Is anybody going to the PCA event at Sears Point This weekend? I have a cold Becks Beer for anybody with a 914 hat or better yet drive you 914 and you get two. Gates open at 6 am Saturday.

I'll pop in after 1:00 to catch the end on Saturday.
914 will stay home if it rains

KT

sorry to hijack, what is the difference between a time trial and a DE? Or is a time trial more like an autocross?

QUOTE (roundboy914 @ Feb 16 2005, 07:18 AM)

sorry to hijack, what is the difference between a time trial and a DE? Or is a time trial more like an autocross?

DE=Driver Education, teachs you car control and how the car reacts to different lines through corners. It is not a competitive event.

Time Trials=Timed laps around a race track and is competitive.

Paul

Anyone coming by...look for blue surburban...White box trailer.white 914 with sc flares. Car number 281

My son and I will be there Saturday for the High Speed Driving School. If it was low speed driving school we would be in 914's and get beers , but as it is we will be in the White Boxster S and a yellow 78 911 SC.

Remember - No Beer till the last car leaves the track.

Ken 180

Hey - Steve they have you down as AI, are you bring the new car??

Ken

Ken,

I am bring the new car...They made a mistake. Old AI car lives in Tampa now.


Steve

I thought maybe it was a clever way to stay in the Yellow group.

Ken

QUOTE (roundboy914 @ Feb 16 2005, 07:18 AM)

sorry to hijack, what is the difference between a time trial and a DE? Or is a time trial more like an autocross?

The difference depends a lot on how your local clubs define the terms...

Here in PCA Zone 7 (N. Cal. and some of NV), you can run a DE event with a normal unmodified street car. To run a Time Trial, you must have certain minimum safety equipment. (5- or 6-point harnesses, fire extinguisher, possibly fire-resistant gloves.) A DE is a one-day event, while a TT is two days, with "timed runs" taking place the latter half of the second day.

Passing rules tend to be fairly strict in TT, and exceedingly strict in a DE. (As in, "No passing at all at first.")

--DD

Ken,

I started in the yellow group, I will be there till the powers tha be let me be free.

just to reinforce Dave's comments.
It really does vary by region.

out in colorado, all DE's have a time trial component at the end of the weekend. You have two attempts to set your time and then brag about it later.

All DE's have controlled passing

I took the 911 to Kahlers in Dublin for tech today and all was ok except for a torn CV joint boot which had flung grease all over the place . They should have it patched up by Friday. I wonder if the HSDS group will be on the track the same time as the DE? Looks like rain is possible and maybe even likely. Are there any garage spaces left?

QUOTE (Dave_Darling @ Feb 16 2005, 03:26 PM)

Here in PCA Zone 7 (N. Cal. and some of NV), you can run a DE event with a normal unmodified street car.  To run a Time Trial, you must have certain minimum safety equipment.  (5- or 6-point harnesses, fire extinguisher, possibly fire-resistant gloves.)  A DE is a one-day event, while a TT is two days, with "timed runs" taking place the latter half of the second day. Passing rules tend to be fairly strict in TT, and exceedingly strict in a DE.  (As in, "No passing at all at first.") --DD

For GGR, DEs are two day events culminating in a TT. For your first two events you run as a student and only need regular 3 point belts but by your third event you need the full equipment.

New this year with GGR is the High Peformance Driving School. It's a one day event. You are only allowed to do one of these before you graduate to DE.

There shouldn't be any passing during a TT. Cars should be started far enough a part so that there would be no need to pass.

QUOTE (anthony @ Feb 16 2005, 09:34 PM)

For GGR, DEs are two day events culminating in a TT. For your first two events you run as a student and only need regular 3 point belts but by your third event you need the full equipment. New this year with GGR is the High Peformance Driving School. It's a one day event. You are only allowed to do one of these before you graduate to DE. There shouldn't be any passing during a TT. Cars should be started far enough a part so that there would be no need to pass.

The Time Trial event is the two day long event; starts on Saturday with practice sessions, continues Sunday morning with more practice sessions, then Sunday afternoon are the timed runs. During the practice sessions, you can pass on any straight as long as the person being passed gives the passing car a "point". During timed runs, if you catch someone in front of you then you get a re-run for being impeded.

DE, at least in my note, refers to the "High Performance Driving School" you mentioned. Definitely not a new phenomenon in Z7, except for only being allowed to do one of them. (!!)

--DD

Maybe we are talking semantics but the HPDS is definitely new this year to GGR. They don't really distinguish between DE and TT. It's all DE until the last half of the day on Sunday where you do timed runs. I've heard that many people choose to go home mid day Sunday.

