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mepstein
Is there any reason I shouldn't consider working up a cable shifter instead of the traditional 916 shift linkage. The current 916 kit is $3-3250. Add in labor for machining and assembly and you're at $5k just to make the trans shift correctly. The suby guys are doing the shifting with $300 worth of cables and hardware. Am I missing something here?
GeorgeRud
Even if you run a cable shifter setup, you still will need to flip the ring and pinion and machine for clearance, so there is some cost involved. My 915 has a Vellios kit that was carefully installed and massaged to shift well, but I was able to buy it for a little over a grand so it was a good deal.

With the exception of having to make provisions for a different muffler ( the banana muffler won't fit with the shifter taking that piece of real estate), I don't see where it couldn't be done. I seem to even remember seeing some photos of a 915 behind a V8 conversion, so give it a try! Please post photos and enjoy your project in good health!
mepstein
Yes, flipping the ring and pinion is a given. That will be done when I rebuild the trans. But it came out of a running car so I'm not expecting many surprises. Good point about a muffler but I can build that around the shifter. If I can save $5k on the trans mods (and still have a great setup) that's pretty significant.
ConeDodger
McMark at Original Customs has a cable shift solution in prototype development. Dial him up and see if it's ready for install. evilgrin.gif
914forme
QUOTE(mepstein @ Nov 5 2016, 09:46 AM) *

Is there any reason I shouldn't consider working up a cable shifter instead of the traditional 916 shift linkage. The current 916 kit is $3-3250. Add in labor for machining and assembly and you're at $5k just to make the trans shift correctly. The suby guys are doing the shifting with $300 worth of cables and hardware. Am I missing something here?


915 Cable Shifter Enjoy

And this carries the PMS Name

confused24.gif

"Patrick Motorsports Exclusive

911 / 915 Cable Shifter System - (1972-1986) PORSCHE 911 / 915 5-Speed Transmission - Complete shift system ideal for mid engine, racing and off road vehicles - Features high quality adjustable bearings and hardware - Pre assembled and set up with shift tower, shifter knob and ridged fabricated steel rear bracket - Black powdercoated housing & bracket with chrome handle shift lever - PATRICK MS USA

+ NOTE: Special Order Production and chassis specific application - Cable measurements lengths from center of shifter handle position to the dimple in the transmission shift rod must be provided.
+ Please also share the vehicle application details.
+ Please allow 1-4 weeks for cable production and setup assembly."

The one issue I see is the length of the shift rod. Does it really need all that travel or was them meant to get it into the 911 body properly so Hans could get a bolt in? If the latter is the case, figure out the travel and machine the rear shift rod to shorten it a bit. A bell crank setup would also allow you to gain some real estate out back to make the rear muffler a bit easier to get in.

I see no reason why the answer is not yes. The 916 kits where invented back when things where still rather mechanical.

You could also do this with servos, and actuators, or air or hydraulics. Have fun, that matters could also make you have a semi automatic, but that would take more than 5K to figure out all the programming. Thought the drag guys do this all the time, just not sure you want that setup, as it is intended for one function, and then forget the rest.

Motorcycles have also gotten into the game, slightly easier to do on a bike.
SirAndy
QUOTE(ConeDodger @ Nov 5 2016, 07:21 AM) *
McMark at Original Customs has a cable shift solution in prototype development. Dial him up and see if it's ready for install. evilgrin.gif

agree.gif

My 915 is patiently waiting for the OC cable shifter ...
bye1.gif
mepstein
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Nov 5 2016, 12:42 PM) *

QUOTE(ConeDodger @ Nov 5 2016, 07:21 AM) *
McMark at Original Customs has a cable shift solution in prototype development. Dial him up and see if it's ready for install. evilgrin.gif

agree.gif

My 915 is patiently waiting for the OC cable shifter ...
bye1.gif

Any idea how long?

