I'm in sort of an odd predicament and I want to see if anyone here has had to deal with anything similar. Here's the deal:


I live in Missouri and I just bought a '74 914 from a guy who was going to sell it for parts. I bought it cheap because of this.

He bought it from another guy who bought it to sell it for parts.

The title was not transferred either time. So, the title now has the "original" (as of 1987ish) on the front and the "next" owner (as of 2002) on the back as the buyer. I am in possession of the title, but it doesn't do me much good in it's current state. I contacted the original owner, who then contacted the state DMV. The DMV told him that he could not simply apply for a replacement title, as every car the car changed hands the title should have been transferred - each sale was not legal. So he can't help me either. He did seem willing to tell the DMV "yeah, I don't own it anymore".

Luckily, the guy I bought the car from has been very willing to help throughout this whole process and will be calling the Missouri state DMV tomorrow to see what they have to say. If we can't get a clear title, the guy offered to give me my money back, so I'm not too worried about that aspect. I just don't want to have to give the car back


Anyone ever been through something like this????

Was it a steal of a deal? If not there are good cars out there with a title. If it's THE car ask about a bonded title. You buy an insurance bond to get the title. However it'll be harder to sell the car later. It's a step above salvage but who cares if you plan on keeping it. This is for a keeper. Good luck.

Many pictures help knowing the condition to see if it's worth it.

Most likely be different at DMV from state to state. It will all come down to how much is owed in penalties/fines to resurrect the title.
I bought one in the same situation, California DMV wanted $1801 in penalties and other fees; it got parted out instead.

You might try these guys http://www.broadwaytitle.com/ if all else fails (no personal experience or affiliation)

I feel like it was a steal of a deal - $800. But I could be wrong. Here are some pics of the car. So far, I know I will need to:

Buy a rebuilt bottom end and P&C (heads look good)
Rebuild carbs (they are rusted and seized)
Flush gas tank
Replace fuel lines
Replace brake lines
Rebuild brake calipers
Buy new coil
Buy battery
Buy new tires

Body seems to be very straight. A few spots of the paint are starting to bubble from rust and the outer rockers are probably 50% gone. Paint does look like it will polish up pretty nicely. Rest of the car seems pretty solid. I'm a noob when it comes to all this stuff though, I'm just learning as I go. Thoughts?

The title holder SHOULD be able to apply for a replacement title. Possibly just have him try a different DMV and skip the part about it changing hands

100 mph tape holding the gas pedal together? I think I'd look a little deeper into the structure of the car. Seriously, pull the rockers and inspect the outer and inner longs and the rest of the suspect areas... paint is the least of your concerns my friend.

Missouri License & Title Agency in K C. Check with them. All I did was Google.

I understand paint is at the bottom of the list at this point. I'm just wondering if THIS car is worth fighting for, or if I should just give it back and move on.

I didn't mean to come across as a downer.... but there's only one way to stop wondering. Remove the rockers and carpet and check out the bones of this car. Only then will you know for sure what to do. If you have questions, post pictures and get feed back from the World. They're here for you. Good luck.

I agree. You can't really place a value on it, or figure out where to go form here, without understanding the rust situation. The value of the car is the market value of the car (with potential repairs done) minus the cost of those repairs. That will determine whether you got a deal or not. None-the-less, it looks pretty good, and seems to have a lot of very attractive stuff on it. But, dig into the car to really find out.

I agree ! Skip the other buyers, lost title. Keep it simple.

I 100% agree with that too. Unfortunately, the title holder called the state DMV and told them the situation. I think the DMV scared him into not doing that. He isn't willing to help any further at this point.

I bought a car w/o a title and all I had to do was fill out the proper paper work and I was good to go. If I recall I had a bill of sale and filled out papers for application of title. There may have been one or two more papers to fill out.
Check with your DMV. In CA it was not too hard to deal with.

George would sell you a title.

Hide the title. Get a bill of sale from the last seller. Most states have a title application form that will require a certified letter sent to the last registered owner who will have to say whether they have a legal right to the car, if they say no you are granted the title. Usually the hardest part is tracing down that owner.

That would be a NO! Do a Google Search

I'll give that a try since I've already tracked the "owner" on the title. Do you see any concerns since he signed the title over to another buyer, or is he still considered the legal owner?

