runs great without oil filler cap. runs sucky with oil filler cap on. a bit overfilled (damn valvoline guy)....is this the reason?

better get out your tool box, a few more weeks and you'll be installing a new engine

I nominate you for a V8 conversion. I bet we could sell tickets to that.

sigh.....

mike, is the oil being overfilled the reason i'm having my problems or is it blow-by?

what's "a bit" ? lots of AX guys run a qt overfull. is it more overfull than that?
if you think it's a factor (i don't...) drain it all and add 4 measured qts.

case pressurisation is usually a symptom of something else (bad ring seal, usually) but i can't tell you how the crankcase vent hoses should be vented, and i can't begin to guess what's been done to your engine...

On a more serious note.. I doubt it's overfilling, people do that all the time for racing (so it doesn't get starved on turns). Taking off the cap is probably affecting the FI, through the PCV valve.

its carbed. i think its rings. how much air is supposed to flow through the PCV? I am getting like 1/5 teh total air out of the PCV.

QUOTE (bondo @ Jul 14 2005, 12:06 PM)

...Taking off the cap is probably affecting the FI, through the PCV valve.

through the PCV valve, across the room, and onto the bench where all the FI parts sit in a pile...

as you may (not) recall from an earlier episode of our ongoing adventure serial, BD's engine is now running on a single central Holley (or Harley, i forget...) carburetor. last i heard it was running great; now, evidently not so, ("sucky" was used...) but i may have missed an episode or two between then and now...

you gotta keep up on this stuff - it won't be into re-runs until Fall...

single carb........

do you have a line going from the crankcase to the carb or airfilter?

if so, what is happening is that the oil vapor is being ingested into the combustion chamber, oil vapor displaces air and does not burn...so you have a crappy air/fuel ratio


if the crankcase does not connect to the intake one way or another, you need to get a puke tank and a larger diameter hose to relieve the pressure....seems like an odd thing to be happening, but who knows???

I thought a PCV valve was supposed to be pretty much closed at idle.

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 12:08 PM)

... how much air is supposed to flow through the PCV?...

there isn't supposed to be *any* air...

practically, there may be a little.

if your blowby is overwhelming the PCV valve -- assuming it is the right valve, and working properly, and plumbed where it's supposed to be -- to the extent that it's affecting proper engine operation - that's too much ...

rich, IIRC the crankcase pressure has NOTHING to do with the induction system....whether carb'd or FI.

i get no oil smoke out of the exhust, so im wondering why the pressure is so high in the crankcase....

the carb episode is finished. DVD coming out soon.

How do you know what the pressure actually is?

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 12:15 PM)

rich, IIRC the crankcase pressure has NOTHING to do with the induction system....whether carb'd or FI.

i agree.

so i guess i donno what point you were trying to make.

excessive crankcase pressure will make a boxer motor run bad. it has nothing to do with the induction. it has to do with trying to compress the air between the pistons in the case.

theroretically what would happen if the oil was overfilled past the "safe for racers" point?

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 09:19 AM)

theroretically what would happen if the oil was overfilled past the "safe for racers" point?

what do you think will happen....it's called path of least resistance...if the pressure is too much, the air and oil will find a way out of the motor...blown valve cover gaskets, pushrod seals, rear main seal...etc...etc...

normally too much oil equals smoke from oil seeping past the rings or valve guides (that would have to alot of oil), esp. on a flat motor

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 09:19 AM)

theroretically what would happen if the oil was overfilled past the "safe for racers" point?

Oil hits crank, crank whips oil up into foam, foam takes up more space, so level gets even higher, and gets more foamy. Eventually your oil pump ends up picking up oil with imbedded air, which it can't pump too well, and doesn't lubricate to well. Oil pressure drops, and bearings die.

You have a dipstick, right? I've had it as high as about 1/2" above the full mark with no apparent problems. Where are you at?

less than half inch

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 11:31 AM)

less than half inch

Do you have a working oil pressure gauge?

How are you measuring case pressure?

