99ea x 4) radius 1.5" to match the tube. All I had to do was shorten them a bit. I had already tacked the shorter tabs in place before I started with the pics. . They were out of the short rectangular tab so I used the ones with slanted sides which is covered a few pics down. Here the plates are back on the mounts with both short and long tabs tacked in place. The tube is slipped back in place to check flush and square from time to time.

The right bank

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Left bank

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Another angle of the Left bank

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Ditto on the right bank

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Front view

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A quick double check of the angle

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LJYYCM(%VF

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I wanted to add a piece to tie in the stand offs so I cut some off this 3/16" piece

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But........because I had used the tabs with the angled sides I needed to tweek the end to match. With the piece firmly clamped in the vise a cheater bar clamped to it and...........

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These two pic's show that angle beater than I can say it.

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The pieces seem to fit well enough

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And after a few minutes of welding in the vise

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One more quick check and it still level. The cross bar will not get welded in place yet. It is my variable if I've missed something. At least that is what I am telling myself. Next thing is to position the long side rails and weld the bolt collars in so I can hang them off the car. Then the cross member will be cut/radiused to length (and possibly bent to offset any height issues and/or exhaust issues) and welded in place. Stay tuned as I stumble and bumble my way thru this with an emphasis on embarrassing myself.

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some more

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Nice job on the mount.

Bob

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Nicely done. Do you plan to bolt the trans to the cradle or mount it independently ?

Thx, Bob. I was very careful to not take any pic's with the "really bad" weld joints.

David, I'll have to figure that out. My original plan was to use the factory mount on the bottom rear of the tranny but...........that part of the tranny is removed because it isn't needed. That being said, who knows. DB Coopers cradle design might be the way to go but I haven't finalized that yet. Once that part is worked out some gussets and additional bracing/re-inforcement will be added. It's pretty much a skeleton at this point.

Looks really good Kent! I like the way you incorporated the front mount attachment points. For the trans you can just fab up a couple of hangers similar to the coldwater.com setup.

Got my engine out...I'll try to update the thread soon.

Thx Chris. As you can see in the following pic's, I did the same on the tranny pick up points except that I welded those pieces to the cradle. I understand why Ian did his that way but I felt that if I were to need to drop the tranny that I would just drop the entire assm or just remove the tranny from it's factory mount (4 bolts).

Before going any further with the cradle I replaced this little pest.

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Then on to the tranny to switch it from AWD to FWD. Thx for the link Chris. After draining the lube it is stood on end and the rear cover bolts are removed.

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A few taps with a rubber mallet to separate it

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To reveal this

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Now it's just a matter of removing a few pieces

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Group photo of the pieces that are removed.

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Here the locking nut is being removed. Notice the pipe wrench's affixed to the output shafts. Impact makes short work of this.

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Next I need to make a cover plate for the rear of the tranny. I'll use the old cover as a template but I need to remove this gear first so I remove the 4 allen head screws holding it first.

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Now I can scribe the outline.

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Then a quick ride on the bandsaw.

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A little shaping on my "washing machine motor turned 12" sander".

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A after 10 min's of polishing the piece of junk yard aluminium, viola!

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Now, back to the cradle. One piece that ties the tranny support onto the cradle.

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The other side (right)

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And now it's tied in. I used the factory tranny mount after realizing that this section "was not" removed as I believed it would be earlier.

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Found my first "gotcha". The clutch fork is contacting the trunk in this pic. It appears that I can trim this piece down. I'll need to drill another hole for the return spring after trimming this.

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Hanging from the front mounts.

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A view from the lid

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And a shot from the rear. The bottle neck jack is there until I shave the clutch fork down enough to connect the rear attach points on the cradle.

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Awesome!

Now post that center diff on NASIOC! I got $250 for mine no haggling.

Shopping for a clutch and came across this. It appears Exedy is not the way to go.
http://www.rexnet.com.au/forum/index.php?/...8/page__st__150

I would look into an act clutch and pressure plate, they make awesome clutches

It looks like the engine is rubber mounted and the tranny is not.... is that correct?

that will be trouble, both need to be mounted solid or isolated mounts, not mix and match.

The Trans is on a mount. Its the black thing underneath the rear of the trans

I think Troy's point is the fact that one end of the cradle might have a soft mount and one end might be directly bolted to the chassis. Keep in mind we also have engine mounts in the middle attached to the engine.

