I am a half-year 914 guy, the car spends a lot of time in winter storage here in Northern Michigan. I bought my 1974 1.8 in 2007, helped along by the generous advice of 914world members.

Now the Parade is only 40 miles from my house, I am thinking of entering the concours.

Immediate questions involve the completely unoriginal radio, wheels that have been repainted, and front and rear sways that I had installed when Brad Mayeur did the original work on it.

Otherwise it is a very clean car. I am wondering if I am ineligible for a "survivor" judging because of these mods?

My original thread with pics:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...c=69564&hl=

Thanks for your help.

Paul

Absolutely! If not the Preservation class, enter the Touring class. Loose the coco matts, tidy up your support material and go for it!!

What parade are you speaking of?
And when where, please?
Found it

The 58th Annual Porsche Parade
June 23-29, 2013
Grand Traverse Resort and Spa
Traverse City, Michigan

Paul,

Preservation is Survivor/Originality & is 75% original per our Zone 8 rules, which AFAIK are the same for national Parade.

This applies to paint/body trim - so replaced rubber/seals & wear items are okay in most cases, along with some paint touch-up. Tires also are wear items, but a set of 5 period correct Michelin XZX 165SR15 tubeless ones will add to your competitiveness.

And it applies to interior - so some carpet replacement - the radios were mostly all dealer or owner installed aftermarket, but you may want to find a period correct radio to swap out for competitiveness sake too.

Similarly for the engine bay & underside engine & non-engine ends/halves. Aside from cleaning up & detailing everything, look for mismatch details like one bold silver & other gold zinc plated, new vs. old period correct items. You'll just have to deal with a possible challenge or few points gigged for the sway bar addition, but maybe not!?

Your pix look great, so you'll have a shorter work list to prep, and a few local concours will help you fine tune for Parade.

While I've not been around PCA & judging long enough to have done a Parade, the guys I know who have say they're basically looking for anything to gig cars on in order to cut down the big fields in national events (vs. local & regional PCA concours).

So you'll need to prep to pristine, detail & check to exactness (local/regional usually won't look at originality items, but ask any judges there what they look for at Parade where the do judge originality), and document everything you can on your 914 - then hope you can stack up well against the other models in the running - as well as the 914s.

You should be able to find some upcoming & past Parade judges in your area to help you go over your 914.

Good Luck!
Tom
///////

Hi Paul, looking forward to seeing you at Parade & your beautiful 914.

I am also entering my 914-4 at Parade in Traverse City this year. March 12th-14th is registration day. I know my car is not in the Preservation class so I am thinking about entering in "Street" or "Restored" but don't know where I qualify???

Any advise from the 914 gallery????? Can you explain what they do in each class?? What Class???

BTW: My car was restored about (12) years ago and it has some cleaning issues to get in Parade shape. I hate cleaning so it will only get a dust & buff. I will be there for the fun with my 914 friend so it really does not matter, well a little bit.

Tom

Hey Paul!

I'd go for the Preservation class with that one.

Super detail everything, then do it again. It's fun, though it can be a little stressful if you really expect to be in the running.

Most judges of the smaller classes are not out to hammer every little nuance, but stay with the cat when it's judged. Know everything about the car and be ready if a judge asks you about originality of any items. Judges don't always know everything about these cars, though they are expected to. If they question something, respond truthfully. If you are gigged for something you know is a bogus gig, and the scoring is tight, you can protest. But you'd better be 100% certain and be able to prove it.

The last Parade I competed in I was told by an interior judge that my window cranks were non-original because they were chromed instead of black. I informed the judge that I was the original owner and that the cranks were as delivered in '72. He still gigged me anyway, and told me in no uncertain terms that he knew more than I. I had brought pics of the day I took delivery, as well as a '72 Porsche brochure, clearly showing the chromed cranks in both cases. When I showed them to him his fce got very red with anger, but removed the gig. Still lost by 0.3 points but felt better. I'll not divulge the name of the judge, but he should never have been judging 914s. When I chaired the '93 Parade Concours I made certain that people knowledgeable in the various models ONLY judged thos they knew. Unfortunately, the judging is now controlled by PCA National, and with the classes that combine models it requires judging knowledge of all models, and there very few that are capable of doing that.