In NY state , the buyer can use the signed titke to order a new title under his name.
He can authorize you to register the car on your name but he is still the owner, when the title comes he signs it over to you.

Another thought....
You can get about $4-500 for the wheels alone if they're true. Parts sales will move you into a titled car. Sell it off and find a driver for spring.

Every state is different. In Oregon I bought my car with a bill of sale from a guy who bought it with a bill of sale. I had no title in hand when I bought the car but I knew I could return it if I could not get the title and I only paid $300. I went to the DMV and got a name and address of the guy who last had the title. I sent a copy to the address of a bill of sale. Once he sent me the signed bill of sale I was able to go to the DMV and obtain the title in my name.

You need to track down the guy whose name is on the title and obtain a bill of sale from him, otherwise s/he is still the legal owner. Check with your state DMV on how to proceed. It's a tenuous situation to be in because there's a lot of waiting and unknowns. Don't do much work on the car or invest much in it emotionally until you know the outcome.

I've been there and know how you feel. Hang in there.

From my understanding, in Oklahoma at least, the state only cares about who was the last person to register the car/title. If the one guy never bothered transferring it, he never bothered "buying" it.

Check the battery area, the pan, and rear suspension mounts (especially the right) before you do anything else, it may be a parts car.

If the car is worth the hassle, you may be able to obtain a mechanics lien. It would require you to file a lien with the court, have an auction and then file the paperwork with the state. Have your wife or girlfriend "buy" the car for want ever price you need to, or you may wind up deciding to sell it to the new buyer at this point. It's different from state to state, but this may be an option.
-mark

I think if the first owner has never had the car out of his name, you could get a new title in his name regardless of what your DMV says. You might go talk to a 3rd party place if you have those in your state.

Otherwise, you would need to find the guy whose name is on the back and get him to do a power of attorney for the car to you. At least that's how it works here in AZ. I've done it on a 914 in fact.

Basically the owner on the front of the title has put it into the hands of someone else. That person never transferred the title, but they can grant a power of attorney to you to transfer the title for them. And when you transfer the title for them, you transfer it to you. The DMV wants a paper trail from the front owner to you. The power of attorney is the missing link.

have you spoken with the original owner?
If he is ok with it, go online and file for a duplicate title, pay for it and they will send it to his address.

Give him something for his trouble and signature.
BTDT...kinda a hassle, I never buy cars without titles because of that.

rich

I have have done this at the CA DMV.
I had a signed title from the original owner, signing the car over to a new second party.
The bill of sale documenting the sale from the original owner to the second party.
The bill of sale from the second party documenting the sale of the car to me.

Took it all that to the CA DMV and transferred the title of the car to me.
Of course that were some extra fees & penalties because of the time between the original sale and the sale to me.

In CA it seems all you really need to do is provide enough paper work that the DMV can charge you a bunch of fees & penalties and they are happy.

Jim

I used Broadway Title a few years ago for a 914 (my current track car). Had no problem whatsoever. Good, quick service. Cost was about $295 or something. I see now their current rate at $895 appears to be higher than what you paid for your car....YIKES.

I would simply go with the original owner requesting a replacement title. In this case, no need to devulge all the changing of hands...TMI. Go for simple.

I have registered 3 cars in the past that did not have titles, not including the 'kit' Beck Speedsters and Spyders I used to sell when I had the dealership.

Go to DMV office, tell them you bought a non-running car from a guy but he did not have a title for it. Many states do not issue titles for older cars anyway (Georgia comes to mind). Here in NC, they have you fill out a form and a DMV inspector comes out to see the car, writes up a report, verifies the VIN tags, and they submit it. Takes about 3-4 weeks, but assuming they don't find any leins or judgements against it, they issue a new title to you.

obviously the transfer to the person on the back was never processed, else you would be in this dilemma - therefore the guy on the front is still the legal owner

do as suggested above - just have him give you a bill of sale along with A lost title form

- then find out what the back fees & penalties are if it was not kept currently registered & make your decision

OR - sell it to a Californian and have them do an Application for Original Registration - it's a piece of cake - no back fees, but you will have to present the body for VIN certification

good luck