Looks like PMS are just cable shifts with there name on it for more money.
SirAndy
QUOTE(mepstein @ Nov 5 2016, 10:08 AM) *
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Nov 5 2016, 12:42 PM) *
My 915 is patiently waiting for the OC cable shifter ...
bye1.gif
Any idea how long?

No, but McMark would know ...
shades.gif
mepstein
I'm very encouraged to see an existing solution and hear of another in the works. I definitely will be moving forward with the 915 trans for the 2nd conversion car.
rgalla9146
QUOTE(mepstein @ Nov 5 2016, 09:46 AM) *

Is there any reason I shouldn't consider working up a cable shifter instead of the traditional 916 shift linkage. The current 916 kit is $3-3250. Add in labor for machining and assembly and you're at $5k just to make the trans shift correctly. The suby guys are doing the shifting with $300 worth of cables and hardware. Am I missing something here?



I wonder if Martin Bott would sell his side shift parts separate from his complete 916
conversion kit ?
The trans can be supported with a fabricated rear mount (which someone already makes)and the 915 rear cover and selector shaft can be trimmed to clear the muffler.(or not ?)
If so, the only fabrication is the shift rod which is pretty straight forward and getting it to coordinate with a 915 shifter. Oh yeah, clutch cable too.
PS I have the whole setup from Mr. Bott and already did the trans conversion but haven't gotten far enough with the car to actually drive it.
There are certainly other ways to skin a cat.
How about a Boxster trans ?
914forme
agree.gif Boxster fits the space even better, and well you can get the VW version dirt cheap.
ConeDodger
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Nov 5 2016, 01:48 PM) *

QUOTE(mepstein @ Nov 5 2016, 10:08 AM) *
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Nov 5 2016, 12:42 PM) *
My 915 is patiently waiting for the OC cable shifter ...
bye1.gif
Any idea how long?

No, but McMark would know ...
shades.gif


Weekends belong to Alison so try contacting him Monday. LOL! I butt-dialed him today while sight seeing at Harvard University. He didn't answer. biggrin.gif
mepstein
QUOTE(ConeDodger @ Nov 5 2016, 09:58 PM) *

QUOTE(SirAndy @ Nov 5 2016, 01:48 PM) *

QUOTE(mepstein @ Nov 5 2016, 10:08 AM) *
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Nov 5 2016, 12:42 PM) *
My 915 is patiently waiting for the OC cable shifter ...
bye1.gif
Any idea how long?

No, but McMark would know ...
shades.gif


Weekends belong to Alison so try contacting him Monday. LOL! I butt-dialed him today while sight seeing at Harvard University. He didn't answer. biggrin.gif

One of the most popular tourist destinations in the world.
ConeDodger
QUOTE(mepstein @ Nov 5 2016, 10:07 PM) *

QUOTE(ConeDodger @ Nov 5 2016, 09:58 PM) *

QUOTE(SirAndy @ Nov 5 2016, 01:48 PM) *

QUOTE(mepstein @ Nov 5 2016, 10:08 AM) *
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Nov 5 2016, 12:42 PM) *
My 915 is patiently waiting for the OC cable shifter ...
bye1.gif
Any idea how long?

No, but McMark would know ...
shades.gif


Weekends belong to Alison so try contacting him Monday. LOL! I butt-dialed him today while sight seeing at Harvard University. He didn't answer. biggrin.gif

One of the most popular tourist destinations in the world.


Yes, my wife who is a member here, (Yopu) is a financial planner with her own agency. One of the companies she represents sends her on trips all the time because she is their consistent top agent. The last three days we've been in Boston. Tomorrow we go home, so we decided to hit the town. MIT, Fenway Park, Harvard, and downtown Boston. Back in our room now but amazing trip! What's wild is she's already won a trip to Disney World in the Spring! Everything in the park is free! She's working on Hawaii trip for Winter 2017... love Boston though!
eitnurg
QUOTE
There are certainly other ways to skin a cat.
How about a Boxster trans ?


