So I picked this up in Van Nuys and it's down to just the shell. Doors, hoods, well everything off the car. Rust cut out and repaired and next week the dustless blaster get's here and then I epoxy primer the car.

Now, that being said, the original color is L-80E which is Ivory White. I have read ALL of the threads and no one actually has the new paint formula to share here in the forums. My paint supplier told me to bring in some paint off the car. that's impossible as it sits 3' off the ground and ready to strip. I've been told to buy a quality paint (learned that lesson with my last car) and was told to get Matrix because PPG does not make a two stage that matches that L-80E number. Is there anyone who has sprayed a newer paint that feels the shade matches the original Ivory White? If so can you recommend the brand and formula?

Second thing is my car has the black undercoat along the underside but behind the rockers is white. I assume that the car was originally completely painted white as I see it under the black coating. I was planning on hitting some spots with some clear POR15, let dry of course, then entire car with PPG DP50LF with 401 Catalyst, then sealing all the seams with Wurth Seam Sealer GR1019. Then hit the underside with Raptor bed liner (Black) as many here have good things to say about it.
Any flaws or experience here from you guys that can share your experiences?

So my 73 is after the serial number denoting the black sills meaning I should have the black and mine are aluminum. I got two window/trim sets with the deal. One is polished Aluminum and the other is polished aluminum that has been either painted black or anodized black??? Is the black one correct? I can't imagine they would just paint those sills as they take some serious abuse but what did they use? The glove box lock was also painted black and that seems weird to me. I soaked it in brake fluid and it's of course chrome and looking good but was it black as well? It has the original center console with the correct gauges and I recently purchased a correct 150 silver dot speedo for the car. Are there any other 73 2.0 secrets that I might be missing?

On a side note, I called Porsche in Atlanta and they took my vin and engine/trans numbers and the car is numbers matching. The engine and trans are out of the car and appear to be complete. No compression out of #3 (Figures right?). If memory serves me, do the valves sometimes get stuck? This engine has sat for years and years. I guess it really doesn't matter because I'm planning on new rings and some head work (minimum). It will go to the machine shop for some thorough measurements.

Oh yeah, can you get a repo door sticker that has the vin in dot matrix form? Mine is ok but I'm not sure how to protect it from the blaster other than have him not get near it.

Thanks for reading.

Rust-Oleum Canvas White is an exact match to light ivory. You can do a spray out on a piece of metal and have the paint shop color match it . I have an original headlight door that I compared to this color.

Light Ivory is a great color on a 914 IMHO. A 1973 914 2.0 is a good starting point for a build as you may well know.

Yes, the stickers are available, SoCalAndy was making them, but there may be others doing them now.

The window trim should be shiny, not black. And......

Best chance for a match is spectral analysis of original paint. Two stage does present some challenges.
With my 356 the painter and I went to a lot of effort to match the original color. We obtained a spray card from John Willhoit. Ended up using areas of the car like the glove box door to get a reading. Spray outs and some tweaks and he nailed it.
I have an Ivory ‘67 911 (6604). No trouble other than the usual “let’s try it again” with spray outs.

https://goo.gl/images/NmO4s6

Carbone makes VIN decals
http://car-bone.pl/?s=Vin+decal&post_type=product

I have about 1/2 gal of R-M Limko base mixed in L80E. If you’re interested in the mix formula off the can let me know. I used this to paint a 1973 914 in light ivory in 2013. I also have lots of photos of the car if you want to see the color.

Guy

Click to view attachment

This little guy is an exact match to my original paint trunks. You can probably find one of these someplace.

Downerman -

See my blue notes in your message quote below, then the links for PPG & Glasurit mix codes for L80E "Light Ivory" (ignore all other names for the color that paint mfgrs use).



For the old school PPG & Glasurit paint cards with the mixes, you have to jump around MYs to get the L80E & have to use the VW version - since they don't seem to list any Porsche ones online that I've found so far for my own 73 L80E. The 914s were all made & painted at the VW Karmann plant anyway, & initially the 914-6's used the Porsche 1110 Porsche paint code (for "Light Ivory with Black" for the Targa top in black), while the 914/4's used the VW paint code of L80E for "Light Ivory" (the official "Ivory" for VW & Porsche is a darker & more yellow-pinkish color). Eventually they went with the L80E only in the 73 MY IIRC anyway.

