Not really my idea on the louvers. It was d914's but he put them on the hood.Wished I had a picture of D914 car with the hood louvers but I'm out of the country now and not at home.
I have planned to use them in the floor if needed on my LS3 car.


Bob

I'm liking that! Has 30 louvers VERY close together...and you can buy another smaller panel if need be. Definitely something to consider. Thank you Geoff.

Specs:

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Here is a pic of Greg's car:

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It looks like he used those hot rod panels. Looks cool.

I did, and I have a reverse view, very open, and should cause a draw of air flow out

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Great thread for the Subie guys! I’ve been following Kent’s build for several months now and your louvered front trunk floor has raised some questions for me and my Subaru conversion. First I’m not even close to buying my motor and tranny for my car at this point; I want to sort out the suspension and other components before I dive into the actual conversion. My question is my 914 had A/C and I wanted to use the opening in the floor to allow the air to flow out through that opening. I was thinking to screen it and then shroud the radiator so the air flowed down and out the opening. My concern is that I’d be putting too much air under the car and affecting the down force. I plan on using this car as driver with an occasional autocross if I feel the need. Sounds like most of you have been around the block with these conversions and wanted your opinions.
Sorry Kent I’m not trying to hijack your tread, I just know a lot of Subie guys are reading it.

Thanks,
Brent

Talk with Ross (Rnellums here), he did exactly that and I think it is working great for him. There have been discussions re: this style install and it's effect upon high speed handling but I believe most of this information is either hear say or conjecture as there aren't enough similar conversions that use this method to draw any concrete conclusions. Personally, I cannot speak to this as my top speed (on 10 yr old tires) has only been 105mph, thus far. Once it has new tires I should be able to comment with some reservations. FWIW, I believe one could retain 60% of their front trunk space by using this fan install method coupled with some 5" sub-floor design that would also serve as the ducting to floor vented fan. Did you start a thread for us to follow, yet?

Kent,
Did you remove the clutch return spring from the peddle assembly?
I am pre-installing everything now, it seems like the clutch peddle would need a very light spring the other way, if anything?

Removed. Not necessary! Overkill run a muck.

You can either add a spacer or just unclip it like I did (after pounding the sh*(t out of my roll pin). I'm just going to cut the hooks off when I take mine apart again to paint it.

Chris, use the spacer or carry a spare spring in case that one breaks. If that clutch tube slides to either side the clevis fitting will bind and begin to wear.

I Haven't noticed the front end getting light from venting through the floor, but I'll let you know after my track day this weekend (i should be hitting 115 mph easily). I have noticed that I seem to run out of gear though with stock profile tires. At 105-110 I seem to be getting pretty close to the redline in 5th. I've got my prototype front ducting setup now and essentially have a full front trunk worth of space (spare in trunk).

I'll be eager to hear how it does for you this weekend. Do you have any pictures of your front trunk set-up?

Thanks,

I noticed my Subie is out of revs around 118 or so- sounds like you have the same trans as mine. And yes, pictures please! Seeing your setup gave me lots of ideas and now you've run out of room?!

I'm surprised you're all done so soon. I've been told my car goes... um... quite a lot faster than that, and I know was still pulling very hard at 109 in the quarter.

Using the stock ECU what is the rev limiter set at? I have my Megasquirt set for a soft limit at 7K.

THe stock EZ30D is at 6500 RMP. It is still pulling hard headed towards redline. The transmission is out of a 2001 2.5 RS (final drive is 4.11) which I believe has the tallest gears. I could always go to a larger profile tire. I'll update some pics of my front trunk in my thread tonight.

I'm glad this came up. I will need some new tires to replace these 10 yr old's. I'd like taller tires to improve the usefulness of 1st gear. What tall tires sound good. I'm running 4 bolt wheels so I might be limited. Suggestions?

4 bolt wheels, tall tires sound good
So, you thought you were all done?

