I am seriously contemplating a V8 conversion for my project and I am in the bodywork phase right now, so I figure if I'm going to put a rad in the car I might as well do it now. However, I am also concerned about loosing too much trunk space and/or the spare tire. I'd like to use the car as 'week-ender' to drive up and back to the cottage, perferably with a passenger, so some luggage space would be nice.

I was reading a post by Special K about V8 Radiator Venting and Tom73 mentioned an idea that no one responded to about tilting the rad back and venting with the help of some duct work through the floor. He thought it might still save enough room in the front for the spare (therefore leaving the rear trunk available for luggage).

To take this idea one step further, why not lie the rad on the floor (horizontally), or with a slight tilt, and duct the air to it. The rad would lie directly on top of the vent hole and would be very easy to vent. It appears like you could do this in the space previously occupied by the spare tire and the upper portion of the front trunk could then hold the spare (plus overflow container and some hoses).

I'm no engineer or aerodynamicist, so I need someone to explain the pitfalls to me. Are there coolant flow problems associated with a non-vertical rad? Is there a problem ducting air to a rad vs. ducting it away? Anything I'm not considering?

Feedback would be nice, but I don't want to hear, "Just do it the old way because it is easier." I would like some thoughtful critisism or ideas (or actual knowledge) on this subject. "There are no problems, just solutions."

it's been done before and it does work, however, the traditional method works as well if not better......if you do go that route, run "puller" type fans (yes, 2).....

for the standup radiators, the inflatable spares fit perfect...

the few people that have run the radiator on the floor normally do so to save money since the main kit manufactures sell the upright radiator which can be easily 2 times more expensive (but it works without any questions)

There's only one way to find out and that's to try it! You'd have to figure out where to mount your fan(s), whether to have them on top to push the air down or underneath. With a crossflow radiator I don't think it matters much how it's mounted. The system is under pressure during normal operation. The ductwork will add some restriction, but with an efficient aluminum radiator and shrouding it may be enough cooling for you up there in Ontario.

i recall a guy I believe named Peter Hahn that lived in Orgen or Washington that had a website featuring his blue 914 with Buick V6 in it, he did areally neat job on the radiator up front, had it all hidden below a false floor, that left trunk space. I believe it worked well for him, try an internet search, i think he might have also had postings on Pelicans website, so maybe check there i believe the V6 was turbo????

good luck

have you thought about mounting the radiator in the rear trunk, with fans blowing or pushing down throught the trunk floor. would just need to cut out part of the forwrd wall of the rear trunk and the floor under the radiator. you would lose about half of the rear trunk, but the roof should still fit. the rear trunk is tall enough for a battery and the roof so a radiator should fit. you would just need big fans but 2 2500 cfm fans would/should do it.

to figure fan size call a motor shop and ask them what size fans they run

nice thing about this is shorter water lines and it is higher for bleeding puposes.

Doug:

It's Allan here and just reviewing your thread and find it interesting.
The idea of a rear mounted Radiator looks vert interesting and may be
worth some serious consideration; that way you get to keep the WHOLE
front trunk storage, etc. I might ever check this out further and consider
myself since I am just now starting to work on the vehicle after preparation
of the LT1 engine. I would be interested in any senerios you come across
here and appreciate if you could keep me in the loop. Thanks

Allan
Toronto

What about mounting in hte rear quarters? Add soem late Mustang rear quarter scoops and mount radiators on the right and left sides.
I beleive there was someone propsed that a year ago, never saw any outcome.
Just a thought.
CCLINRADRIDE

QUOTE (dmenche914 @ Jan 29 2005, 01:16 PM)

i recall a guy I believe named Peter Hahn that lived in Orgen or Washington that had a website featuring his blue 914 with Buick V6 in it....

Philip J. Haun; the car's name is "Blue Thunder".

http://members.rennlist.com/bluethunder/

--DD

I am still in the dreaming stages but here are a couple of my thoughts.

Most of the kits have the radiator mounted vertically in the front right at the rear of the headlight buckets. I was thinking of maybe tilting the radiator forward where the top of the radiator would be at the front of the headlight buckets and at the leading edge of the hood. Sink the bottom of the radiator as far down into the spare tire tub as possible. Then make a huge hole in front of it May have to add some reinforcement around and across the opening. Then from the rear side of the radiator create ducting to take the hot air either out through the floor or to the wheel wells. Then above/on top of this ducting you may be able to create a depression for the spare tire, and, who knows, maybe a space for the battery.

The other idea would be to create "saddlebag" radiators on either side of the engine behind the doors. These would be much smaller radiators but you would have two of them. Would need some type of a scoop for air intake, but ???? Also, if you add flares then you could extend the radiators out into the front edge of the flare and incorporate the scoop into the body side and front of the flair. You would still have the full front trunk (would have to relocate the battery and the front would be great for weight balance) and a full rear trunk. Best of both worlds.

