I Recently purchased a 74 914 (VIN 4742901009) with what I believe originally had a 2.0 liter installed in it (original engine ID 006765). According to the seller the stock engine had one of the cases busted when it had thrown a rod through it. He went on to say he purchased a case (W0111578 ID found in front of oil filler) and took the remaining parts from the original engine to a shop here in MPLS. there they replaced the main, rod and cam bearings. Blasted-polished the crank and rods. installed a 30mm high flow oil pump. Honed the cylinders & installed and gapped new 94mm ring set. Replaced worn camshaft with a new "IV" mechanical cam. At this point the car is not drivable for structural reasons but the engine starts idles, throttles up down and sounds pretty good. The car came with what looks like the 1.7 type air filter set up and the throttle body which sets horizontal rather than the typical vertically positioned throttle body with the larger square type air filter set up.
With all that important info out of the way, I have many questions. Is this a 1.7 injection installed on a 2.0 engine? if it is, is it a huge deal? Will the 1.7 injection automatically adjust to the larger engines demands for fuel. Most importantly what specs do I use to tune the engine? Thanks Gunn

No, it will not autmatically do anything, it's from the 70's.

Basically there are several hard coded (hardware coded) air/fuel maps.
Cold, warm, and hot.

To tune it you will want an external air/fuel meter with either an 02 sensor installed, or what I do is stuff an 02 sensor into the muffler.

This will give you a better understanding of how the motor is running.
You will not get a good set of readings unless you do this under load, driving or on a dyno, because one of the main sensors is manifold pressure and that changes dramatically under load.
The rest of the sensors are simple to test with a multi meter.
Read this site attached, it's considered the bible.
http://members.rennlist.com/pbanders/DjetParts.htm
Rich

Post some pictures of the engine/engine bay so we can see what parts are being used.

And...

Picture as requested.
I know its sort of a mess....No one ever said it would be easy! Click to view attachment

Find the numbers on the ecu, mps, tps, and cht
They all need to match per the charts on the site I posted

If you don't know what those acronyms mean it may help reading the site I posted

Click to view attachment Picture of ECU.

r-towle, I will read the article and get the numbers of the ECU, MPS, TPS and CHT. Thanks

If engine is original to the '74 body, spark plug position suggests the engine most likely started out as a 1.8. Double check all the FI pieces to verify exactly what you have.

gunn1, here's a link to a site with all the 914 Fuel Injection part numbers ans associated years. Also includes diagnostic info. Lots to learn, but well worth it.

http://members.rennlist.com/pbanders/djetparts.htm

Welcome to the madness!

Gents

This is what is currently in the car, and how the ID numbers correspond with the numbers in the D-Jetronic Parts Analysis and Troubleshooting
ECU=
022 906 021 E (Bosch 0 280 000 037) ECU use only with the 1973 2.0L engine.
MPS=
022 906 051 C/0280 100 037/use on 2.0L 1973 NLA. GA0 000 001=>GA0 006 765
TPS=
039 906 111 A/0 280 120 032/use on 2.0L 1973-1976
CHT=
311 906 041 A/0 280 130 012/use on 2.0L 1974-1976

Sort of looking like the car was a 2.0L and when the engine was replaced because of the broken case they used a 1.8 or 1.7 case ?

Remember the ID number on the case WO111578? what does this ID equate to for information?

Thank you

3 or 4 studs on the head to intake runners?

If the original 2.0 threw a rod and busted the case the cranks would \probably not have been usable. the W code engine they used as a core would have had the 66mm crank used in a 1.7/1.8.
You could have a 1.7L/1.8L engine under all those 2.0L D-jet parts.

Just a thought.

Jim

Oh and

Thank you for the welcome to 914 world....

The engine has 4 bolts holding down each of the intake runners, 4# for the left cylinder bank and 4# for the right cylinder bank.

Welcome to 914world!

Your engine is not really that messed except that firewall pad. You can just delete/remove that pad so you be able to see if there is some rush on the lower firewall area that needs repair.

Click to view attachment this photo was taken by the previous owner.

Its the only one I have of the engine after the rebuild, before it was reinstalled in the car.

Hold the phone on the 4 versus 3 bolts holding down the intake runners.....I may be wrong looked to quick because of the snow that's currently falling!

Will get a better look tomorrow....

There should be one or two letters on the beginning of the engine ID.

A "Certificate of Authenticity" would tell you the original engine serial number and original engine size. Talk to Porsche to get one, and bring money. You can also look for the emissions stickers in the engine bay, which will list the engine size.





W would be an early-ish 1.7 engine. The stamp being in front of the oil filler means it was from a VW, likely a 411.

It is most likely that the engine still has 1.7 heads, as the 1.7 style manifold takes a little extra work to bolt up to the three-stud heads. (And if the 2.0 parts are available, it's easier to use them.)