Just be serious about it, and have fun at the event. Oh, and take a lot of pics!

I did the Traverse City Parade last time it was there, and rate the whole experience number 2 of my Parades - Aspen being the best.
P

" I will be there for the fun with my 914 friend so it really does not matter, well a little bit. Tom "
I like the above quote.........
have fun and let the chips fall where they may.....
don't let the "Concour Madness" get to you....
sure judges will want "Q/Tip mentality"....
have a good time with that....but to remove sways and radio change out .
IF you Really want to win this...Give John Paterek an email....he was at Keystone
did you meet him up there???
I know he will enjoy your 914 as is.... ...just know that the repaint on wheels
won't kill yah...all these Barrett Jackson cars have been restored.....
just being there is half the fun, as above quote......plus damn it is Really in your
backyard....the expense to transport is next to nil.....
your car will get plenty of Oogle's and Ah's.....
and stories will abound from onlookers...I feel that is worth more than a ribbon..
Who know's..maybe you will come away with a
Rx

If you love your car, are passionate about it, know every little detail about it, and its a driver not a garage queen and obviously well maintained you will make some judges happy.

"Transport"? Drive it!!

Nothing I hate more than completing against a car that arrived on a trailer, and especially those that travel to the event on a trailer and uploaded a few miles from the site!!!

I think it would be great if all entrants were required to drive a mandatory tour the day before the event. <grin>

Thanks for all the replies. I'll post again when I'm closer to getting it out of the winter storage garage.

I will absolutely drive it there although nothing can compare with Jafsmith driving from ?Maine? to San Diego? No Death Valley for me!

Maybe I'll go with Preservation. There's precious little that's been done to the car and under the coco mats are great carpets. I'll try to get in touch with the son of the original owner and ask him a few questions.

The sway bars are in for good, resprayed in the rear trunk after installation, and I believe the front will be harder to detect. They are original equipment, installed by Brad in 2007. Also some spray in the front compartment where someone had tried to jack the car up from the middle and the paint had peeled. I mean, what good is rust for no reason? Oh, and the engine compartment was resprayed. My original pics showed two little eyebrows of corrosion above the battery terminals.

I will show pics of the wheels. They were repainted in an off-silvery shiny color and are not appropriate. I have Fuchs alloys in decent-not-quite-concours shape that are on the car now. The steel wheels have the 165 tires, the Fuchs the 185's.

Paul

Cool Paul. I'm hoping to be there as well.

There is a slight (repeat, slight) chance that we'll stop my the Parade as oglers. Iwould really love to me the bunch of you in person.

Janice & I had such an enjoyable time at the last TC Parade. The cherries will be in season. The peninsular wineries will be ready (like a mini-Napa tour and they're pretty good), the Sleeping Bear dunes, the lake, etc, etc.

This really is a beautiful part of the country in the summer.

We'll see.

That would be cool, I'm sure a thread for a meetup will start as we draw near.

I'm pushing hard to move our summer MI trip a couple of weeks earlier just for Parade.

Sorry lost in translation...next to nil is a gallon of gas to get it there,
and one to get it back...

I entered the concours in the "touring" class.

Looks like they have "full," "touring," and "street."

So, "touring" is more of the "survival" class?

Paul

Glad you are showing it.

If my 914 looked as nice as that one, I'd show EVERY chance I got.

Don't think I am making the parade this year, but if I do I look forward to seeing your car!

Go to the Parade site and download the Parade Competion Rules, PCR's, read em and read em again. All will be revealed.

I feel a bit silly because I cannot find the competition rules. Can anyone provide a direct link please?

Paul

I'm in the middle of the registration process now as well.

I'm trying to figure out what class to put it in!?!?!

SMI - PF03F - Full-All Series Street-Modified?? HELP A NEWBIE!!!