I routinely run with oil level about 1/2 qt high, esp for HPDE events. High speed corners a'plenty at Putnam Park. I've not had a starvation issue, nor an overpressure issue on the new engine...

QUOTE (Mueller @ Jul 14 2005, 08:01 AM)

better get out your tool box, a few more weeks and you'll be installing a new engine

He's got to come get it 1st. Won't be long now ..... In this order. High oil level results in high oil pressure which leads to blowing out seals at crank or cooler. Maybe even the case plugs behind the flywheel. All of a sudden the green light goes on as a result of no oil pressure. Hence you now need my motor REAL BAD.

Nobody but me puts a wrench on my car. Some people I don't even open the engine lid to look inside.

Does this have anything to do with "How do I change oil cooler seals"?

QUOTE (mudfoot76 @ Jul 14 2005, 10:34 AM)

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 11:31 AM) less than half inch Do you have a working oil pressure gauge? How are you measuring case pressure? I routinely run with oil level about 1/2 qt high, esp for HPDE events. High speed corners a'plenty at Putnam Park. I've not had a starvation issue, nor an overpressure issue on the new engine...

i'm not measuring....it's pretty obvious. Joe the guy with the truck i will talk to today.

FYI,

real race engines will have vac. pumps installed to minimize the crankcase pressure, some work so well that you could have a 1" hole in the side of the case and not lose oil while the motor was running....

bottom line, do you have a vent hose to atmosphere for the crankcase?

QUOTE (Headrage @ Jul 14 2005, 10:36 AM)

Does this have anything to do with "How do I change oil cooler seals"?

nope...wasnt it. twas the pressure switch.

QUOTE (Joe Ricard @ Jul 14 2005, 09:34 AM)

QUOTE (Mueller @ Jul 14 2005, 08:01 AM) better get out your tool box, a few more weeks and you'll be installing a new engine  :wacko: He's got to come get it 1st. Won't be long now ..... In this order. High oil level results in high oil pressure which leads to blowing out seals at crank or cooler. Maybe even the case plugs behind the flywheel. All of a sudden the green light goes on as a result of no oil pressure. Hence you now need my motor REAL BAD. Nobody but me puts a wrench on my car. Some people I don't even open the engine lid to look inside.

I beg to differ. Oil level is unrelated to oil pressure. Oil pressure is regulated by the spring and piston arrangement in the case. The crankcase is simply a reservoir to pump oil from. It can be as high as you like as long as it doesn't hit moving parts. Once it does it becomes a low oil pressure problem. Crankcase pressure is regulated by blowby and venting. I think it's time for a leakdown test. Oil level is clearly not the problem here.

QUOTE (Mueller @ Jul 14 2005, 10:37 AM)

FYI, real race engines will have vac. pumps installed to minimize the crankcase pressure, some work so well that you could have a 1" hole in the side of the case and not lose oil while the motor was running.... bottom line, do you have a vent hose to atmosphere for the crankcase?

right now i made a hose system to vent both heads and the PCV to the fitting to the carb with a T fitting. seemed to work fine when the pressure switch was pouring oil all over the place....


but now taht i have the switch fixed other problems are creeping up. ran liek a charm until i stopped to get oil.

i really hate venting to atmosphere.....

motor honey wont fix the prob for now....

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 09:45 AM)

i really hate venting to atmosphere..... motor honey wont fix the prob for now....

is the air from the crankcase going into the intake before or after the carb??

QUOTE (Mueller @ Jul 14 2005, 10:53 AM)

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 09:45 AM) i really hate venting to atmosphere..... motor honey wont fix the prob for now.... is the air from the crankcase going into the intake before or after the carb??

before..... i dont know how to make it after.....but i figure there is more vac that way

IIRC the head vents are *intake* for fresh air into the crankcase, not *exhaust*. The PCV valve is the crankcase exhaust.