Kent what are you doing for cradle mounts? Front, back, or both? I'm actually worried about the opposite. I have 911 mounts at the front and rear as well as the stock mounts on the engine. Might be too soft. If so I can remove the front cradle mounts I guess.

I'm running front and rear factory rubber mounts in their original position i.e. the bottom of the engine and tranny. I don't know why your cradle has those front extensions unless Ian discovered a weakness in that design or maybe it's a material difference. They certainly won't hurt anything. I used 4130 1.5" .095"wall which I felt was substantial. My motor mount receivers are different from his also so he may have transferred some of that load to those front mounts. Time will tell. Maybe mine will fall off someday. Chris, does your clutch disc have 4 lg springs only or 4 lg spg's with small spgs inside the lg ones for a total of 8?

I'm sure your mount is fine. Ian designed his mount so it could be used with any Subie engine...maybe that's why it's different. Fits great I must say.

I don't know on the clutch...already installed it about 3 months ago. It's a different kit than yours with a thicker pressure plate. I'm not gonna worry about it though...if it rattles I'll buy one from Subaru I guess. Seems like the worst that could happen is the disk gets chewed up. If I happen to separate the engine and trans anytime soon I'll check for you.

Edit:

This is the kit I bought. If you look REALLY close you can see 2 sets of springs for a total of 8...whew! Good news there. Gripforce on e-bay seems like a good outfit.

Clutch kit

Everything looks great and very familiar!

A little bird dropped me a question about this time in my build regarding the trans mount clearance. If this part of the cradle is not the lowest point then, disregard my nosiness.

Feel free to ask about any details that were not listed in any of the Suby builds here, especially Strawman! Geoff is very helpful!

Cheers!

Nate

I finally quit obsessing over it and took your advice. Ordered a KB03 this AM. I'll let you know when it gets here. BTW, all those chatter posts are on AWD systems.


Nate, I think I can speak for Chris (and others) as well when I say thanks to you, Geoff, Bob and et al for looking over our projects. We need all the help we can get. I'm confused though. Were you pointing out that my cradle needs to attached to the firewall also or that I run the risk of tearing my trans mount off? As things sit presently, my oil pan is about 1.5" lower than the cradle. I may have to attach a skid plate to the cradle to rectify but that will be addressed later.

Kent, on the clutches I think the issue was definitely related to 4WD HARD DRIVING and also some cheap kits that were probably not supposed to be used with a Subie. EXEDY makes clutches for other cars and they might just need 4 springs.

Definitely appreciate all the help from everyone. Every time I need an answer from certain Subaru sites I am reminded of how genuinely helpful this community is. I would not be able to do my swap without you guys.

Nate, your trans mounts are thicker at the top than mine, which would solve my clearance problem. Thanks for the example. I will shim them for now but will probably weld some more steel on the top of the plate to lower the cradle a bit (winter project).

If the cradle would take the scrape rather than tail mount then no worries. The way mine was situated the Suby mount would take the brunt of a blow. So, that is why I used the 911 mounts at the stock positions with the trans stubs mounts to the case itself.

Hope it clarifies my nosiness

Looks great!
NAte

I installed the new clutch

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and TO bearing. Must admit that "pull clutch thing" threw me a curve ball at first.

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But before I slapped the drive train back into the car for another fit I did something I'd wanted to do since I began bouncing this cradle design around in my head. First I retired this contraption. They will be re-purposed in a welding station.

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And did this. $24 worth of casters, scrap piece of DOM & 2" angle. It's a dream to move around the shop and no worries about tipping over, either.

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But I saved the best part for last. Watch how fast and easy the install back into the car goes. After rolling the assm under the car (with the wheels on the car) I line up front left mount and place the floor jack under the cradle

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Raise it 2" or until the wheel falls out

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Then the bolt is slid back thru with a large washer to mate against the factory bracket and spread the load. BTW, both the bolt and washers are re-purposed from the old rear mounts. The nut with a smaller diameter fat washer are started from above but not tightened. One down

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Repeat on the right side. Two down

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Back to the tail and just like the sides it's jacked up 2" but after the wheel falls out the receiver is removed from the tranny and the rear mounts are fastened to the old rear receivers as shown in an earlier post here. After the rears mounts are tightened I go back and finish tightening the fronts.

