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Before moving on I want to offer a heartfelt thank you to everyone who ever purchased anything from me, that money allowed me to complete my education and finish my degree which I would not have been able to do without your assistance.

Short Version:
So for the past few years I’ve been working to develop my own line of LED bulbs and I need your help. The 1st bulb prototype is a direct Plug & Play bulb for the BA20S bulb in our 70-74 (Round) fog light housings. I can really use your input so please check out the post and complete the 10 question SurveyMonkey survey to help with my new venture.


LED Bulb Survey


Long Version:
So after years of hiding and being on a hiatus, I’m finally back on the 914World site. In the past you may have known me as the guy in Riverside CA who used to build engines and sell refurbished parts. Fortunately, I “grew up” and moved onto a “Real” job after obtaining my Engineering degree, but unfortunately, I no longer had any time for those 914 activities due to the never-ending work hours with a Japanese automotive company and a new family.

Since graduating I’ve spent the past 10 years working for a global OEM automotive manufacturer and running an engineering division within the company, and I’ve had the privilege to deal with some great suppliers, designers, and engineers. During that time I’ve witnessed how well, and sometimes how poorly the components for vehicles are designed, manufactured, and utilized. What I discovered is that when done properly the result is a very well performing component, but when done incorrectly the result is honestly quite disconcerting.
So on to the point.

About 5 years ago LED conversions and LED lamp additions started becoming more and more commonplace and I myself became more and more interested in LEDs after buying a set of bulbs online. I was even further amazed to find how poorly lighting elements were being designed and built and how poorly they would often perform. In essence the lighting elements were being designed to meet “some” spec, and the aftermarket just marketed them to the masses without any understanding of how the component would actually be used; and with regard to quality, don’t even get me started on quality levels, that doesn’t even exist for many of these manufactures! You would be amazed how many times I’ve had heated discussions with manufactures about Six Sigma, Cpk requirements, ISO practices, 5Why, 8D, or Kaizen activities just to find that most couldn’t answer the questions, and what was even scarier is that many didn’t even have any sort of quality management system in place.

I knew I didn’t know enough, I mean who of us does, but I did know that many of these LEDs were absolute CRAP! So I spent the next few years educating myself on how the human eye functioned and how it was affected and responded to various light wavelengths and intensities with varying ambient lighting, along with how LED element design has matured over the years. What I discovered is that contrary to popular belief, designing light emitting elements is not just as simple as sticking a LED in a housing, there are many other aspects which come into play which make a “good” vs “bad” light, and that’s what distinguishes a good from a bad design.

In 2020 during the COVID pandemic, and after running out of things to watch on Netflix & Hulu, I decided to start my own side business, I also happened to luck out and find a LED company that was selling off all of their assets so I drove across the country and picked up their equipment so I could setup my lab. I then built my lab from scratch and began to develop my 1st LED bulb based on the design and “Kaizen” principles I obtained at an OEM level. During that time I also being purchasing popular LEDs that you find on Amazon and eBay and discovered that almost all of the manufactures flat out lie about their bulb output and build quality, which quite frankly is just wrong. Bulbs that I personally tested with my lab equipment were often on the order of 40-50% of the advertised output with beam patterns that were often horrible to say the least.

Now to the 914 stuff! After 10 months of development, I’m finally down to 2 final prototype designs for my first bulb which is a BA20S Plug & Play bulb to replace the poorly performing incandescent bulbs in our 70-74 (Round) Bosch fog/driving lamp housings. I wanted to keep the fog light looking period correct so separate LED elements were out of the question, but I also wanted to have a good beam pattern. I also believe in the KISS (Keep It Simple Stupid) method of design, so the bulb is a very simple but yet robust design in order to produce a great beam pattern, high output, white light, and long life while still maintaining the period correct look of the car.

What I’d like to ask from the 914World community (if you haven’t already fallen asleep from this long dull post) is to please complete the 10 question SurveyMonkey survey I’ve attached above, and give me some feedback on this thread with regard to your thoughts on what you’ve experienced with aftermarket LED lighting for any of your cars (new or old). I truly believe it takes a village to raise a child so any input you have will be greatly appreciated, good or bad.
To give some insight on what’s been going on I’ll be adding some additional photos to show some of the details of what’s been in development over the past few years.

This is just the 1st design that I’m working on and I already have designs for 4 other bulbs in process, the goal for our new company is to release one new P/N per quarter (4 per year) and supply a full line of interior and exterior lighting for both on and off-road, new and classic vehicles.

Also, in case you’re wondering about the logo, I chose KnightBeam as our name to represent our core values, KNIGHT which represents chivalrous values such as protecting others while protecting yourself, promoting honesty, and inspiring integrity, along with BEAM to represent the focus of our product and our company.