Since L80E was exactly the same color & mix for all MYs 1970-76, you can use info from any MY, & there was no difference between VW & Porsche paints/codes.

Here is what I've found in my own L80E paint code research:

> For some reason this website doesn't list L80E in their PPG charts -
http://www.autocolorlibrary.com/aclchip.as...swagen-pg01.jpg

But they do in other 70-76 MYs here -

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1976-Vol...9121.1524935589

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1976-Vol...9121.1524935589

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1975-Vol...9121.1524935589

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1975-Vol...9121.1524935589

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1975-Vol...9121.1524935589

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1970-Vol...9121.1524935589

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1970-Vol...9121.1524935589

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1970-Vol...9121.1524935589

http://images.tcpglobal.com/chips/1971-Vol...9121.1524935589

Print the above out &/or save to your computer for future reference.---^


http://www.autocolorlibrary.com/aclchip.as...swagen-pg01.jpg

http://paintref.com/cgi-bin/colorcodedispl...973&rows=50

https://www.uniquecarsandparts.com.au/colou...ch_porsche_1973

http://p914.com/p914_paint_73.htm

http://p914.com/p914_paint_L80E_72.htm

Good Luck!
Tom
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Interesting. My '73 2.0 has black plastic sill plates. It's possible they were replaced by a PO but I have all the receipts for the car from 1976 on so they would have to have been replaced within the first 3 years after manufacture.

Thank you all for the great information. I think I will leave off the undercoating living out here in Monterey area. Also with respect to the black sill plates. The 914 book by Dr. Johnson (and I have no idea how it's perceived in the 914 factual world) say's that in 1973 after serial # 473 291 8919 they were black plastic. Hoping to shed some light on comment below.

Interesting. My '73 2.0 has black plastic sill plates. It's possible they were replaced by a PO but I have all the receipts for the car from 1976 on so they would have to have been replaced within the first 3 years after manufacture.
[/quote]

Thank you Tom. Let me digest this. With respect to paint. I have had bad luck with single stage working in my garage and good luck in the way past with two stage so I'm going to go with the two. Not sure which are which in all of your links but I will dive into it tonight.

My 4732924778 has black plastic.

That works. I'm 473 291 8937. I have the 1st edition of that book but never noticed the VIN cutoff, will look again. Thanks!

I'll check with some other 914 experts to see about the door sills to be sure.

If they did start the change before the 74's, then it's another example of a floating equipment changeover starting outside of the model years, albeit in this case with the earlier MY using parts from the bin intended for the next MY.

My 73 had the late front 2 bleeder calipers, while the rears are the early single bleeder flavor, & I had the 70-72 chrome window cranks originally - & being the 2nd owner since 1975, I know that's the way they came from the factory - but that was an example of finishing out parts from the earlier MY - rather than early use of later MY parts.

I'll correct my info if I find out different info.

Dr. B has been caught on some incorrect info in his 914 book, but he's actually a super 356 expert on those with that crowd. Since the factory was not always diligent on records & dates, etc., it's not uncommon to have a few mistakes. However, he may be right & I may be wrong in this case. I'll check.


Tom
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IMHO:

Aluminum sills look better and more vintage/German/Porsche to me.

I'd use aluminum.

Okay, so I stand corrected (or sit) - according to another 914 guy whom I know:
"in june of 73 the strips and thresholds were switched to black plastic from bright aluminum"

However, I wouldn't be surprised if the actual VINs were all over the place, since they didn't always track with mfgr. & VIN sticker dates. So don't be surprised that some VINs prior to Dr. B's number above have black plastic sills/strips if the VIN sticker date was in June, nor if some later VINs were dated prior to June & have aluminum.

For example, I know of another early 73 2L which has an earlier VIN number than mine but the date is September 72, whereas mine is in August 72.

For Downerman & others, you could translate your Chassis Number to the build date (see below), & if it comes out to be May 73, then your's may have had aluminum originally.