See if you can get some 205/65x15s ... you may need to roll the rear fender lips though

Before I flared my car, my current front tires (225 x 50 x 16) were in the back.
It took a lot of rolling but I really did like the look. They were 5 lug but you can fit quit a bit in the back before you have to flare.
With the original 4 lug wheel and tires, I remember a lot of tire spin. With the 6 and no turbo, how does it feel now?

I always planned on keeping the 4 bolt wheel pattern. It's part of the "bait".


I'm running 205/60/15's currently. Embarrassed to say but I never learned the new tire sizing thing. What exactly is the difference between the two, Mark?


I don't have that info yet Mike. No tire spins until I can magnaflux my home made engine cradle. That will be another 30 hr's TT from now. But to answer your question, I'm pretty sure it will spin anything I can bolt to my current set up.

My understanding was that you were planning on stock offset wheels and retaining the narrow body characteristics. That's why I said 205/65-15s. I apologize if I'm preaching to the choir, but here goes:

The first # (205) is the tread width (the higher the #, the wider the tire is). In this case, a 205 is a nominal 8" width.

The second # (65) is the aspect ratio, or 'profile' (the higher the # the taller the tire is).


The stock OEM 914 tires were 165SR15, which were actually 165/80-15 (6.5" wide and 25.4" diameter). 205/65-15s are only slightly taller (25.5" diameter) than the stock tires but 1.5" wider (8").

205/65-15s are roughly 3% taller than the 205/60s you're currently running, so they're pretty close to stock height.

You can get away with wider tires (maybe 215) if you have a lower profile, but you may have rubbing issues, especially during hard cornering at speed. Also, the lower the aspect ratio, the higher RPM you're running at highway speeds.


Here's the tire size calculator I've been using for years: (Tacoma World Tire Size Calculator) ... There's also one on 914 World as well, but I haven't been able to get it to work for me ... (Click here)

205/65 would be pretty fat and wide, I might be worried about rubbing (that's the weirdest thing I have typed in a while). 195/65 is very close to the original (tall) stock. Every brand is different though so check a few out unmounted before you get them installed.

Speaking of louvers

Check out what I got done today:

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other noises

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Found the NICEST guy who punched some more louvers in my PM panel. He owns a one-man hot rod shop about 50 miles outside of the Chicago area (but 100 miles from me). Was doing some beautiful cars. All 1920's to 1940's stuff. His metal skills were amazing. Of course I left my phone in the car so no pics there . Went from 16 to 40 total in a ~ 12.5 inch x 18 inch area. I also like the fact that the more concentrated ones are towards the back where most of the air will be exiting.

He said he would be willing to do more panels so maybe I'll do a group thing if there's a demand. Could probably do it for not much more than a Patrick panel but with about 3X the louvers.

OK Kent, I have 40, 4" x .25" louvers, what's my total exit flow area now? Am I at 2:1 if I cut the front out like yours but maybe not the upper bumper part? Just cut the holes into one big hole?

Edit: Duh, it's 40 square inches...I'll measure the inlet...probably NOT 2:1 but if I shroud it hopefully we'll be OK.

That panel gives you ~40sq inches. If your cut out is like mine (3.5" x 18") your inlet will equal 63". I've read but not confirmed that our target area for the outlet should = 1.7 x the inlet area.
63 x 1.7 = ~107 sq inches.
-40 sq inches
67 sq inches
So, if that 1.7 factor is correct you'll need another 67 sq inches. That being said, there are at least 5 unknowns that come to mind. First, is 1.7 factor an arbitrary number reached by someone? Was that figure for a LS1, 350 CI block, a 4 cyl Suby, a Ford 6 cylinder and so on? Where was that person's inlet and outlets located? What effect does hose size or routing have on this formula? Secondly is the location/placement of the outlets/louvers. IOW, are we placing the louvers in the lowest pressure area? The style of bumper that we use will greatly effect this location as well. I would think the louvers are most effective close behind the bumper where they ride in an relatively undisturbed slipstream. I suspect the air becomes quite scattered the further back one goes, which I'm sure has it's effect upon how efficient these louvers will be.
FWIW my total outlet area = 61 sq inches. So by following that formula I am 46 sq inches short or appx 43% undersized. As you know (Chris and I compare notes on a very regular basis), I'm very close, if not "at" the correct amount.
Alas, we may all be on our own until we standardize these installations and I don't see that happening unless people are willing to duplicate someones "correct" build.
I wish one of our AE's here was water cooled and could put the slide rule to this. A wind tunnel or raised flat bed truck + a 914 + some streamers and smoke pens would give the visual reference that my dumb ass would need.

