Finally picked up the 914 yesterday after almost a month at a highly recommended local indie shop (the reason it took a month is another story). I made it about 10 miles towards home before the steering felt funny and there was a clunking from the left front . . .

Yeah, you guessed it:

Click to view attachment

Click to view attachment

Click to view attachment



LF lugs weren't tightened/torqued. I guess that I WAS lucky on one level . . . I hadn't decided to take the freeway home.

After jacking up the car and tightening the lug bolts (and checking the others), I drove back to the shop for a "safety briefing" with the owner. Not much said besides "sorry."

When I'm doing multi-step work on the car where I might forget something, I tend to leave sticky notes one the dash or steering wheel ("pump brakes," "torque lugs," etc.). But when a car is in the shop, how do we know they haven't forgotten something and everything is really OK . . . that the valves are properly adjusted, push rod tube keeper wires in place . . . or if a wheel is about to fall off?

And I know that sometimes people make mistakes, that $hit happens, that the exception doesn't prove the rule, etc., etc., but still . . . I guess it comes down to a matter of trust--kind of like buying/eating mushrooms

We try to exercise our judgment in picking the best mechanic, shop, doctor, contractor, product, etc., then we pay our $ and take our chances, right?

Sorry for the rant, but this experience has left me kind of pessimistic.

Everyone makes mistakes. Pros should own up to it and make it right.

Wow. Super scary. Glad you're ok.

You're right, $hit happens. But not $hit like that. Inexcusable. The fact that it was only one wheel leads me to believe that the tech got distracted and just forgot. The owner of that shop should have taken it way more seriously.

I agree . . . I didn't lose my temper or anything--that's why I took the "safety briefing" approach when I got back to the shop--and why I was a little hesitant about posting this. cuddyk was right on--apparently the tech got interrupted. I'm just trying to figure out a good way to avoid things like this in the future.

I've had some come loose...should have torqued, then drove around the block, then re torqued.

Now I know

Of course, to err is human...but a good hedge is the "preflight check" like pilots do. After each service, I check lug nuts, CV bolts, oil level, all wires in engine bay, ground strap, and connections at battery. A true pro shouldn't mind you doing this before driving off. If they won't let you, you can at least confirm with the mechanic that all of the above are good. Just asking "what were the lug nuts torqued to?" or "Did you check the CV bolts?" could help.

FYI...when I personally work on anything than can hurt or strand me, I take my car to a great local (gray haired) mechanic who "grades my work". Adds another level of comfort...and safety.

I make mistakes and I own all of them.

Preflight is a good idea--I've always done a post-MX walk-around, check the oil, etc. Guess I need to take it to the next level (and carry a torque wrench in the car ).

But while that may be fine for us gear-heads, it still leaves open the question of how those not mechanically "savvy" approach the question. Similar questions apply to having work done on a house, getting medical attention, or whatever. Sorry, maybe this is heading towards a philosophical discussion that belongs in the sandbox?

FWIW, the new-to-me shop has a good rep with the local PCA members (my 914 had around 25 different P-cars and 2 ferraris for company during its stay), and the owner has ~ 40 years experience. Maybe it was just a couple of bad days.

As you said, to err IS human . . . but I sure miss my old mechanic.

Thanks for listening--I appreciate it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ii8rC6CPCvM

It's worth the 2 minutes to see. . .

If all you got was a "sorry" & not even bothering to check the car over for you, re-check TQ on the bolts, etc. - if it were me, then I'd be looking for a different shop!

There's a reason I've been with the same shop for 40+ years!


Tom
///////

Any professional shop will test drive and recheck their work and catch such mistakes before the car leaves the shop with the customer. Would not trust that shop again...

Sorry to hear, I had a coworker that had her GMC service at a local dealer. Upon exiting the dealership, the front wheel fell off. She was lucky as she was headed to the freeway a block away.
Things like this, there's no excuse. It's simple wrenching one n one.

The wheels tend to fall off at slow speed. High speed force keeps the wheel on the hub.

Happened to my nephew. Tire shop pretty much blew him off and wasn't going to pay for the damage. His dad got involved and they bought him a new jeep. His dad is very convincing.

Not directed at anyone but the above statement is one reason some shops are more money than others. Just think how much time it takes to drive every car you work on to make sure it is o/k, not only what was done but to make sure nothing else is wrong.

When I have no time or lack the needed knowledge my families cars go to a shop that has a high labor rate comparatively. They have super communication & always test drive the cars depending on what work was done. It is never about cutting corners.

I agree that errors are human but I think they should have done a little more than just a "sorry". When you returned not much could be done except do a quick check but the offer of a free service down the road might help smooth things over.

One of my local customers has a couple BMW's M3 and brought one by for me to look at a few months back. He had a BAD clunk in the L.R. and thought he had a bad CV or wheel bearing. Turned out that the tire shop didn't tighten the lugs on the wheel. His then pregnant wife was driving this car everyday at the time.

Yeah shit happens, but when your JOB is to change tires, or do any type of suspension work, it SHOULDN'T happen. I personally go over anything I have worked on 2-3 times after the job is done to make sure everything is tight

I've seen this problem in the past and can say that when you choose a repair facility to work on your vehicle there are a few things you should be looking for in that place. Price and convenience are commonly at the top of the list, however IMHO not as important as experience and quality. Many small shops have the owner, lead tech, service writer, customer relations consultant, advertising agent, lube tech, shuttle driver etc... all wrapped into 1 guy. These types of mistakes happen when the tech is distracted. Whether he has to stop to answer the phone, take out the garbage, drive a customer home or any other task that takes his attention from the job he's working on, that tech is overloaded. Find a shop that has organization, such as a service writer that doesn't allow techs to be distracted.