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And it's a good thing that I went with gas struts for the lids because this brace that contained the 2 torsion rods for the old truck lift ended up dead center of the TB throat. I'll grind 'em down later but that spot might get a trim anyway.

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Plenty of clearance up front

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This is the Carrot in Front of the "yours truly" Donkey. Just seeing it sitting there should keep me motivated. I believe the cradle is finished short of paint and a few weld tabs for the shifter or exhaust system.

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Cool

There's no front cross member under the engine? The mounts being aft of the engine's centerline are adequate?

See now you're just showing off...slow down Kent! I almost caught up!

Looks great and it will be nice when you have to drop the engine. So easy.

Adequate? Adequate! There's no adequate in 914's. Actually your correct. No front cross member. When I pull the tranny I need to brace the front of the engine because it is totally front heavy w/o it. In it's factory configuration there is a support attached from top center of the tranny to the firewall.

I love that mount

Oh I think you are ahead of me Chris. Anything that's gone quickly is a result of others previous endeavors, including you. Less research time=more build time. The roll around cradle makes it so fast and easy that I don't hesitate to R&R as needed. I think I have about $150.00 +/- $10 in materials including the wheels. Now if you add in the bender, tube notcher and bi metal hole saws your looking at about $350 to make one. There is no doubt that it is easier to buy one but none were available and this helped offset the cost of my welding equipment. Any of you locals are welcome to make the 2 bends necessary on my bender, should the bug bite you.


Thanks. One of my ideas actually worked.

Kent,
I love the casters idea
When I get back to working on my car, I was going to look into a support attached from the tranny to the firewall. Maybe you can pave the way.

Nice engine cradle, the wheel setup is brilliant

Definitely have to copy that design when I get ready to build mine.
You guys are way ahead of me....I'm still trying to get my shop done so I can get started.

Nice job Kent, keep the details coming.

Jeff

Sorry I'm late getting back with you guy's. Hey Mike , you do realize that you are one of the MAIN reasons I got into this. Not sure whether to you or you, yet. Just kidding. I did take a quick look at that and the first ? that came to mind is why? It is only about 2" aft of the engine mounts so it isn't to add support when the tranny is out?? Given the bolt thru it was horizontal I doubt it was for torsional control?? Was it there to spread the weight load? If it were attached to the trunk wall what reinforcements would be needed?? Your thoughts?


Hey thx Jeff. You might want to go .125" wall if you go DOM. BTW, that was one 10' piece of tube. I cut it a little close as I had 2.5" left over when finished! Next time I won't cut it as close as it took too much effort (you know, that double and triple checking your measurements ). I could have used a little more cushion when constructing it.

So I better post something up so I don't have to call myself out on "The Slackers Thread". I really don't have to show as I have been trudging thru this maelstrom known as a wiring harness. There aren't enough joint's in the world to take the edge of this job. So I with it until I begin to feel my sanity slipping away then move onto something trivial. Or should I say something less demanding? Simple suits me well.

So as a diversion I'm falling back to something else. This is one of those items. The slave (is that politically correct?) cylinder needed another 5/8" clearance so....


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A flat panel would have made things a bit easier. This cover will need to be removeable to inspect/service the banjo fitting.

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And as it turns out the starter needs a bit of room also. Even after I asked Bob which one would clear I still end up with a clearance issue. The good thing is if it takes a I won't have to worry about another one fitting if it happens in BFE. And before I get flamed for the elongated access remember that the engine/tranny combo is up and then slid forward, so it is necessary.

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Rather than pontificate I'll just run some pic's past ya and you can use yer imagination or ask a question if ya have 'em.

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This littl POS consumed 4 hr's of my day, after all was said and done. I couldn't be any slower if I tried. I had to go over it twice to fill any pin holes as I didn't want this piece rusting out soon.

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After all that I ended up with this gap which I corrected with a tab welded in place. I'll show that in the next few days. It's primed, in place and already covered up as the trunk is converted back to the cat motel. Yea the little bastards sleep in the trunk but they do their business outside and whilst me neighbors have rodents we have none.