Dunno Eric

Seems to be in a class of it's own......

Let us know how that all works out!

Eric,
Put your GT 914-6er Chrome Yellow in full restoration along with my Chrome Yellow 4-banger. I think 914-6's & 914-4's are judged together. I just want to park next to your beauty.
Tom

No direct link, go to pca.org and log in. Scroll through menu bar at top of page: Regions/Forms & Documents/ scroll down to Parade/2012 PCR's

Just pick a class that favors rear fogs!
Kidding.
I hope to be there as a spectator for a change. No competing, no judging. Relax & enjoy. Watch the judges, critique the gigs, etc. Getting too old to stress about it.

I know what James is talking about. There are teams, and I mean "teams", that "build" the cars for Parade concours, enclose trailer them to within a couple of mile of the event, & offload them as "driven to the event". Basically, they are cheaters. Lost to one of them the last time I competed. You'll never stop them, and a tour before the event won't help because they usually bring a cadre of lemmings to clean up.

Lessons to be learned are:
1. The big bucks will usually win, but not always.
2. Enjoy the event & know that you are the best prepared.
3. PCA Parade is the "bigs" for Porsches. Losing is still a cred.
4. Stick with your car when it's being judged! The judges only "think they know" everything about a 914. If Paterak is judging run away, unless you can trump him with doc's. If you really believe that a judge has made a mistake, talk to him. If you're convinced that you are right and can prove it - protest. Last resort & you will probably be labelled for it if you lose.
5. If you feel the judges are happy with your car, and that you may be in the running for a class win, or BOS, leave towels on the engine to keep ambient dust, etc. from accumulating. f you are called to move your car to a different area for re-judging DO NOT forget to remove those toels FIRST (ask me later how I know).
6. Enjoy the wonderful lunch provided. Make new buddies.

Nothing like it for a Porsche guy/gal.

I know Paterek from back in the 80's. I called him before buying my orange beauty, he used to work on my black car that Riley Rogers has now (long story).

Regarding my orange car: I sent him pics of the car before I bought it and he told me "no, it costs too much." I bought it anyway...

As far as the "trump with docs," does this mean a COA is an absolute must-have item? Bring all my receipts? How much will I get dinged for having installed sway bars that were not originally on the car?

Paul

Paul,

You MUST bring the COA! Original things like Monroney sticker would be good, but not mandatory. You will most likely get dinged for the stabilizers, but it shouldn't be huge and you can make up for the loss by super-detailing other areas.

Examples: Steam clean the carpets. I don't care how clean you think they are, you won't believe the dingy crud that is removed by steam cleaning.

Take q-tips and polish to the blades of the foglight grills. Easy, use a slow hand.

Remember those procto swabs you sent me? Use a couple to swab out the tailpipe at the event.

Use q-tips again to clean all dust/dirt from all vents, as well as the drids on the speaker grills..

Never, ever use Armorall for anything! There are good products out there (Griots) to maintain the patina of rubber parts. The bumper tops should be free of slick stuff and dimples. If they have dimples, contact Mikey.

Don't use anything but warm mildly soapy water on your seats, if they're vinyl. Keep the patina.

Jeez, the list goes on.......

COA is a must. All the original documentation and manuals that came (or should have). My Six being a Euro version, I had a two page sheet (several copies) typed up listing all the differences, with references to validate my claims, and yes it made a difference. Definitely be present when they judge, provide the lead judge with the info, and answer any and all the questions, and then step back.

It might well to have a white towel on hand to either throw into the judging ring, or cry into after they find dirt on the bottom of your door hing pin. <grin>

Some may take what James says as a joke. It is not. A PCA Parade concours is the most hardcore there is. The judges are not necessarily looking for grime, but if they find it you get gigged. It's parts of the process of saying "my car is the best". They are bound to prove you wrong, or show you where you can improve. Everything on the topside of your 914 should be perfect - focus on that! That's where you'll score the best points.
On the underside become anal after the topside is PERFECT. Clean everything you can reaxh underside. You won't get it all because your arms are shorter than the best judge ( hated being judged by Jon Lowe because he had the arms and fingers of a pianist!).