I thought the problem was that the Boxster trans has no provision for a starter motor? Or am I missing something here? (They're certainly cheap, though.......)
ClayPerrine
QUOTE(eitnurg @ Nov 6 2016, 02:18 AM) *

QUOTE
There are certainly other ways to skin a cat.
How about a Boxster trans ?


I thought the problem was that the Boxster trans has no provision for a starter motor? Or am I missing something here? (They're certainly cheap, though.......)



I am building the adapter plate to put a G86-21 Boxster six speed behind my 964 motor. I will be documenting the whole process on World for everyone's enjoyment.

Yes, there is an issue with locating the starter. I have it worked out in my head, but that plan is subject to change when the plan contacts reality.
914forme
Large enough demand for said combo I am sure some one "Kennedy" will produce the combination for you / us.

Clay way to go, love your work.
mb911
QUOTE(ClayPerrine @ Nov 6 2016, 03:11 AM) *

QUOTE(eitnurg @ Nov 6 2016, 02:18 AM) *

QUOTE
There are certainly other ways to skin a cat.
How about a Boxster trans ?


I thought the problem was that the Boxster trans has no provision for a starter motor? Or am I missing something here? (They're certainly cheap, though.......)



I am building the adapter plate to put a G86-21 Boxster six speed behind my 964 motor. I will be documenting the whole process on World for everyone's enjoyment.

Yes, there is an issue with locating the starter. I have it worked out in my head, but that plan is subject to change when the plan contacts reality.


Oh that would be awesome..
McMark
Step 1: Build a mount that doesn't cost $1,000,000. Started this awhile ago, but now I finally have time to finish up the project.

Step 2: Finalize the cable shifter. With both Rob's (@ConeDodger) and Andy's (@SirAndy) cars headed to the shop, this will all be developed and completed in the next few months.

The design goal is to have everything bolt on, no modifications, and be relatively cheap.
0396
Well, I'm happy to see that there's interest in putting a 915 in a 914. I remember seeing various treads stating that the 901 was sufficient even for a 964....interesting thoughts on the longevity.

Clay's objective is very interesting. Especially with that monster 3.8 pray.gif .

Now, all we need is to see it at the track pulling away from some GT3. smile.gif
Steve
I'm running the Martin Bott kit on an 86 915 gear box on my 3.2. Starting off in second and slipping the clutch with the 901 got old. 3.6 or greater or a v8 doesn't have this problem, since they have the power to start off in second. Either way first gear is worthless and a four speed sucks in a sports car, let alone the longevity issues.
McMark
Whoops. Forgot my picture.
mepstein
QUOTE(McMark @ Nov 6 2016, 11:41 AM) *

Whoops. Forgot my picture.

Cool!
rgalla9146
Attached are pictures of a hangar and an idea for linkage that I fabricated to install a 915 in a 914 chassis.
I've since switched to the kit that Martin Bott makes that duplicates 916 parts.
eitnurg
QUOTE
I am building the adapter plate to put a G86-21 Boxster six speed behind my 964 motor. I will be documenting the whole process on World for everyone's enjoyment.


Hopefully quite soon.......after despairing of the cost of 915s for some time, the thought that this may well be possible after all has raised the excitement level somewhat.....
0396
QUOTE(Steve @ Nov 6 2016, 08:57 AM) *

I'm running the Martin Bott kit on an 86 915 gear box on my 3.2. Starting off in second and slipping the clutch with the 901 got old. 3.6 or greater or a v8 doesn't have this problem, since they have the power to start off in second. Either way first gear is worthless and a four speed sucks in a sports car, let alone the longevity issues.


+1! , if I had the time, that's the way to go. Vintage looking too boot.
mb911
Is length an issue for the booster trans?? I know I will use the 901 for now but maybe some day a 6 speed.
ConeDodger
QUOTE(396 @ Nov 6 2016, 11:33 AM) *

Well, I'm happy to see that there's interest in putting a 915 in a 914. I remember seeing various treads stating that the 901 was sufficient even for a 964....interesting thoughts on the longevity.

Clay's objective is very interesting. Especially with that monster 3.8 pray.gif .