I can't see in the photo if the injectors are green or yellow. 2.0 injectors would be green, 1.7 ones yellow (or rarely black).

Note that it is possible for a D-jet engine to run with mis-matched parts, but it likely won't run correctly in at least some circumstances.

--DD

The runners use four nuts for attachment to the heads. I do have a cert of authenticity from Porsche, which the last owner gave it to me when I purchased the car. 006765 is what the cert of authenticity says no letters appear in front of this number on the cert.
I will look and see what I have for injector colors later today. I can already tell his is going to be fun!

Gents,

Ok so I spoke with the gentleman that rebuilt the motor.

He says the engine is a 2.0 liter in displacement.

He explained that when he rebuilds these engines if the cases and heads are junk or to far gone, he uses 1.7 liter cases with 2.0 cylinders and 1.7 liter heads(which explains the 4 bolts on the heads for the runners versus the typical 3 bolt design normally found on the 2.0 liter). He say's he then "opens the heads and case halves up" or "fly's" them on a Bridgeport lathe, that way everything assembles correctly and makes it a 2 liter in displacement. Guessing that explains why the engine runs with all the 2.0 liter electronics on it.

So does this mean I can treat it as a 2.0 liter and build accordingly? Suggestions?, Bueller, Bueller, anyone, anyone?

Welcome to the the World, Gunn!

We have a couple of 74 2.0s in the garage in St. Paul. One of the 2.0s maybe for sale.

PM me if you're interested-

You can use any case with no modifications for all three sets of cylinders.
You need to mill out the 1.7 liter heads to fit the largers cylinders.

The valves, and ports are very different on the 1.7 liter versus the 2.0 liter heads so those heads will never flow like the 2.0 liter heads.

I would suggest for the sake of costs that you get an A/F meter and see how it runs and if the mixture is right.
You will most likely have to be using a custom Djet setup to make it work properly.

Rich

One of these days you guys will give me some good news!....maybe....

More info!!!!!! The injectors are green (2.0 L) it has the 2.0 liter crank in it.

The fella that rebuilt the engine told me that he has done this (milled out the heads) many times and has never had a (underperforming)performance issue.

But in the interest of doing things the correct way, if I wanted a "True" 2.0Liter engine seems to me all I would have to purchase would be a set of 2 liter heads and a different set of runners, and a 2 liter air filter assembly.

Hmmmmmmm.

Maybe a Subaru or V8 914 is in my future....although it would be really great to keep it real.....air cooled boxer style!

Thoughts?

If you have a 2L crank, rods, cylinders and pistons you need the 2L heads. The 1.7 heads with stock valves the green injectors may not have enough air to properly burn the fuel.

So with 1.7l heads bored out to fit 94's you do have a 2.0L but there is no way it will make 95hp without the real 3 intake stud heads. With that setup you might be making 85 hp...

After doing some more detective work on the car/engine and talking with some of the folks, they are now saying the heads are actually 1.8 liter not the previously purported 1.7 liter heads that were machined to fit the 2 liter jugs.

Curious how this development will affect things. I would guess while not the 2 Liter heads the 1.8 Liter heads are still better flow wise than the 1.7 Liter heads would be.

Are the 1.8 liter heads better flow wise or are the 1.8 and 1.7 liter heads the same and the difference in the displacement size determine by the different bore size?

So Many Questions.......................So little money

The 1.8 heads will fit the 2.0 liter jugs with no machining required.

Now for flow, the 1.8 liter heads are basically the same casting as the 2.0 liter shape wise, but the ports are slightly smaller, and the valves are smaller.

They can be ported to match the 2.0 liter, and the larger valves could also be installed.

So, pull off the valve cover, get the part number off the head, that will help.

Aside from that, really.....who cares.
From what I recall, you have some welding to do....unless you are trying to sell that motor...

You are correct Rich....I do have a boat load of welding to do, starting with welding up a rotisserie for the car to be worked on.

But I, like many on this site can walk and chew gum at the same time....I am also focused on the engine and mechanical aspects of the car so that I can keep an eye out for parts that may come available over time. I am in no hurry, and want the car to turn out nice, so I am ready for this project to take some time.

I do appreciate everyone who has weighed in with their knowledge and advise.

Thank you...

in the walking and chewing gum line of thought, if it was me, I would do this anyways.

I would remove the engine.
Remove all the engine tin for cleaning and new paint
I would clean the engine of any and all foreign matter in the fins.
I would replace all the oil seals.

Now, here you are, sitting with the long block on the bench.
You are about 20 minutes from removing the head...
I would do that.
Pull the heads, and measure up what you have...
Measure bore and stroke...and measure the valve diameter.

Rich