This isn't meant to be easy! Requires committment and many hours of work to be the best - but you CAN do it! Keep focused & don't let weariness get in the way. You have the car. You have the tools.
Win it!

Read through everything I could and went with Modified Touring... also read that I can change before the event. Have a call into Mike Joffee to see what he suggests.

Tom - I think I need to be in a modified class (obviously). I say we play to be on a tour together or, create one of our own. "Lunch in Leland" tour??

Pat, thanks for the inspiration.
Eric, Ferg, Tom, hope to see you guys this summer.

My COA is on order tomorrow...

Paul

Eric,
Good choice with Modified Touring class, I picked full restoration, thinking there will only be a few cars in that class. Hoping for no more than (3) cars so I can get 3rd. place. Looking forward to seeing everyone.
Tom

I'm trying to decide whether to enter mine or not. The topside is good, and the car is very original, but the underbody has scale that won't be easily remedied in time for Parade. Maybe the street class?

It is not helpful that the 2012 Salt Lake City Rules are the ones posted on the PCA site, not the new ones including the current classes for the concours. Anyone see an updated set of Concours Rules & Regs?

Paul

Just do it! You have to start sometime. You'll have fun too!

My Cert of Authenticity arrived. Man, is it underwhelming. Basically, intermittent wipers, the 1.8 liter motor, and Phoenix Red color.

Car is coming to my house next week no matter what. It's in the bubble storage right now and is 10 miles away, a muddy connecting road to the pole barn and then salty roads. The weather here has been atrocious.

BUT, my buddy has a car trailer and will ferry my car home next week if necessary. Then, I will have LOTS of posts and will ask for LOTS of advice. Thanking everyone in advance,

Paul

Paul,
You may already be anticipating this level of preparation for the Parade, but this was typical "get-ready" prior to display at the concours location...........

....and......

...and .......(this was Pat Garvey when he had a 914 that truly ran and that he really cared about)

Thanks for the inspiration! I hope to put up some pics in the next week.

Paul

Guess I have a trailer queen. I am looking at the (finally) published rules. I thought Preservation was Preservation but there's a "low mileage" preservation group! And to make it worse, I'm in with the 356 and 911 people!!

Check it out:

"Preservation Group (Divisions 1 – 5) – This group is
for automobiles 21 model years or older and reasonably
driven. Emphasis is on preservation of the automobile,
maintained in its original condition. A
demerit is to be given for automobiles not driven to
the Parade. In addition, judging of automobiles in
this group will take into account the overall “utilization”
of the Porsche as intended by the Porsche factory.
Ownership and preservation of an automobile
with reasonable mileage shall be considered superior
to an automobile simply “stored” to avoid usual wear
encountered from normal use. Proof of authenticity
such as Kardex (build data sheet), Certificate of
Authenticity or original Monroney Label (window
sticker) is required for the automobile to be judged
and will be examined by the judges. Other documentation
may be used as proof of authenticity if, in the
opinion of the judges, such documentation substantiates
the automobile’s authenticity. In the case of
two automobiles being equal in the opinion of the
judges, length of ownership will be considered. The
judges rating for the chassis (if judging is requested)
will not be altered due to the presence of fresh road
dirt or signs of recent use.
(b.1) Preservation Group (Division 6) – Judging for
this division is to be the same as C-5.1.(b) except
that the judges are not to penalize the automobile
for not being driven to the Parade. This division
is for automobiles with less than an average of
1000 miles per model year age of automobile. No
penalties will be given for the low odometer
mileage or for the fact that these automobiles are
basically non-driven and mostly stored."

So, in trying to decipher the rules, there are "Classes" for "low mileage" vehicles. Mine has just under 25000 miles.

Classes: PS08T 1949 - 1976 356, 912, 911, 914 (all)

Then, there are six "Divisions," one of which is for the 914:

Divisions: PIV All 914 including Limited Production

It's like the animal kingdom phylum and class and genus and species, etc.