Now, all we need is to see it at the track pulling away from some GT3. smile.gif


Well one good reason is five useful gears. 1st on a 901 can only be used to get you rolling forward. The 915 I'm putting in was designed by Porsche with gearing for my 3.2. I'm only adding a Quaffe TBD. Besides the nostalgia of having both Andy and my car in the shop at the same time!
jim912928
McMark...just south of you about 1 1/2 hours. I've got the original 915 that came with my 3.2l conversion engine. I would be interested in your setup when available. My 901 is ok, but just not right at highway speeds.
ClayPerrine
QUOTE(396 @ Nov 6 2016, 09:33 AM) *

Clay's objective is very interesting. Especially with that monster 3.8 pray.gif .

Now, all we need is to see it at the track pulling away from some GT3. smile.gif



Actually, it's not a 3.8, it's a 4.0. Subtle difference there...... :-D

Wonder if the Texas DMV would catch a license plate that said "IEATGT3" ???

I am looking at going to the machine shop to have the adapter plate made sometime this month. Lots of pictures to follow....





0396
QUOTE(ClayPerrine @ Nov 7 2016, 12:21 PM) *

QUOTE(396 @ Nov 6 2016, 09:33 AM) *

Clay's objective is very interesting. Especially with that monster 3.8 pray.gif .

Now, all we need is to see it at the track pulling away from some GT3. smile.gif



Actually, it's not a 3.8, it's a 4.0. Subtle difference there...... :-D

Wonder if the Texas DMV would catch a license plate that said "IEATGT3" ???

I am looking at going to the machine shop to have the adapter plate made sometime this month. Lots of pictures to follow....


So sorry for posting the wrong info..I must be getting old biggrin.gif

I did remember it was a "big cube" motor. I wish I could do the same biggrin.gif .
Looking forward to the progress with that monster. pray.gif
jim912928
any updates on 915 setup or boxster tranny setup?
ConeDodger
QUOTE(jim912928 @ May 27 2017, 12:26 AM) *

any updates on 915 setup or boxster tranny setup?


I think I'm the hold up. Sir Andys car is at the OC but lots to do with it before the transmission is the focus. I want to hang on to my car for the summer so it will not go out to Michigan until fall...
Steve
It's only money.. I have 10k in my Martin Bott 86 gear box. At least it's not a jury rigged mess. Same as factory and works great.
A Boxster S trans would be better if someone made a kit?? Hint.. hint.. it can be done. I've seen a 3.6 car with one awhile back.
The 915 is harder to shift than a 914 trans, but having a trans with gears that match the motor is priceless
Mark Henry
QUOTE(mb911 @ Nov 6 2016, 09:20 AM) *

QUOTE(ClayPerrine @ Nov 6 2016, 03:11 AM) *

QUOTE(eitnurg @ Nov 6 2016, 02:18 AM) *

QUOTE
There are certainly other ways to skin a cat.
How about a Boxster trans ?


I thought the problem was that the Boxster trans has no provision for a starter motor? Or am I missing something here? (They're certainly cheap, though.......)



I am building the adapter plate to put a G86-21 Boxster six speed behind my 964 motor. I will be documenting the whole process on World for everyone's enjoyment.

Yes, there is an issue with locating the starter. I have it worked out in my head, but that plan is subject to change when the plan contacts reality.


Oh that would be awesome..


Yes a boxster has no provision for a starter, I really don't see how you can do it.
I have a 1999, 996 trans here which I believe is the same trans (at least same case), I can post pic's if you like.
I'll take a look at it right now.
mepstein
I'm not interested in a boxter trans for my car. I'm moving forward with the 911 trans and the parts needed that make the cable shifter work. Stay tuned. smile.gif
larryM
check this - apparently Martin's parts ???