Well I'm not sure if this will be enough but I'm planning to start by just cutting the holes up front into one big hole, so that's 2x18". Gives me 36 square in, 40 square out. If that proves to be inadequate I can cut out a section of the inner part of the bumper reinforcements. Definitely can get to 2:1 that way. I ordered the Renegade valance that looks like it scoops air in pretty well and then plan to make a ducting system like Ross's to push it back out. I think it will work fine.

I like it! Looks like that shape will give you a nice low pressure area beneath the louvers, also.

Yeah I called in last week to order it and the VERY nice person on the phone said "Hi this is Melba! How can I help you????" I thought...Melba...how do I know that name....hmmmm...don't know anyone who lives in Vegas....after a while I realized it was Toast from the BBS! Too funny.

Toast is good people. Well, my Speedo died yesterday but no biggie. It's new. I had done a quick patchwork at the gage area that needed to be corrected. I wired in a 12v power outlet but it's not installed on the gage face plate yet. The CEL is also back there and waiting to be installed. Obviously I need to make another piece of the burled aluminum for the base plate. It will glue on the piece of plywood with a new shift boot. Use your imagination! Outside of the Burled Aluminum trim, it came out remarkably stock in appearance which is exactly what I had wanted.
Gone are the A/F gage, oil pressure gage, fuel pressure gage. One vacancy will be filled with the seat heater switches another with a courtesy lite and the 3rd hole with the 12v power receptacle. All of my ancient carpet was rejuvenated for $13 worth of Dupli Color Vinyl, Fabric and Carpet spray paint. Doesn't leave the carpet feeling stiff either. It does require vacuuming just like regular carpet though. Anybody notice the missing radio? Not me. I can listen to that 6 all day long. The stereo is last on my list.

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My fans are now working off the ecu but I'll be damned if I know why. Let me go back to the beginning. I've always been mindful of over heating the engine so I let the engine get to 3/4 (on the factory gage) of the way HOT (normal is 1/2) and I would check each of the 3 wires coming from the ECU for continuity. They provide the ground to the relay that controls that fan. I never got continuity on any wire or any combination of those 3 wires. Last week after some testing I forgot to remove the jumper that ran from the low speed wire to the 3 wires twisted together. (Previously I had jumped the low speed wire to ground when needed. Which was when I saw temps climb past 1/2 way on the gage.) Anyway I came home and thought I heard the fans spooling down when I shut it off. Turned the key back on and nothing. OK, I was hearing things. Next nite same thing so I made a note to check the fans before shutting it down the next day. Sure enough the next day I pull into the garage and with the engine running I feel air sucking in the inlet. Pop the hood and the fans are running. And within 30 seconds they shut down and gage was below 1/2.
For the life of me I cannot explain this sequence. Possibly the ECU looks at that connection before needing it and writes it off if it's not there. And why would it not connect after temps went passed 1/2 And to confuse matters further, guess when the fans come on? At the 1/2 mark! Way cooler than I expected. I never thought to check for signals at that temp. As long as they work and the engine is happy, I'm good. In the coming weeks I plan to delete 1 wire at a time from the bunch of 3 to determine what does what. I suspect 1 wire will be common to the other 2 and those 2 will be hi & lo. Well see. 700+ miles and counting.

Sounds like your airflow is pretty good!

I finally did some work on Kugel today. I've been having so much fun that I put this off until now. I hadn't wired my backup lights into the conversion yet so today (ahem, after a spirited run earlier )I found the last relay removed from the donor car and used it with the tranny switch on the ground side of the relay. The Subaru switch is the same plunger style switch as the 901.
Here is the relay (blue)mounted and wired up

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Key on and I have reverse lights again. This winter I need to wire up my neutral switch, too.