Click to view attachment
^ Note that all MYs are WWD95XX 1970-76 AFAIK; & that 95 is the Karmann plant denoter, & if they added +1 to 96, that is to denote a 100's car made that day, +2 97 is 200s, etc. Also, you count it as week #1 even if only Jan. 1 is in the first week. Use a googled calendar for 1973 (or another year of mfgr if your VIN date is different - for others decoding).

Otherwise, the only way you'll know for sure which you had, is to be the OO, or know them or be able to trace what was on there originally via PO's, since a lot can be changed over 45+/- years.

Or as Lawrence/Larmo said above, you can go with aluminum if you like them better. Mark at 914Rubber makes an excellent repro set of them. The aluminum won't crack, like the plastic ones sometimes do - so aluminum are more durable.

If you're trying to do an anally perfect CW originality 914, then stick with the black sills/strips, & do single stage paint.

If you stick with black, then use black plastic rivets if you can find them, or else use the clear ones which Porsche still sells.

Also Downerman - I think that all of those paint charts are all for the single stage paint mix, but I would think that the colors/shades of paint & proportions to be used would be the same if used on a 2 stage paint, since the 2nd stage is clear coat.

And also make sure to stick with like kind clear coat - i.e.: both PPG, or Dupont, etc. - so the chemistry doesn't interact funny. My paint guy tried to use a better clear over the Dove Blue metallic on our 88 VW Westfalia, & it caused the paint to turn more grey, but he redid it for us to the original, & stuck with the same PPG color & clear.

You might want to delve into some techniques at the Eastwood website to see if you can resolve whatever was your issue(s) in shooting single stage before.

Since I'm the "King of Runs" with a rattle can, let alone a real gun - I won't even attempt to paint my cars!

Good Luck!
Tom
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My late '73 VIN #4732921258 also has black plastic.

It might be helpful if you guys with them also listed the VIN sticker date, just to see if they all fall in June 73.


Tom
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Well.... This only muddies the water again. Black plastic sills and

Click to view attachment Click to view attachment

Karmann tag translates to 04/09/73 but COA lists 04/05/73 as completion date. Car has late doors with crash bars but silver dot gauges and early window cranks, early brake pressure regulator, but IIRC, a mix of 2-bleeder and 1-bleeder calipers (don't remember which end is which without looking).

And this surprises you about our 914s Brent!!??

914s & the VW/Porsche/Karmann records are a bit loosey-goosey, & rarely will you see a COA with the Transaxle number listed, which I assume means that the source Kardex lacked it too (unless the COA person was in a hurry that day).

It's also VERY common to have the COA staff misread or mis-translate the option codes, & use a newer non-914 code result - like Pat Garvey's "Swedish Equipment" on his 72 914/4, & he swears to his wife that it did NOT come with a Buxom Blonde in the right seat when he picked it up at the dealer in 1972!

Brent - your Chassis no. 1519564 should be 15th week - 1st Day (only counting M-F, for Monday April 9th 1973) - 95 (Karmann) - 64th car built that day. So maybe either the COA person had their glasses off or was in a hurry & wrote 4/5, or maybe the guy at the Karmann plant who stamped the Karmann plates had mentally lost a few days from heavy stein tipping over the weekend before 4/9/72.

You could send the Chassis no. translation to them by email, & ask them to recheck the Kardex & correct your COA appropriately.

Unfortunately COAs are as loose on facts in many cases, as are the records - even when they have the correct information available. My COA took 3 redo's to get the interior color decoded correctly (#11 is Black with Basketweaver seat inserts, mine is #31 is Beige, but they insisted it was Black until I emailed them a document from Jeff Bowlsby's site with the codes, but they still refused to change it), & their COA manager refused to correct it until I called the PCNA Customer Care GM to get it done, & it shows "Information Not Available" for both completion date & Transmission (Transaxle) Number. They also insisted that my early 73 wasn't sold until Sept. 74 & then that it was sold new in CT - NOT California, until & emailed a pic of my CA reg card which shows 1st sold 11/9/72 in CA!