QUOTE (bondo @ Jul 14 2005, 08:43 AM)

QUOTE (Joe Ricard @ Jul 14 2005, 09:34 AM) QUOTE (Mueller @ Jul 14 2005, 08:01 AM) better get out your tool box, a few more weeks and you'll be installing a new engine  :wacko: He's got to come get it 1st. Won't be long now ..... In this order. High oil level results in high oil pressure which leads to blowing out seals at crank or cooler. Maybe even the case plugs behind the flywheel. All of a sudden the green light goes on as a result of no oil pressure. Hence you now need my motor REAL BAD. Nobody but me puts a wrench on my car. Some people I don't even open the engine lid to look inside. I beg to differ. Oil level is unrelated to oil pressure. Oil pressure is regulated by the spring and piston arrangement in the case. The crankcase is simply a reservoir to pump oil from. It can be as high as you like as long as it doesn't hit moving parts. Once it does it becomes a low oil pressure problem. Crankcase pressure is regulated by blowby and venting. I think it's time for a leakdown test. Oil level is clearly not the problem here.

Sorry I don't know what I was thinking. Maybe I don't know shit about effects of high oil level because I never experienced it.

Yea yea that's it.

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 12:44 PM)

right now i made a hose system to vent both heads and the PCV to the fitting to the carb with a T fitting. seemed to work fine when the pressure switch was pouring oil all over the place.... but now taht i have the switch fixed other problems are creeping up. ran liek a charm until i stopped to get oil.

Lose the PCV valve; it's not doing anything but constipating the crankcase. You're not set up (anymore) to utilize a PCV valve, and if you're not running a breather box arrangement, than THAT'S your problem. I'm sure your VW "mechanic" knew that, right?

One hose to each head vent tube, and one hose to the aforementioned "REMOVED" PCV port (for oil drain back). Do NOT use the plastic-crap hose you receive with the unit; it's garbage and it cracks IMMEDIATELY. The box internally vents to atmosphere (ahh, shucks), which means you'll have a trail of enviro-nazis chasing you around town. The price you pay for going to carbs.

And you thought carbs could fix anything.

The topic caught my attention, because I once had the same issue.

Oil was blowing out of the crankcase, very much like you are describing. I tried
everything to solve the problem. Breathers, checking pressure, and then the
loud tapping started. It turned out that the #3 Exhaust Valve Guide had come
loose. The Exhaust Valve was not seating properly, which caused the case to
get pressure back through the push rod tubes, is the theory I came up with.
You can check this by looking at the Valve Adjustment screws, as they will get
hammered as the exhaust valve moves more freely in the guide. Eventually,
the Valve Seat area will start to loose some aluminum, which will show up as a
nice silver paste. When I pulled the head, the valve could be moved around in
the new larger seat that the excess play had caused. Fixed the problem by
replacing the head. My issue was with a 1.7lt. head, but it should not matter.

enviro-nazis?? they dont exist anymore in KY...

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 08:00 PM)

enviro-nazis?? they dont exist anymore in KY...

Unless your state lit a bonfire and can show me the charred remains, they're breediing in every college campus across the country. Some are easier to deal with than others.

what are you on? no emissions testing=no enviro-nazis

you should see some of the cars on the road here....

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 05:15 PM)

what are you on? no emissions testing=no enviro-nazis you should see some of the cars on the road here....

NOT YET !!!!!!

every state is slowly "catching" up to CA...if the US gov. starts to mandate cleaner air, they'll force the states to clean up....it's only a matter of time....

a year ago, my county DROPPED emissions "smog" testing.......

other counties in KY have *never* heard of smog testing.

besides its a 74--rolling exemption....

and by that time i'll have a real engine....

QUOTE (bd1308 @ Jul 14 2005, 04:18 PM)

a year ago, my county DROPPED emissions "smog" testing....... other counties in KY have *never* heard of smog testing.

Yep, MO is considering the same thing...dropping it all together. I guess they figure since the east and west coasts suck, and Texas blows, the Midwest will always have a clean supply of air........

JUST KIDDING GUYS!! (about MO dropping the smog laws... )

drill a hole in the air filter top and connect the hose from the fill tower to it to draw off the vapors. just like any old ford or chevy with a v-8. crude, messy, but it'll work. change your own oil.

k