My #3 Cyl. is squeezing air out on it's compression stroke. Valve's are moving fine and closing. I re-torqued the head, actually all three on that side. I loosend them all then torqued again. All of the nuts tighten down just fine, however when I loosen one of them it feels like the stud is spinning with the nut. I have the carb and headers off right now too.

When it happend, the engine was making a slight cherping sound, but only under load. I thought it was an intake leak. Then as I was climbing a hill near home, engine under load, something just let go. It turned from a cherp into a loud puff, puff, puff...and now always, not just loaded.

I have no experience with pulled head studs, so I don't know what to look/listen for. But I would imagine that pulled stud wouldn't be able to tighten down again.??

Any one have any ideas? - Any six experts in Santa Clarita want to come over for a beer tomorrow?
-Mike D.

You retorqued the heads with the engine in the car?

I've never tried that, but I think it would be very difficult. What size engine is it? Did you remove the head nut from the stud you suspected was turning?

You got that stud to take full torque?

It sounds like a pulled stud or blown head gasket to me (hopefull the latter).

And, if you relieved torque on heads with gaskets, there's a good chance they won't reseat.

Yep, engine is still in the car, I was able to get to all 12 bolts no problem, engine is a 2.2.

I did not completely remove the nut I suspected of turning the stud. I was afraid that if I got it out I would never get it back in. Guess it wouldn't have mattered at that point... I was able to torque it to 30 lbs. +. after it didn't seal the first time I went around and wrenched them down some more.

I'm turning the engine with starter, btw...

I didn't think you could blow a head gasket on a six, aren't they copper?

-Mike D.

In a 2.2, it's a copper crush-ring arrangement. It's rare for them to fail, but it is possible. I'm mostly concerned that you loosened the heads. It could have moved slightly and not reseated, making the problem worse.

Regardless, it sounds like that side will need to come apart.

However, without seeing it in person, there's no real way I could diagnose the problem.

Sure, lots of ideas. First thing is do a compression check....if you find a loose sparkplug, you can quit there Otherwise, report back.

BTW: when loosening a stud nut ( or trying to) on an old motor, it's not uncommon for the stud to back out. If it takes the torque, all is well.

Oh, where's Santa Clarita?

I'll be in Santa Monica tomorrow. I could look at it tomorrow afternoon, if you could pick me up.

I'm north of Santa Monica, 30-40 min. drive...How much time do you have?

Of course, he's totally right. You did check the plugs, didn't you?

I'll get in about noon and will be free for the rest of the afternoon, but will need to be back in Santa Monica tomorrow night.

...Santa Monica Airport.

yeah, plugs have been checked... <_<
Are you a pilot?
If your serious I'll come get you!
not too familiar with SM airport, what terminal?

Yes, I'm totally serious. Yes, I'm a pilot.

It would be really nice to spend the afternoon with a club member and his car.

Here's a map:

http://www.supermarine.com/c-sm.htm

My phone number is 505-301-5657

Cool, I'll head that way to put me at the airport around 12:15, and I'll ring your cell.
See ya then.

Excellent.

When you turn into the airport from 28th (it doesn't look like you're turning into an airport), go straight until it comes to a 'T'. Turn left and look for the parking lot almost immediately on the right with an attendant sitting under an umbrella. Tell him you're there to pick up a passenger and then park. The entrance to the terminal is on the side of the building, next to the parking lot.

My phone doesn't work great in that area, but I'll try to stay outside. I'm 35, medium build, red hair and will be wearing my 914world.com hat.

Oh, PM me a phone number and description, so I know how to reach you.

PM'd you...I'll also have my club hat on, easy identifier...
cell - 818-720-5285

Well, now that you mention the "b" word, I'm there. I'm in N.Y. Kidding. I'm in Santa Clarita. Let me know when you're back from the airport, Bryan 661 251-2769. Curiuos though, you say that you tightened "all 3" on that side. There should be 4 per cyl. Where did Mr. 4 go??

Want to extend a hearty thanks to Mike for picking me up from the airport today. On an afternoon trip all around the San Fernando valley, I saw more 914s than I've seen in the last two years combined (7).

After a close look at the engine in question, we agree that the #3 head will need to come off.

Here's Mike resigning himself to that conclusion:

And this was a treat, a shortened type 3 in baja style:

Just out of curiosity, where's the leak?

More importantly, where wasn't it:

Not the valves or spark plug. It's difficult to prove with the engine assembled, but we did a compression test and had a close look at everything. After a protracted discussion of the possibilities, we agreed the head should probably come off. Compression was 55 psi versus 120 for the others.

Cranking the engine on the starter, with the other plugs out, carbs removed and exhaust removed produces a very noticable hissing sound which coincides with the compression stroke for that cylinder. The hissing sound seems to come from the head/cylinder junction, but I admit that's a subjective assessment.

Yeah....55 is not a gud number.

You can verify the leak at the head/cyl juncture with a soap/water mix sprayed on....after the shroud is off.....bubbles are a clue.

I agree, but he wasn't ready to pull the shroud today.

Yep, it was all bad! Except hanging out with Joe all day. Thanks for Lunch, Joe.

I was planning to just pull the engine and get to work but that soap and water idea sound interesting. It is definatly leaking though. It would just prove to me that I'm done for now...I do need to paint the engine bay, and dress the wire harness, and.. and...and...well, you know how that goes. I was just having so much fun driving it.

Thanks again Joe for confirming my nightmare - here's to next time when you can stay longer We'll have to get some of the other out for a run!

BRP914 - Where are you? I see 914's all over Santa Clarita but I can't get anyone to come out and play, ha

I'll post some pics or progress while I'm at it...

-Mike D.

If your engine is 2.0, or 2.2 based on a 2.0, I have a spare set of fresh heads. I'm in Santa Clarita.

2.2 six cyl. And hopefully nothing is wrong with heads...

I'm in Saugus off Seco Canyon and Pamplico...

Yeah, hopefully nothing wrong with your motor - just fyi. There's a guy advertising a 3.0 on ebay in Santa Clarita, but I think cis is too pc for an orig. 6. I'm looking into mfi. Are you familiar with pmo carbs? Are they any better than webers?

Not an original six, It's a '74 so a 3.0 would be great, prolly can't afford it though. I have seen and talked to guys using PMO Carbs and they love them. I'll stick to my Webbers for the cost. If I was to spend $2500 I'd go with a tunable EFI set up.

Going to e-bay now

$2500 for a efi? My Clewett catalog lists a Tec3 "basic" (whatever that is) kit for $5600. Plus tax. Plus dyno time. Too much for my Sunday afternoon cruiser. I'm hoping to get a mfi going for $2500 or so. I thought about the 3.0, but then you're looking at re-doing a 915, ext oil cooler, exhaust, axles, etc. Too much.

I'd like to hear how you resolve your situation.

bmp914,

It's my understanding that PMO has duplicate exactly what Weber has but PMO has done some serious improvement that runs and tunes much easier than Weber. They also modify the fuel bowl area to eliminate the "dead" or "flat" spot known as fuel starvation when corner hard. That probably justify the price of PMO.

As for EFI, there are other units that are cheaper than what Clewet offers however, theirs maybe a very complete set up while you might to source parts to finish the job if you had bought a unit other than Clewet's. I just got Megasquirt kit and am gonna try this unit since there are members here tinking with it now. That would be my advantage to learn and make a good use of resource here. Kit Carson kit sounds very attractive but I ain't gonna sit on my ass and wait for them to cough it out on the market when I need one NOW!

Do some research and you'll be amaze what's out there.

j