So after a few more stints in the wiring asylum I soon found another item that required my attention (just don't make me go back to wireworld. BTW, I stole this idea from Bob (bigkat). I had laid out what I thought to be the correct location for the pump assembly then a little voice said better double check that so I went thru the threads and noticed that Bob had his centered a bit more than mine. I had fixated upon installing it upon a flat surface and almost ruined a good tank. After looking at Bob's install it occurred to me that the criteria was where the pick up is located! DUH This is why you will see one drawing imposed upon another. The piece of wood held in place by the cleco side clamps is there to position the compass upon. By looking straight down the filler neck w/ a plumb bob I established the location of the reservoirs rim. By sticking a tape inside the reservoir I determined the diameter. Rather than bisecting a segment in the circle to locate center I just split the compass and worked off the edge of the circle. Once I felt OK about my location it was just a matter of figuring the offset in the pump itself and flipping the pickup sock 180'. I'll need to build a step onto the base of the cover to accommodate the offset on the tanks surface but that's another day.

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and the $$$ shot

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You're pretty good with that sheet metal fab, Kent


When I mentioned an extra motor mount, I was thinking more along the lines of a front engine mount utilizing sort of rubber dampener to the firewall, rather than at the tranny

It just seems to me that a front mount will allow for a bit more aggressive driving

Hi Kent,
As I was reworking my cradle or at this point I could just call it a X-bar, I spent a lot of time thinking about the load distribution.
The lower Suby mounts are just about the CG of my WRX/901 combo. So all the static load is on the lower mounts. Under power the motor wants to pivot about the drive shafts. That takes load off of the lower mounts and more downward force on the 901 ears. Downshift and you get the opposite, down on the motor and up on the transaxle mounts. The 901 ears may have very little static load but under hard driving may take a beating. Braking may also push the motor forward and down about the lower mounts. With all that said, if an upper transaxle mount was horizontal it should better control loads under the torque of the motor. Am I over thinking it? Missing something? The way Subaru hung the motor or at least they way we 914 guys are doing it, just seems strange. Anyway, with the upper mount, I would be able to pull the transaxle without touching the motor.

Hey Mike and Mark, I was at Hershel's (nineonefoursix) yesterday so we popped the hood and scratched our heads as we tried to figure it out. It won't help w/ torsional loads (at engine centerline) and not much vertical load (hanging) either. The connector between the tranny and firewall is like our bumper "dog bone" but elongated and will twist with little effort. It is angled down and aims at the front bumper. Makes me wonder if it is a brace for 4 wheeling when you are at an extreme downhill attitude. ?? The main reason I haven't (notice I didn't say didn't) run a brace from the firewall to engine is that I am not sure where one would connect to the front area of the engine. I haven't seen any suitable attach points on the engine itself. Not what I would consider load bearing points anyway. Next time I have it out I will check closely. Maybe a boss in that area that could be tapped?? I also considered connecting the cross brace with the firewall to cut down on for/aft movement but the tranny attach point is solid and should keep the engine combo in check when braking hard. In other words; I have no idea what I'm doing and time will tell.

In the first iteration of my car we used the 901 transmission, and my son broke one of the transmission mounting ears drag racing. Power shift, boom. After it was fixed I removed the engine cover and you could see the engine twist under load. For the second iteration with the Subaru transmission we used a pretty substantial urethane mount at the rear of the transmission that seems to have effectively eliminated torsional twist and any other movement. No problems so far and the poor car has been severely thrashed by a whole bunch of different people. Well, maybe not "thrashed" exactly, better to say "tested".

By the way, the other thing we did with the second iteration was change the intercooler location from the top of the engine compartment to a water-air at the front of the car. The engine cover was off so we could experiment with air flow, to see if we could make intercooler work there. I never saw how, so we changed it from the engine cover to the front of the car, where Porsche located their oil coolers. I sincerely doubt you could make a radiator located there cool the car, no matter what engine. I'm curious, but doubtful enough myself that I'd prefer someone else did the experimentation. So I could just watch.

Hey DB. I've read your thread a-z several times. I may know it better than you. I've stolen some of your idea's and as soon as I get my exhaust started I can begin stealing your shift set up, too. Emulation being the sincerest form of flattery Hopefully I won't twist the Suby Trans off it's mount. I liked your trans mount but didn't want to source that urethane mount. That is probably a 'stock" item for a fabricator but not your average shade tree guy so I stayed with factory rubber mount. I hope it's strong enough. I won't being driving mine as hard as you. If it ever actually becomes drivable I want to "bum" someones GoPro and watch what goes on in the engine compartment. OT: I saw a film of a Lycoming under load and I wished I hadn't. I'm with you on cooling up front in the undisturbed air. I've read too many threads where others have failed. I think Chris even gave up on cooling his N/A engine back there.