There are four Groups under which fall the Divisions followed by the Classes.

I am confused!

Paul

I too would be confused, baffled and bewildered by the various and sundry classes, divisions, and groups that the rules attempt to catagorize. Me thinks that the folks who write the federal tax laws are somehow involved here Good luck, Paul.

Paul

Safe in the bubble, I deflated it and uncovered it today. Still too much snow and wet outside to drive it home.



The bag is deflated...



Paul

The Certificate of Authenticity makes no mention of a radio, which I believe is common as many were dealer installed. Whoever installed my radio used a non-original antenna. And then they tightened it too much. So under the wide cup against the fender is a small non-progressive crack in the paint. A standard (Hirschmann) lets you see the crack so I've left this antenna on.



But a bigger issue is the radio. It is an awful, awful Kenwood removable face monstrosity.



I have an original style radio that I could install but it only has one wire coming out of the back...

How about a radio delete filler for the dash and hope no one notices the speakers or antenna? (just kidding)

I will post the radio later...

Paul

Actually my radio thread is here:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=109964

Paul,
I bought my late 72 with no radio from the factory, yet it had the speaker grills (no speakers) in place. Bought speakers & a Blaupinkt Frankfurt from Crutchfield. You probably know that I never drilled for an antenna, but it worked fine with a windshield antenna.
Point is, I would give more work into cleaning/detailing other areas. Radios from the era could be anything - forget it as long as it is "period correct". These cars were a constantly changing beast until late 74.
Have you addresed the interior edges of your front door jambs? Make certatain that there is no wax residue - that's why Q-tips were invented I think.

So I brought my car into the local guru of paint to have my car professionally buffed and waxed. I bought a PorterCable orbital about four years ago and did it myself but still had some tiny starburst looking random scratchy spidery lines in the paint.

I would like to say that my car is beautiful and does not in any way need a new paint job, at least in my eyes. And unless you are looking closely at 6" or less, you really do not see flawed paint. BUT I was hoping some of the swirly marks would disappear.

Anyway, my guy is upset because he buffed the back trunk and was not able to improve the appearance. He was afraid he'd go through the paint!

1. I'm not gonna get out the orbital but I am interested in the latest and greatest product for our cars with original paint. Is there some special nanotechnology shine substance I can use before the Parade?

2. He said the paint back in the day was "thin." Is this true? I remember in 1974 I hand buffed through the paint on my 1971 Signal Orange car...

3. He also said the car did not have enamel paint. I always thought it was enamel?

Thanks,

Paul

PS I will get rid of all the wax, Pat!!!

The literature says it is enamel, it looks like enamel, and is single stage (no clear coat). Its also likely to be thin after 40 years. The paint detailing gurus have a special gun that will tell them the mil thickness of paint, you need to find someone like that. Paint thins over time by oxidization and wear and you may not have much thickness to buff out. Have it checked to be sure.

Thanks Jeff. He used his photo spectrometer thingy to match some touchup paint for me, so I know he has equipment. Never thought to ask about how thick my paint is.

A buddy of mine has mentioned Swissvax, some incredibly expensive stuff for paint care. Back in the day, Zymol was the best. But I'm still wondering about some of the newer compounds that might "fill in" or make imperfections less noticeable.

Maybe just clay followed by wax?

That Porsche ad is great, by the way. Especially the zinc part. Zinc my eye, these cars are famous for rust!!!

Paul

I don't think its a spectrometer, its a digital paint film thickness gauge.

That 'ad' above is the backside of the 914 car colors brochure.

You might look into 'glaze' products in the car care section, I understand this product is used to fill in minor scratches, then wax over that. Meguiars website has some helpful paint care processes/products - I bet the other major mfrs' do too.

He used the spectrometer to mix up some touchup paint. I need to ask him if he measured the paint thickness.

Any ideas on best wax products? I think Zymol has one for red cars??
I think I should just go ahead and clay the paint followed by a wax.

Paul