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I reinstalled the rain tray and guess what; it fits!

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It's been a few months since my last post. The car now has about 2700 miles and most of that has been uneventful, which is a good thing. Items have been a rear brake line that leaked because I forgot to tighten it. That took 7 months to show up. The right headlamp power plug became disconnected because I ran the lead incorrectly and it would pull off when the lamp rotated. The horn took on a life of it's own till I discovered the warped rubber puck under the horn button. And one chaffed radiator hose that I carelessly installed.
This weekend at Rt66 the temp went up on me at 2700 ASL and I had to pull over for a few minutes then continued on with out incident. I caught it early and the engine didn't get heat soaked. I had been hammering it! OAT was increasing in Palm Springs. I had the RPM's in the 4-5K range and was pumping water too quickly thru my single pass radiator. Climbed another 3500' that day w/o incident but I kept the power setting at a sane level.
What I learned from this is that I'm "Border Line" on my cooling. I need a 2 or 3 core radiator. I plan on adding A/C and want to be able to drive in the summer, thru Vegas with A/C blasting. So, I will document that here once I install another radiator.
Mike Wills was nice enough to bring a windshield to Rt66 from AZ, Thx again Mike. So yesterday afternoon I removed my old sandblasted windshield. I was afraid of running into rust issues with < than a month before WCR15 but decided to just go for it and was pleasantly surprised. A surface rust area the size of a dime on the lower right corner and a slightly larger area on the left lower corner but it too is just surface rust. I Ice Picked the Hell out of it. All of the holes for the plastic rivets are true and no rust on any of them. I need to get a roll of Butyl Tape, a seal for the dash to windshield, clean and prime the channel then slap it in.

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Check out the dirt. No wonder they hold moisture in this area.

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The old seal removed. The shit was so hard a cat couldn't scratch it!

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L&R lower corners. This is a bad as it gets.

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These 2 pic's show the general condition of the channel. I'm a lucky man.
I won't bore anyone with the install. That ones been done already.

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Finally! Two weeks in the garage but the new windshield is water tested and installed. I need new wiper blades to complete. New tires will be in this week so they will get mounted on the new Fuch's. Follow up with good cleaning and she'll be ready for WCR15.

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Lugs nuts all prettied up

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Nice! I bet it's like you don't even have a windshield in. Clear as a bell. I like the way yours is evolving. You're using it and just making little changes here and there. 2700 miles...of

Your so right, Chris. I drove facing into the sun yesterday and it was as clear as a bell. I finally got around to getting some tires mounted on the Fuch's I bought from Larmo. I went with 195/65's, which are larger than the 165/80's I had on there. Meet Mr. Inertia. I can feel it when accelarating or coasting. Also the break is MUCH more pronounced than previously. When it broke loose with the small tires you could feel it coming on early. More tire, more grip. As you can see in the pic's, there is very little difference in diameter's.

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And when I replaced the windshield I also replaced the vinyl and pad. I used Mark's product (914rubber.com) and was impressed. The foam is different in structure but I love the substantial "feel" it lends to the installation plus it is easy to install. Just lay it out, weigh it down then trace out the cut lines by pressing down on the foam against the raised steel edges. In the pic's you can see where I pressed down to reveal the cut lines then followed up with the felt tip. I cut the vinyl using the old piece as a template then stuffed the edges in with a slim flat piece of metal. (It's really a chip chaser but worked great. It's the one with the green handle) Now I need the new dash that Mark is making along with a carpet kit and the interior will be finished. When I say finished, I mean that in the Mike Bellis sense!

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Next I added a bit more Dynamat to the interior firewall and on the gas tank bulkhead.

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And then to TOP everything off (punn intended) I added these little topper from Mikey

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Looking good bud! Can't wait for the new Dashes from 914 rubber. Long time in coming those .

