First, money isnt a concern. What is the BEST (easiest to use, most compact, most accurate and versitile, and factory support) data acquisition available? My research has turned up mostely motec, and Im looking for function thats as good or better than motec's SDL data logger.

Thanks in advance!

did you check out RacePak?


Price sheet...wow...not cheap

I have a Race-Technology DL90 logger, and will soon be taking part of the RT upgrade and getting a DL1. I also have a AIM MyChron 3 plus

Motec stuff is the shizzle as would be expected for that coin, but the DL 90 has proven very capable. and the AIM unit looks like a mini MoTec dash...and the AIM logs four channlels beside displaying vital stats

you can also look into

Pi
EFI
Corsa Instruments
Stack
Race-Pak

what exactly are you looking to log? Define what you need to record and build your system from there. Allow for expansion

If money is no object then wont go wrong with MoTec.. it allows expansion, and can use CAN bus tech

On a race car we support we log:

steering angle
wheel speed (all four)
shock travel (all four)
Lamda
RPM
Speed
EGT
GPS
X and Y accelerometers

and some Im sure i am forgetting..

Tim,

Do you have the Video software option?

That is too cool !!!!!

If you have a camera mounted in your car, you can watch the video and the data logging info in real time on your computer .....

This is for an engineering project, so the data acquisition is very important. Our goal is to have LOTS of data, so when we go to competition we can proove our setup to the scrutineers. We will have approx. a year and a half of track time before the first competition, so I think we'll have time to sort though all the data.

As far as data inputs, that looks like a pretty complete list. This is a small prooven engine so engine management isnt as crucial.

But thanks for the tips guys! This will give me a good head start.

Yes i can overlay the data on the video.

I have one of these that I have finished, its a HUGE file. lemme see if I can stash it on my buds site


and Matt you can spend tons of money on the Motec stuff, which is some of the best stuff available,

you can log tons of data with less expensive equipment

Okay, I know motec is great stuff and almost every team with money uses it at this competition, but there is also a cost portion of the competition where we are scored based on how much these machines cost, so if we can shed a few bucks here and there for the same result, its worth it.

Thanks for the info Tim and Mike. Now I need to crunch numbers and talk with the team.

Formula SAE is a very interesting project.

I am assuming your task. You should be looking at PI data system, it is a true engineering system in which you can attach strain gages and so forth, this is not something you will learn in 1 month so be prepared.

As for Motec, they are also one of the very best, but they can incorporate the FI system into the entire package. This is a major benefit.

I would strongly suggest someone from the team attend Claude Roelle's seminars on DA. It is truly worth better than a semester of practical experience. I found answers for questions I have had for years in the first 2 hours.

Many on this site would enjoy seeing an FSAE car. We are all mechanical junkies.

As for your Data Tasking, none of the judges will care about video representation. But they will care how and why you elected to go with carbon a-arms that are .060 thick instead of .045.

Don't forget the "package". Althought billet crankcases that house v8 600cc engines are cool, few Universitys have the resources or time. I would love to see the following.

Counter rotating Barrel valves for the intake system.

Staged Shower style injectors

Tapered tubing exhaust system

Dry sump on engine with the ability to pull 15-20 inches of crankcase vacuum

These name just a few

Look up optimum power technology they have a seat of virtual engines which is one helluva tool for engine work.

Erik Madsen

Yep, its FSAE. I wasnt trying to hide anything, I just didnt think many people knew about it.

Im not expecting a 1 month learning curve. I know this stuff is really complex and I have a lot to learn. Just becaue Ive read through Race Car Vehicle Dynamics doesnt mean I'm an engineer yet

Our team consists of 10 really dedicated engineers. I am a second year, there are a couple of other second years, but there are also two seniors on the team. One of them did the project a few years ago for an unsuccessful UCI team, but the situation has changed down here and we think we have a shot at doing pretty well. The guy who was on the team is at the Claude Rouelle seminar now, and thats why Im posting. He called me at 8am and said "matt, research data acquisition by the time I get back." I started a google search, but decided the club is a good place to start (and I was right).

Im going to try to go to the seminar in Denver in august after we get some more of the car completed. Im afraid I wouldnt fully appreciate the weekend now like I would in a few months. Our schedule is to do research, CAD, and FEA and start building on July 1st and hopefully be done by the end of summer giving us over a year and a half to test at Willow.

We're still working on our engine solution. I heard a story of a team a few years ago that built a BEAUTIFUL home made 600cc V8 and mid year they made a rule change about the starter (it must be located on board) and their car wouldnt pass tech... it was a shame.

I'll keep you guys updated, and I'll post dates of local auto-x's the team will be at if you want to come watch!

Matt,

Please keep us posted, many gearheads here and some do not know what FSAE is. I was somewhat involved with University of Missouri (at Rolla) and Worchester Polytechnic Institute on there FSAE projects as an advisor. A couple helpful hints.

Make sure you have responsibilities defined clearly and dates, if your school has any manufacturing engineer types, this will get you extra points when judging time comes.

For you as a second year you might be able to build a V8 car the key here is they take smaller "breaths" of air (if you will) than a 600 and through that puny 20mm restricter you need to take small gulps, thats why no one builds a 600 cc single cylinder. Many of the best cars start with a second year student with ideas and the car morphs as the student gets to 3-4, and ah 5th year. As for the V8, if you use 2 FZR400 Yamaha cylinder heads, and make the bore/stroke oversquare you will have excellent Hp potential. I have thought of this motor for awhile. The heads are downdraught. And if you really wanted to do soemthing, Mount them so the exhaust port is on top and the intake is on the bottom so the packaging will be better. If you are going to use a 600, don't go any further than a 04-05 ZX600 kawasaki engine. some people are hot on the yamaha right now, but it does not have enough torque for a car. as for the Honda, they are good, but not the K brand. Suzuki, down to the Honda. As for other ideas.

Ceramic bearings in the trans will get you another 2-3.0 hp , just 4 transmission bearings. A real valve job WILL make a difference, I would suggest ATTACK performance on the Kaw motor, Dan Kyle if you do a Honda, Graves motorsports if you do a Yamaha, and Mike Fargnoli of Altantic Motorsports (in Rhode Island) if you do a Suzuki.

Many of the D sports racers have chain drive differential which are adjustable for % of slip and so forth.

Don't forget to get a marketing guy/girl (better to have a girl, you look like you are equal opportunity) this would be someone that will get corporate sponsorship for your program, they will research companies and put together sponsorship packages, cuse the more money you have the better, but also judging will address this issue. The more you look like a F1 team the better we were told.

Next, many teams fail do to not following the rules and providing a "package". No package no win.

WHOS gonna drive, if you don't have a driver you don't have shit. We held a contest and had about 40 guys show up. The dude that won was an autocrosser and he really could drive.

Reverse engineering some of the car will help a bunch.

Look at the scoring catagories: and break them down into groups/ Engine chassis/HP etc then determine how you will attack each group to maximize your score.

lastly:

When I was in school I hated history, poor grades, until (many years later) I realized that when I knew where everyone had done well, or not, I could avoid their mistakes and elevate my game above theirs. So someone needs to be a previous team researcher. I would start by getting all the back issues of Racecar engineering.

I also think the engine could be used as a stressed member and with the addition of a couple tubes to triangulate the rear end, I would engineer the suspension to hang from the engine assembly. Just a thought.

Good Luck,

Erik Madsen

PM me here if you have any questions.

I would definitely go with Motec! That's just what I am used to and I love it.

Erik, I had the opportunity to work closely with Claude this year, super nice guy. Absolute pleasure to work with, don't think there is a bad bone in that man's body.