This type of place is usually more expensive, but with that, they are more profitable and have the resources to service you as the customer better. Let's face it, it's never cheap the get your car fixed, I believe it's worth it to pay a little more $ to get a lot better service.

Sometimes. My dad was driving down the highway in his TR and looked to the side and saw a wheel rolling alongside him. He thought, huh, I wonder whose wheel that is. He managed to stop the car without letting the rear disc touch the ground, dug the wheel out of the ditch where it ended up, screwed it back on and went on his way.

These discussions make me scratch my head- when we talk brakes, everyone thinks you're crazy to do it yourself. I have a whole lot more motivation to pay attention to my brakes than some new-hire teenager at a shop or dealer. If you have a shop you trust, great. I find them exceedingly hard to find.

Reminder post it on the driver's window and torque wrench on the driver's seat. Makes it hard to forget when I'm having a 'senior moment'.

This is why I do all my own work. If you don't know how, find someone who does so you can watch and learn. Plenty of how too videos on you tube. I was watching a you tube video on a lube & oil change place in Canada scamming customers. A customer would go in to get an oil change for $19.95. They would upsell to $29.95 for better oil. Then they would check the fluids and tell the customer they needed a brake fluid flush and coolant flush. The funny part is they would return in 10 minutes with a bill for $281.00 and tell the customer his car was ready! You are lucky to do a half assed oil change in 10 minutes, let alone a brake fluid and coolant flush. What proof do you have that they used the $29.95 oil instead of the recycled drain oil? Did they change the filter or clean off the old one? If you must go to a garage, always ask for the old parts.

I've known my mechanic for almost 40 years.. I trust him 100%.
I don't have his personal cell phone number but my wife does and
when she calls him to say she has an issue with her 911.. He reacts.
I don't call him.... I let her call for me.. Much better response time.

He is a friend... as was the man he bought the shop from many years ago..

I consider myself very lucky...

I always try to give mine away, free of charge!

I saw this on a car in my shop today.

[attachment is=550514]

Yeah... But he is smarter than to go there....

A buddy of mine came back from a Les Schwab after getting new tires. I pointed out that he was missing a lug bolt on one wheel and on another wheel the bolts didn't match the others.

I often trust my own work more than the work of others. At the very least I'm certain that I care more about my stuff than anyone else.

If there is more than 1 person touching the car, $hit happens easily.

End of the day and I'm cleaning up. Newbie service writer brings me a 12 yo Maxima with 200k for an oil change and "thorough" inspection. Short time later she comes back, closes the hood, says hurry up customer waiting and walks off. I open the hood, put oil in it, write a short summary "needs new car" on the report and pass it along.

Common oversights are rarely the [good] Mechanic's fault.

Anyone who gets paid to do a job is professional, but how good they are is different story...

Had the same issue with lug nuts after picking up a car from a shop before, and also discovered the issue before wheel departure. Also had a friend who smoked an engine when his oil drain plug worked free within miles of the shop after an oil change. On the flip side the other day, I was rotating tires on my DD for the first time since new tires went on a few months ago. Some of the nuts came off quite easily, some required a lot of heft with a 1/2" two foot breaker bar - no consistency, some way too lose, and some way too tight all on the same wheel...

Good shops are hard to find, at least around here. That's one of the reasons I've learned to do as much as I can on my own.

Thanks Chris! This is exactly what I recommended to the shop owner.

I really appreciate all of the thoughts and advice from everybody here in 914world.

A little background: I've been working on my 914 for 40+ years. I've been doing my all own work on it for the last 8 years. My regular mechanic/friend (the guy that built the motor back in 1982 while I was at sea) had to give up his one-man shop after a bad motorcycle accident. I had hoped he would stay in the local area so maybe he could teach me some of the finer points, but he moved two states away.

Anyways, I thought it was time to have a pro check MY work over real well and do a simple tune-up (valve adjust, new points, etc., set ignition timing,etc.). I spent the past year + shopping around for somebody to do the work. Like I said in my earlier post, this shop was recommended by some PCA guys (and others) that I know pretty well. The on-line reviews were good too--solid 5-stars, lots of glowing comments. I had talked to the service writer on the phone and he seemed knowledgeable; same with the owner. The shop was clean and seemed pretty well organized. Though it wasn't the closest or the cheapest, it seemed like the place to go. As it turns out, maybe not . . . or maybe they just had a couple of bad days. Maybe they'll be a little more careful in the future--if so, then this incident was probably a good thing in the long run. Maybe we'll all be a little more careful too.

If there's any other good news that comes out of this little adventure--aside from the LF wheel "remaining in the work environment"--it's that I've met some really good old- school car guys. I may have even found a new mechanic . . . turns out that he's an old friend of my old mechanic (they raced E-Prod 356s in the old Mid-Atlantic Road Racing series back in the day). Walked into a little shop to ask directions and there he was.

Last but not least, there's all the good folks here--thanks for all you do.

Stop by if you're in the neighborhood, the beers are on me!

I copied this from Bradhole. China Marker on the window list. Waterproof and takes effort to wipe off. Also comes in many colors.


PS it was hot last year.

Since Dave no longer is participating I blame all my mistakes on Rob now

That's a great idea! I think I may have a white china marker in my kit. Thanks!

This thread kept me from making the same mistake last night... Been working on my 930 - haven't touched since December, and was down to wheels on and get it off the lift. I went to do a quick test drive and then remembered this thread, it reminded me to torque the hand tightened lugs... that would have sucked...