Me too, Jamie. But we've waited this long; what's a few month's? Mark took on a huge project that has "someone else" pulling his hair out I'll bet Mark will get it right before he starts taking money. Harumfff! And speaking of waiting. I've treated Kugel as if he were my Red Headed step child for far too long. That being said; something I've lusted over too many times. Proper mirrors. Only one question, though. Do I need to by a Rolex and leather jacket to "rub elbows" with this Real Mirror crowd?

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And if one add CP mirrors I assume this is the next step. A real antennae.

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A couple of door switch seals.

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As long as I'm inside the door I need to start insulating and sealing things up. I'll start with the door. No room for insulation but a vapor barrier helps some.

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But I believe this will be most beneficial; .5" insulation. I didn't place any on the firewall as it would interfere with installing the back pad.

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Since I went to the trouble of pulling all of this old shit out I guess I should install some new carpet. I don't believe it appears the same colour in any of these pic's. The fit was excellent. Attaching the grommets to the posts were like stretching a gnat's ass over a rain barrel but they hold the carpet in place quite well.

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more

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And why this concern for insulation? Well it has something to do with this thing. More on this, soon.

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Nice work.

CCCCOOL

Anyone who owned a VW in the mid-late '70's might get the hidden message .

My 2nd condenser arrived this afternoon 3 days early. I ordered the 1st one too small out of ignorance. It might have been large enough but it would have chocked down the air flow to the radiator tremendously. This one is about 1.5" more narrow than my radiator. So here are some pics of my 1st test fit of the condenser.

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The compressor is ready to plumb in once I locate this 22mm suction fitting. The male one in the pic is 15mm. The suction port on the pump is 22mm. Now I need to order hose, fittings, evaporator and dryer.

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I was finally able to locate that large AC fitting, so it was time to order hose and fittings. This was 3 evenings of perusing the internet and this is what I learned. These are the type tube used; steel, aluminum, SS, barrier hose, reduced barrier hose, Aeroquip, BurgaSeal aka BurgaClip. I was attracted to BurgaSeal because of the No-tools needed but those in the know said "Forget about it"! You could go broke using Aeroquip, I can't weld SS or Al so that left me with barrier hose. The reduced barrier hose is more $$ and allows tighter turns than plain barrier hose. I've since found the plain barrier hose turns quite enough for my needs. With that choice made I am left with 2 types of fittings to choose from; Barbed or BeadLock. Again, those in the know have suggested Beadlock as it is the Industry standard. This was a good choice (that happens when you take the pro's suggestions ) as it turns out because of the big selection of fittings. I don't know from Apple Butter about AC & fumbled about trying to create an order for fittings. I finally decided to order the hose first then "discover" what fittings I will need.

This is the #10,#8 & # 6 Hose I will need.

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This is where I want to run them.

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There are two factory holes in the gussets. The upper one needs to be enlarged for the hose.

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And as you go forward the long flares out with the clam shell so it gets drilled.

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The other side of the clamshell drilled and with a hose now passing thru it.

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Then down and back under the car following the curvature of the seam. I'm holding it the way it will stay once anchored. After that it turns into the wheel well and I'll show that after the fittings arrive.

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Loosely in place you can see the Suction line hanging beneath the front of the door and the 2 lines curving around the rear and up into the engine compartment.

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Across the engine

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And then tie into these 2 lines. More in the next few days as fittings arrive.
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Watching! What are you doing to connect the old fittings to the new lines?

What exact condenser did you go with?

And where did you order the barrier hose from? Do tell

Andrew, there are couplings for this. They are called line splicers and AFAIK are available in all sizes including reducing sizes. I'll be using a variant of these which incorporates the 134 test ports for the hi/lo sides. I'm using the OEM Suby compressor but if you will have to buy aftermarket I'd recommend Sanden compressors. Great aftermarket support. Or the OEM compressor that came on your engine.


Stephan, on Ebay. IIRC, a seller named johnsjoy in Bedford, TX. He's a vet and combines orders to save on shipping. I'll post his info and the materials used a little later. BTW, your clutch plate shipped yesterday. You should have it Fri or Sat.

What does this guy think he is...a plumber or something?

Kent what are you going to control the setup with? The stock Subaru controls? Can't remember. Looking good .