So PCNA's records leave a lot to be desired, as does their staff qualifications & customer service on a very expensive COA service where they will not give you a copy of the Kardex source document, whereas PAG in Europe will do so. To the contrary, my VW COA cost $76 IIRC, & was right the 1st time - despite there having been 10x as many Vanagons built, than 914s + 911s of that era.

FYI - I have heard that PCNA brings their computers to some of the bigger national PCA events etc., where they'll look up the digital copy of the microfilm/microfische actual Kardex. So you could get to them at Monterey or another Parade up near you in MT, etc. to have them look yours up, & have your phone/camera at the ready to snap a screen shot to print out for your car records. Otherwise, send them pix by email & ask them to correct.

Very interesting on the mix of other early & late parts, but you should check on them with the OO & PO('s) - if you're not the OO.

Mine has the mix of F late 2 bleeder & R early 1 bleeder calipers, but mine was built on 8/31/72 with 8/72 on the VIN sticker - a super fast 1 day build! ;-D

In reality the parts could've been mixed over an extended period, Porsche did Recall BO for the wheels not being the correct p/n ending -01 for the new front hub-centric hubs (self-centering hubs with the lip around the center hole), which ran through the Dec 72 production of 73 MYs. So it's possible.

I've not seen any late 73's without the silver dot gauges, but that could start a whole new discussion if somebody who is an OO who has the all black gauges now!

Early bar-less doors were only on early 73's made in up to September-ish or October-ish 1972, but then the replacement doors sold as parts were apparently mostly or all without the extra side crash protection bars - at least for some time. So I've seen some late 73-76 with the lighter late doors due to accident of shopping cart damage replacements.

Unless you know for sure that the mix of parts was on there from day 1 - your early chrome shank window cranks could be later replacements, as could be the black sills/strips, & so could the calipers - if a PO did an an exchange on rebuilts or new & they got the early single bleeder type. If you are sure that all or some of that mix was on yours from the factory, then please do post an info topic over in the O&H Forum, so that others are aware of the extent of the mix of parts throughout 73 MY.

My early 73 had early chrome shank cranks, but when one broke later in my ownership 77-ish, they only had the late black shank type at the dealer, so I replaced both to black, but have gotten an NOS set of early chromes for my current resto. So without my ownership of my car as #2 owner since Dec. 1975 (I'd seen the car since Nov. 72) - a later owner would think that it had black window cranks from the start. Similarly for the mix of early/late calipers, "light weight" early-late doors without the bars but with the later window mechanisms.

So happy to muddy the waters even more, but don't shoot the messenger!


Tom
///////

Nice and thorough Tom I'm not at all surprised the date on the COA doesn't match and wasn't terribly concerned since the dates are close; unless there is a reason I should be. On the transaxle, I have an email from Sara in my COA file that confirms the number was not recorded on the Kardex. I wanted that confirmed since "Not Confirmed" is not the same as "Does Not Match." At least nobody can claim my transaxle is not original. My COA has the color codes correct except they list the Porsche codes rather than VW codes. I thought that was interesting.

So... to the mismatched parts. The OO sold the car in 1976 to the PO that I bought the car from. The only thing I have from the OO is the warranty voucher and service record. Since the car was only 3 years old when it changed hands, I'm doubtful that many parts were swapped out before that time. I received from the PO, a stack of receipts that seems to be very thorough and include every battery, shock replacement, brake job, tune-up and even the replacement owner's manual and key she bought. So I have operated under the assumption that most, if not all replacement parts were recorded in those receipts. I can't rule out part swapping 100% but can reasonably assume low probability on most. That said, I've been jogging my memory and:

Sill plates - It seems unlikely these were ever swapped out. It's not something you expect to replace in the first three years. My VIN is just a few chassis beyond the switch over VIN listed by Johnson (I just looked, and that was in the 1st edition) but before the June date. I'm inclined the think that date may need to be backed up a bit but can't prove it for the above reasons.