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/pts/6146003135.html

Porsche 915 to 916 Side Shifter Conversion Tooling and Parts.
Description:
1 Set Detail Machining Drawings
1 Set San Casting Patterns
2 914-6 Firewall Engine Mount
3 Rear Castings
1 Machined Rear Casting.
3 Machined Side Shift Housing (One Is Assembled)
3 Internal Shift Arms ( 2 with Shafts)
Total Price $5,500.00.

who among us is the seller?

p,s, - i have the complete Bott kit & a rebuilt 915 on the shelf - but have never had the compulsion to do the conversion since i have 3 good 901's & they'll handle 250hp which is all my 3.2 makes



QUOTE(rgalla9146 @ Nov 5 2016, 05:42 PM) *


I wonder if Martin Bott would sell his side shift parts separate from his complete 916
conversion kit ?
The trans can be supported with a fabricated rear mount (which someone already makes)and the 915 rear cover and selector shaft can be trimmed to clear the muffler.(or not ?)
If so, the only fabrication is the shift rod which is pretty straight forward and getting it to coordinate with a 915 shifter. Oh yeah, clutch cable too.
PS I have the whole setup from Mr. Bott and already did the trans conversion
Steve
Looks more like a poor copy of the vellios kit.
porschetub
QUOTE(larryM @ May 30 2017, 03:45 PM) *

check this - apparently Martin's parts ???

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/pts/6146003135.html

Porsche 915 to 916 Side Shifter Conversion Tooling and Parts.
Description:
1 Set Detail Machining Drawings
1 Set San Casting Patterns
2 914-6 Firewall Engine Mount
3 Rear Castings
1 Machined Rear Casting.
3 Machined Side Shift Housing (One Is Assembled)
3 Internal Shift Arms ( 2 with Shafts)
Total Price $5,500.00.

who among us is the seller?

p,s, - i have the complete Bott kit & a rebuilt 915 on the shelf - but have never had the compulsion to do the conversion since i have 3 good 901's & they'll handle 250hp which is all my 3.2 makes



QUOTE(rgalla9146 @ Nov 5 2016, 05:42 PM) *


I wonder if Martin Bott would sell his side shift parts separate from his complete 916
conversion kit ?
The trans can be supported with a fabricated rear mount (which someone already makes)and the 915 rear cover and selector shaft can be trimmed to clear the muffler.(or not ?)
If so, the only fabrication is the shift rod which is pretty straight forward and getting it to coordinate with a 915 shifter. Oh yeah, clutch cable too.
PS I have the whole setup from Mr. Bott and already did the trans conversion



Good points really is the 901 that bad,even if you exceed 250hp it is cheap enough to replace or adjust your driving style.
The 915 isn't the total answer in fact the real 911 guys grizzle about them,they aren't as strong as expected and a very noisey....not such an issue in a 914 but in a 911 not so good.


ChrisFoley
QUOTE(Steve @ May 30 2017, 12:26 AM) *

Looks more like a poor copy of the vellios kit.

I think those are unfinished Vellios parts.
GeorgeRud
Vellios had some great ideas, and his 915 trans conversion works well if carefully set-up. It was a 914 rear cover with the mounting ears and then a 914 side shifter type of linkage. He made all sorts of interesting parts back then, not just the 915 conversion. Does anyone still have a copy of his catalog?
Steve
QUOTE(Racer Chris @ May 30 2017, 05:39 AM) *

QUOTE(Steve @ May 30 2017, 12:26 AM) *

Looks more like a poor copy of the vellios kit.

I think those are unfinished Vellios parts.

I heard he passed away. There were piles of unfinished vellios parts on eBay. I think MB911 bought some of the unfinished oil tanks. The shift console looks like a vellios part versus Martin Botts 916 console.
Beach914
Not doing anything with it at the moment but next after I get my 3.0L project further along.
Going to need lots of help from Steve......
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment
Steve
QUOTE(Beach914 @ May 30 2017, 06:49 AM) *

Not doing anything with it at the moment but next after I get my 3.0L project further along.
Going to need lots of help from Steve......
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment

Nice!! Looking forward to it.
larryM
QUOTE(porschetub @ May 29 2017, 11:23 PM) *

QUOTE(larryM @ May 30 2017, 03:45 PM) *

p,s, - i have 3 good 901's & they'll handle 250hp which is all my 3.2 makes


.... really is the 901 that bad,even if you exceed 250hp it is cheap enough to replace or adjust your driving style.