But, as I said, I am still dreaming

tom...

Back in the Day in hte back of Hot Rod Mag there used to be an small 18" rad that was octangle. Anybody know of this one i was 18" across, and would cool a 454 Big block. Or so the ad claimed, looked a lot like a big heater core.

Take care, Stephen

why is every body stealing my email address... my email is a9144me at comcast.... so far i have sen a 9144me, and 914forme as sceen names... keep your hands of my koolaid

QUOTE (Dave_Darling @ Feb 24 2005, 09:33 AM)

QUOTE (dmenche914 @ Jan 29 2005, 01:16 PM) i recall a guy I believe named Peter Hahn that lived in Orgen or Washington that had a website featuring his blue 914 with Buick V6 in it.... Philip J. Haun; the car's name is "Blue Thunder". http://members.rennlist.com/bluethunder/ --DD

Here is the link to BlueThunders engine and radiator pics:

http://members.rennlist.com/bluethunder/engine.htm

tom...

I found this picture of a rear heat exchanger setup, but I think it's for a turbo intercooler. I suppose it could be adapted for a V8.

I've contemplated a rear trunk mounted radiator like that for some time. The area between the taillights should be a low pressure area at speed, so appropriate ducting from the engine bay should generate decent flow. I'd much rather give up the rear trunk than the front trunk, esp. if it means a lot less plumbing.

QUOTE (914GT @ Feb 24 2005, 01:02 PM)

I found this picture of a rear heat exchanger setup, but I think it's for a turbo intercooler. I suppose it could be adapted for a V8.

That's the intercooler from the Turbo Six that "Maltese Falcon" has in his car. Not a water radiator.

--DD

QUOTE (Dave_Darling @ Feb 24 2005, 03:29 PM)

QUOTE (914GT @ Feb 24 2005, 01:02 PM) I found this picture of a rear heat exchanger setup, but I think it's for a turbo intercooler.  I suppose it could be adapted for a V8. That's the intercooler from the Turbo Six that "Maltese Falcon" has in his car. Not a water radiator. --DD

That's why I said I thought it was an intercooler. My implication was that a radiator with water hoses would be mounted in a similar manner. Apologize for being unclear.

I'll bet that car can jump a curb if you accidently hit the starter with it in 1st.

hah


M

QUOTE (lapuwali @ Feb 24 2005, 01:16 PM)

I've contemplated a rear trunk mounted radiator like that for some time. The area between the taillights should be a low pressure area at speed, so appropriate ducting from the engine bay should generate decent flow. I'd much rather give up the rear trunk than the front trunk, esp. if it means a lot less plumbing.

If you're planning on putting the radiator in the rear trunk, don't forget to plan for space to store the removable top (one of the beneficial features of the 914, remember?)!

QUOTE (type47fan @ Feb 24 2005, 05:33 PM)

QUOTE (lapuwali @ Feb 24 2005, 01:16 PM) I've contemplated a rear trunk mounted radiator like that for some time.  The area between the taillights should be a low pressure area at speed, so appropriate ducting from the engine bay should generate decent flow.  I'd much rather give up the rear trunk than the front trunk, esp. if it means a lot less plumbing. If you're planning on putting the radiator in the rear trunk, don't forget to plan for space to store the removable top (one of the beneficial features of the 914, remember?)!

Sorry, my top doesn't come off...

Jaide did it, see the link in my signature...

Sorry, I didn't have this pic in that thread...

I have always heard that you want the air flow to hit the radiator as close to straight on as possible. With this one the air has to make a 90 degree turn to get through the radiator

tom...

If the air is ducted and sealed well, then it would have to run through the radiator...if it's being forced in by the speed of the car....or the fans are pulling air through. I thought about doing that method, but the upright setup is just proven and I just don't carry a spare anymore.

I'm planning to use the golf radiator - which should sit leaning forward right at the front of the front trunk. Then I will put a false floor which slopes backwards towards the rear of the car - providing the most trunk space right at the rear where there is a lot of height (Napa- wine cases).

Should look like this. Spare tire is going in the rear trunk because:
1) it's too small for anything meaningful
2) it's annoying digging around under the roof for stuff
3) my rear trunk is missing a lot of steel due to two turbos and a starter motor.

You could reduce the size of the radiator by using finned tubing as your water lines. The finned tuing has more than 192square inches of surface area per foot times 4 (4 feet up and 4 feet back) thats over 1500 square inches of surface area.
That will pull a lot of heat out and allow the use of a much smaller radiator.
If you ran two pair of finned tube 3000 si of area which is what I would do you could use a radiator the size of a gt 6 oil cooler and that would fit with its ducting where the spare tire normally sits and there would be no need to cut out the fenders for the air to escape.

Gt ducting

Finned tubing