Window Cranks - After thinking about this, there is a high chance these were swapped; and most likely by me. I had 3, 914s and a pile of extra cranks since those Volkswagen cranks were everywhere back in the day. This was 30+ years ago and I've gotten a lot stupider since then. If I swapped cranks, it would have been more likely I put the later crank in the 2 liter since I've never been a huge fan of chrome BUT, I know that I snapped more than one crank knob off and there is a good chance I did that with the original black cranks and just swapped in whatever was handy. So let's scratch that one off the list.

Brake calipers - This just got really weird. I was going on memory so just went down to look. I have ONE single bleeder rear caliper and the rest are dual bleeder. That seems really fishy. I don't remember ever swapping a caliper, but jeezus, it was 30 years ago and originality wasn't a concern to me then, being able to get to work was, so... . Maybe my car got the last single bleeder at the factory, or maybe my memory just sucks. I for sure have the early style pressure regulator though and definitely never touched that.

I fear I've hijacked this thread too much already, but at what point would you say the 73 MY switches from early to late. I actually celebrate the fact that mine seems to be a bit of a mutt.

No worries here about hijacking. It's all good information as far as I'm concerned.

BTW.... I had a member PM me the formula for his Light Ivory White that he painted a few years ago. The pics looked perfect and so I took the formula to my local paint shop. They mixed up a sample and it looked great. He (The owner) was also able to cross reference the original code (Something the counter guy could not do) and we compared the formula to the one they just had made. Thought it was worth making a sample. Now this newer sample was almost identical with one small change. Transparent Red and it was a very small amount. I swear sometimes things like comparing colors and listening to high-end audio is so subjective BUT I do think the later with the transparent red was richer looking. Then again, if we were to do 10 blind tests I wonder how many I would have got right. Anyway to make a long post even longer, I bought a gallon along with the PPG clear.

First things first, the dustless blaster get's here Friday. I'm done with the rust/metal work and will be spraying the DP50LF Epoxy Primer on Saturday morning. I will post some pics then and definitely when the base and clear are done.

Thans to everyone. Tom, your posts are very informative and appreciated. I'm sure I will have more questions as this progresses. Just configured a GIGANTIC order with Mark (914rubber) yesterday. This is going to be one fine 73 2.0.

As I thought Brent, the OP Downerman would find this type of info helpful, even if beyond his original questions, as he says above.

I can't say offhand how many quick stops to the dealer that I made to grab a replacement window crank when the knob snapped in my decade of DDing my 914 75-85, but it was a few. I do have all of my records12/75>, but unfortunately for then young & stupid me in my 20's & too busy with other stuff - I never persisted to get the 1st 3 years of records 11/72-12/75 & the center console back after the sale back in 75-76 (the OO removed the console for his 2 kids to sit in it), but I do have binders with all of my receipts from day one. I was in no way as anal CW then, as I'm trying to be now in my resto of it back to as close to as original - including the quirks - at this late date.

Since you did get the OO's records, you might check to see if the caliper was replaced in his time, & they may or may not have listed the p/n on the receipt to check if it was early single or late double bleeder flavor. But it might give you an answer. It being just the one, I'd lean more towards a later change out for a repair or maintenance.

As with window cranks, calipers, etc. - my bet is that there was no hard date nor VIN nor Chassis No. on the switchover on any parts at all - including the Black Plastic. However, usually it was more a case of carryover use of prior MY parts into the new MY - rather than visa versa & using parts intended for the next MY at the end of the production year.

My educated guess is that 73 & 74 MY's were the most prolific production years for the 914s - both in excess of 24,000 per MY (note that the chart at 914 info on here goes by calendar year built - not MY) - so that maybe they exceeded the expected 73 MY production & ran out of the early parts quicker in the case of the sills, or made the changeover to the less costly black plastic midway in production if the OEM supplier had already switched over to new tooling for the plastic ones.

And/or it could've been a cost driven late MY change to try to keep the entry price on the 914s lower & close to the start of the MY, due to DM to $ inflation on the prices - when the then new 73 2.0 "914S" with App. & Perf. Groups of options went from $5299 West Coast, up to $7299, so they intro'd a "914 Sport" without much of the AG & PG options to still be able to advertise a 914-2.0 at $5299 later in the MY (see Dave K's Orange 73 2L on here).