Now, I don't know what other regions in Zone 7 do, but that is what GGR is doing. It sounds like they added the HPDS in order to boost attendence.

In the Chicago Region, and I believe most of the Mid West, we only run DE's. Lower run groups only pas on main straight, higher run groups pas on shorter straights, with a 'point' from the car being passed. Lowest run group only needs stock belts, higher groups need 5 & 6 point belts. No TT's around here, just the step up to club racing.

So it sounds like TT"s are DE's that lead up to a controlled competition.

Axle boot fixed, car passed tech, hotel in Napa booked for Friday night. WOOHOO! Got this notice from GGRPCA for a "chalk talk" session on driving the track Friday night.

On Friday evening from 6:30 to 7:30 we are going to have a special “Chalk
Talk” on driving Infineon Raceway. We have made arrangements with two
special guests, Woody Harris and Steve Romine of MSI Motorsport, to discuss
various driving techniques that will enable us to improve our driving
skills.[COLOR=green]

Anyone else going to the chalk talk?

QUOTE (anthony @ Feb 17 2005, 10:59 AM)

Maybe we are talking semantics but the HPDS is definitely new this year to GGR.

GGR was, for years, the only Region in Z7 that ran Big Track events. And, once or twice per year, they had DE events (or HPDE, if you prefer)--in addition to the regular schedule of 5-10 TT events (that being the full two-day event which is mostly "practice sessions"). They may have stopped offering the DEs for a little while and then started them up again for this year--but that does not, to my mind, qualify as "all new"...

Aaaah, whatever. For the most part we are saying the same thing with different words. This is merely a side discussion which isn't really relevant to the thread anyway.

--DD

On Friday evening from 6:30 to 7:30 we are going to have a special “Chalk
Talk” on driving Infineon Raceway. We have made arrangements with two
special guests, Woody Harris and Steve Romine of MSI Motorsport, to discuss
various driving techniques that will enable us to improve our driving
skills.[COLOR=green]

If you do not know these two guys, they are really know there stuff and know Sears well. I do not know the format for the talk but I have been at a Drivers Ed event at Sears with both Steve and Woody running my group and it was excellence. If you have not been to the track for awhile and/or would like a refresh on Sears I would say go. What they teach you will be able to use on any track.

Can we sneak in for this tech session?

KT

You "don't need no stinking badges" to get in.

Ken

Damn....now the withdrawls start again....

I wanna play.......



Ken H.,

Did you put in the LSD?

Bill P.

Looks like rain on and off Saturday. For those of you with some track experience (call me track virgin) how tricky does it get at Sears in the rain? I sure wish I was running my 914 (almost done)! I assume they run rain or shine. I guess I don't have to wash my car beforehand now. I am poring over the track layout tonight. The SC Car is emptied, tools and spares packed. It will take an hour to clean up all of the makeup, hair care devices, and general clutter in the wife's boxster. I would trade in a minute for the boxster, but feel more comfortable with my son running the newer car.

Hi Patrick,

If it's a light sprinkle you should have no problems at Sears....be smooth but don't let the adrenaline take over, if it's damp or rainy people will go off the track....it will happen.

Generally at the GGR TT's if it starts coming down hard, people come in and hang out in the pits until the rain stops...then they send out cars...any cars for the most part (tow vehicles, station wagons, race cars...) to dry off the racers line....then if it's dry enough, they resume practice or the TT's.

Last year we had fine weather up till the TT. After about 2/3 of the field had timed runs, the rain came and washed out the competition part of it.

When it rains, I get off. It's a personal choice. It's not about the car getting wet (I have slicks so it doesn't like the water) but in every run group there is a hot shot who goes a little too hot into a wet section and gets sliding, either on the track of off. Those guys scare me....

Bill P.

Bill,
Thanks for that. HOTSHOTIAMNOT! ETA for your car still mid-season?

Hi Bill,

LSD is in and ready to play. Now I have to set the car up again, as I understand the LSD will increase the understeer.

Sorry you and Doris will not be there.

Ken

Hi Patrick,

For TT's I'm thinking we'll make number 3 at Buttonwillow for the 3 day event at the end of June. Auto-X we may make it out by May. Probably June as well. It's getting closer....I saw the car tonight....it's looking good.

Ken H.

Doris says hi and we'll see you at the track soon. I really liked the LSD. Didn't take but a few laps to get used to it. The car pushes a little at first, but you adjust it out and it's all good!

Bill P.