The 915 isn't the total answer in fact the real 911 guys grizzle about them,they aren't as strong as expected and a very noisey....not such an issue in a 914 but in a 911 not so good.


- i gently use 1st to get up steep drives & such - but that's about all it is good for even behind a 1.7

i have an acquaintance who ran a chevy 350 in an scca 914 - never broke it - he is a former PCNA employee - it was his advise that convinced me me stay with the 901

as discussed elsewhere on this site - the main problem with a 901 is if you rev to 6000 & drop the clutch in 1st gear - it will twist off the mainshaft - when we AX, we all just start in 2nd gear - and stay there - kinda like having an automatic! - a good-stronger-durable clutch helps

for we on a budget - the 901 is an OK conversion solution vs $10K for a 915-916

904 mainshafts can solve that - but they are/were rare as hen's teeth - one FS on ebay now - $1200 - there was someone making repros back in 2008 -
repro here for $1415 - https://retro-sport.com/porsche-gears/porsc...haft-new-albins

901s are also subject to wear in the intermediate plate (i broke 2 due to that when racing) - there is a fix for that - originally developed by Dwight Mitchell for 911's https://www.google.com/search?q=901+interme...-8&oe=utf-8

both above mean a rebuild, of course - but still arguably cheaper than a 915 rebuilt PLUS Bott kit

- 915's are subject to similar wear issues in the side plates & i know of 2 guys who got cheap 915's for a 914-conversion & wound having to rebuild 'em beyond the ring-gear flip (no longer cheap)

so it's kinda a tossup depending on how rich you are feeling, or actually are

- if we are talking about converting a 4 to a 6, the economics are not there - imho -4 conversion cars are never worth enuf to justify the added cost

p.s.- interesting about those C-list parts - i kinda wondered if it was somebody's attempt to steal someone else s work given the included drawings
naro914
Our race car "Papa Smurf" has a 915 with Vellios conversion that was set up really nice. Got the whole thing for $2000, so it was worth it. Definitely the best shifting race 914 you'll drive....feels almost gated and inspires confidence with each shift....though "Huey", our street car with 3.2 engine and 901 trans also shifts amazingly well...

Having said that, if Clay ever figures out a good Boxster S trans w/cable shift conversion, I'm very interested....
eitnurg
QUOTE
Having said that, if Clay ever figures out a good Boxster S trans w/cable shift conversion, I'm very interested....

Ditto.
Steve
Curious what the 915 guys are running for a shifter. I'm running a renshift, but I still nick reverse when shifting from 5th to 4th. I have spent way to many hours adjusting it, so I know it's as good as it gets. If I shift from 5th, let it settle in the center plane on its own, then I can shift into 4th without hitting reverse. I heard wevo is the best. I will try that next.
GeorgeRud
I'm using the stock 915 shift console with my 915, and it works OK. I think you have to be careful with the 5-4 shift, but fortunately that's not usually a shift I need to do quickly.
naro914
QUOTE(Steve @ Jun 1 2017, 10:43 AM) *

Curious what the 915 guys are running for a shifter. I'm running a renshift, but I still nick reverse when shifting from 5th to 4th. I have spent way to many hours adjusting it, so I know it's as good as it gets. If I shift from 5th, let it settle in the center plane on its own, then I can shift into 4th without hitting reverse. I heard wevo is the best. I will try that next.

I use Rennshift and never nicked reverse or had any issues.
My set up:
Rennshift with Tangerine Racing shift linkage kit to Vellios side shift conversion.
Chris Foley made me an intermediate adjustment piece that allowed for minor length adjustment between the rod in the center tunnel to the Tangerine shift rod outside the firewall. Plus we had to make a small spacer to adapt the linkage parts to the Vellios console.
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