Kent,

A quick search for that top mount got me this quote:
"The Subaru Pitch Control Mount is found under the factory top-mount intercooler (installation is simple) between the fire wall and the front end of the transmission. The pitch mount is designed to produce crisper gear shifts by preventing the front end of the transmission from pitching up or down, forward and back."


http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http:/...ved=0CDIQrQMwAg

Why thanks. You're right, those urethane mounts were in a box of miscellaneous stuff under the bench and I don't know where they came from originally. Sorry.

I swear that cable shifter is the best thing ever invented by man. If you want me to take clearer photos with a ruler held up for scale let me know. To repeat what I told Ian, when you make your shifter you really need to do it with the idea of duplicating it later for others. And not just for Subaru transmissions, if you modified the transmission end to fit tail and side shifters I'm pretty sure you'd have something every 914 owner would want. Especially those poor tail shifter folk.

Since it's early and all, I''ll go ahead and answer for Kent....YES PLEASE! Pics with a ruler would be awesome! Need to get my cables ordered so it would be great to understand how to measure for them...

Hi,

I've been following this great thread for a while in preparation of my Suby conversion, lurking in the sidelines so to speak, as I'm still just in the very early stages of body prep.. But I've seen your shifter vid DB and that thing is a work of art!..would love to know the specs so I can, well, copy it basically!! So I second Chris's enthusiasm..

Cheers, Ollie.

Me Three!

How's it going Kent? Still waiting on trans parts?

Yes, but that's not a real hold up. The last few days it's been the Wx. Too damned hot! The exhaust is the hiccup that's keeping me off the shifter build. I need to transition from oval to round tube within a limited space. It should begin a cool down later this week then I'm back into the electrical. I'm teetering between going full Suby electrical vs. a splice in, now. If in reality, I can shave several month's build time by using the 914's wiring where possible, I think I should. That and all my existing wiring is really primo. At this stage in life I shouldn't buy green bananas much less get into some lengthy project that might not be completed because of some unforeseen future medical issue. How's things on your end??

Speaking of unforeseen medical issues I'll still get you the shifter photos, I've just wrenched my back and can't get to the car. So a little longer. Or maybe better pills.

Hey DB, glad you posted. I forgot to mention; go ahead and post them here. I'm a little ways out on this and I know Chris and some others are awaiting some direction re: this. Take care of that back. BTDT.

with taking care of your back and with wanting pics of your shifter!

I'm waiting for another intake to come in...should be here next week. Engine is too far forward to use the stock one, plus I don't like it because it's a massive piece of plastic. It was a pain to find a substitute because very few cars have a split dual "snorkel" intake. Mitsubishi 3000GTVR4 if anyone else has the problem.

I decided to splice into the 914 harness. If your 914 wiring is in good shape it will save you a lot of time and energy. With the SVX you just separate the engine and body harnesses and splice into the 914 harness at the former relay board connection (you don't need the board any more, just splice into the 14 pin harness. At Jeff Bowlsby's site you can see how simple the wiring is:

Connector Map

You use the Subie fuel pump relay and ignition relay. I can send you some links when you get closer.

Sorry to hear about the back DB! We'll wait for you. There are enough great pics of your setup out there already for me to start looking for mounting brackets.

Outfront has the exhaust flanges in stock. The rest is pretty easy. I'll send a link on how I did mine as soon as I get home.
Heres some pictures from the RS25 site.
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Bob

Thx Bob, I did buy the flanges on your suggestion. I took them to a muffler fab shop and but it stopped there. I'll use your pic's and show them to the muffler guy. What size should I run? 1 1/2"?? Just came in from the mental gauntlet called the harness.

After a few temper tantrums, lots of cussing and bit of whining I think I've got this whittled down to a manageable size. A few more wires to trace out, test fit, trim, etc. It's one of those 95% complete and 95% to go, things.

The first trimming

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This was the first pile culled

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Got tired of scrubbing the garage floor with my knees so I went vertical. Here is the final few pieces hung and ready to plunder.

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A closer look

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and a close of the other side

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Here it is completely scalped a few hours later.

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A closer look w/ all components, I think

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And the bone yard. Might be a few bucks scrape here.

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