The OO or PO could've also changed the sills to black if they preferred that look - aside from wear or breakage - since they were only something like $5-10 for the full set of black plastic back in the 70's the aluminum parts set were twice that), because a 914 buddy in the `70's wanted me to switch mine, but I preferred the aluminum & the chrome cranks & door handles look.

For Downerman or anyone doing their cars - there is probably enough squishiness on dates for 914s, that they can go with a look which they prefer, & still keep it more or less period correct - since there is no definitive answers on many things.


Tom
///////

If you have time later, go ahead & post the paint formula over in the O&H Forum for others, then I'll add the other paint mix cards as pix into it too.

Have you had them shoot a sample on some metal with the clear coat on top (in case there's any color variance after clear coating) to compare on your 914 yet?

We really should have a nailed thread on O&H for paints, codes & mixes single & 2 stage, etc. over there, where eventually everybody can find their correct colors - especially with the changes to water-based paints in CA & some other states coming too.

Hint - Hint for whomever the 914 Gods on here have appointed & anointed as the new O&H Forum Moderator, now that Pat Garvey has "retired" from that duty.


Also, I think you said you were going to shoot the Wurth Schutz stone gaurd under the Epoxy, but I'm pretty sure that my paint & body guy who will be doing my resto soon (& he did the 83 one) will be doing the epoxy sealer/primer on bare metal first, then the guard Wurth Schutz under it. You wouldn't want the Schutz to chip the epoxy seal layer off at some point later on. So he'll be doing epoxy-schutz-L80E paint. I'm not sure if I'll do the black top undercoating layer though (I actually like the blacked-out wheelwells look, but most seem to prefer the factory paint look).

I look forward to seeing your results, since my L80E will be following on shortly this year (I really REALLY hope soon this year).

Good luck with the dustless blaster Friday, & work thereafter.


Tom
///////

This sounds familiar! When I started my project, I joked that maybe it was my mid-life crisis that caused me to pull my old car out of the mud and give here some love. It wasn't, but boy is it an interesting journey with lots of nostalgia. I've gotten to know the person I was back then better and how much my priorities have changed. Fun stuff.



I should clarify. All I have from the OO/First 3 years is the dealer stamps in the service record in the maroon folder. No receipts. The car's history is blank from the date it was purchased to the first service stamp after the PO purchased the car (at ~35,000 miles). After that, I have very detailed receipts which I have entered into a spreadsheet. I just looked through them again and... guess what? On 5/7/1982, at least one window crank was replace at Autothority, Inc. in Fairfax, VA. Would you look at that? No mention of a caliper in any receipts though. If a caliper was swapped, it was probably done in the first three years or a twenty something kid more preoccupied with college, work, and a new wife than preserving the originality of a car.

There is one other receipt that raises an eyebrow. A 4/18/1978 receipt from VW-Body Shop in Merriam, KS that has no details on what was done but describes themselves as a "Complete Body and Paint Shop." No doubt, that is when and where the car was resprayed and might have been a time to refresh sills. Still the VIN and plastic sills fit what Dr. Johnson wrote. I think there are mysteries this car will never reveal and I like that.

Yes Brent, many shops weren't as thorough on listing all parts & work done. If there were one or more brake jobs done when they either turned or replaced the discs (IIRC you could get 2-3 disc turnings on them before replacing), then a caliper could've been swapped too if it wasn't running out true, & no details put on the invoice other than brakes done & with a bigger $ amount than for just replacing pads & truing the discs (even if no details).

Or even if they had more than one 914 &/or a 411 or 412 in at the same time, it's conceivable that the calipers could've gotten mixed up between them (same caliper as on 411/412), if the mechanic wasn't careful or didn't care.

After the 2nd rolling resto in 80-83, mine has languished in my garage from May 85 after she was whacked in a parking structure by a ditzy gal, so it's not far off from either yours or Downerman's resurrection.

So I hear you on the mid-life thing - or late life in my case - but more along the lines of both kids are grown & gone in 2010-11, & my wife keeps saying to git-er-dun before I'm too old & can't!


Tom
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