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Here's the factory bulb output, dim with a very narrow beam pattern

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And here's a comparison of the eBay & Amazon stuff compared to the prototype (lower right), notice how the Amazon & eBay ones are just blinding blobs of light

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And I tested every bulb on the market I could find that might work, including the mods that other people have recommended. This isn't even all of the bulbs tested!

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It was amazing to find how bad these bulbs performed, most were a decent white color, but they were either dim or unfocused, and don't even get me started on the ones that were way too blue, made the lab look like a freaking smurf village!

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I made various prototypes but wasn't happy with them because I wanted a nice wide beam with no unwanted glare. After multiple attempts I finally had a design that produced a nice improvement!

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To make sure the advertised output was accurate I let the bulb thermally stabilize, and subjected the prototype to a myriad of tests to ensure it won't fail while in service.

Most manufactures I found advertise the max output which is just unobtainable, and I can't speak to their quality as I have no idea what type of QA tests they perform to ensure quality levels are met.

So in a nutshell it's a LED bulb that actually works in the Bosch fog light housings and makes it so you can actually see! This is just the 1st part I'm aiming to produce so any comments you offer will be greatly appreciated!

And if you can fill out the Survey Monkey survey that will be even better.

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/S8NFT9H

"I truly believe it takes a village to raise a child". Right... So when you have a child your going to send them to a village to be raised? Who's village?

Matt

I just did the survey. Always glad to support anybody spending the time, money, effort, blood, sweat and tears to make something for our cars!

Done! Funny, a bit leading… IMO could yield slightly flawed results…

Good luck!

Done. Thanks!

I applaud the effort and at least what appears to be a scientific approach to the solving of this problem, but I am mystified that it is being directed to fog lights for 914s. For most of us, think, our 914s are fair-weather weekend cars that rarely see the likes of inclement weather, let alone fog. I doubt the installation of a better fog light bulb is high on the needs list for our cars. I myself am using original spec bulbs in yellow-lensed factory housings, not necessarily for their effectiveness, but that they look right and proper and they work good for daytime running lights. The chance that I will upgrade to a more costly alternative is extremely low.

Thurman

Survey complete.
My plans are to convert all bulbs to LED where possible. I looked for drop in LED replacements for the BA20S with google - never found anything good. Some looked too long to fit in the shallow housing. I will be interested in a pair of LEDs once you have something.


Any one know if the stock Bosch fog housings are the same as Hella fog lights? Post #2 and #5 reference both. Are they the same and interchangeable? I am too far away at the moment to look or know what is actually on the car (1974)...

I just received some Hella Euro driving lights to "maybe" replace the rusty fogs. I have not opened them up yet to check if the bulbs are the same. Looking through the lens the bulbs seem different - maybe these bulbs have LED versions.

Not sure if I can cannibalize lenses or housings or sockets yet depending what I decide to do.

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I was looking into redoing / running a brighter fog light solution from scratch - thank you for doing this. Reach out to me if you need a guinea pig please!

-Mike

@SchantzMD
I started to do your survey but you do not have an option for pure yellow lights which is what I’m interested in. Maybe I would be the only one, but I’d like an OE clear housing with a bright yellow lamp.

Survey completed.

Survey completed and welcome back Mike.
Excited about the new product

@van b

Why not get yellow lenses?

I have a yellow car, that’s a bit on the nose for daylight hours lol. I’m going the clear lens route for subtlety and I think a purpose built yellow bulb puts out better color.

Survey done

Survey completed...

I just put halogens for my main lights but could not find a good alternative for the fog lights. Ended up buying two bulbs from AA and their a PIA to put in.

Anything that will give me a longer lasting bulb is greatly appreciated.

Thanks for all the replies so far! Wanted to share some of what I've learned and doing to make a light. Go figure, just like everything else it takes specialized tools.

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So this device is a 0.5m integration sphere with a high precision Ocean Insight QEPro 350nm-1100nm spectral radiometer coupled with calibration and auxiliary lamps, power sources, and a flicker sensor, this is a setup I built to measure actual light output (to confirm if what's advertised is accurate). It's essentially a big ball coated with a special white paint that creates a Lambertian (diffused) surface which reflects 99+% of the light inside in order to obtain very accurate measurements such as:





-Lumens (brightness "this is what you see advertised on bulbs and represents the total output with no direction or distance factors, you'll also see Lux advertised for bulbs but that's a whole other type of measurement that is dependent on beam pattern and distance")

-CRI (color quality to ensure colors are accurately depicted "Low CRI can produce altered colors at night, like a Red apple looking Orange")

-Light color (measured in Kelvin "low numbers are yellow while higher numbers are blue")

-Flicker (This can be bad and can cause headaches or eye strain "you're probably most used to feeling this effect when in an office/shop with fluorescent bulbs")

-And a bunch of other things


So basically You put a light source in the ball, calibrate the system, and poof you get a reading like below which shows what the light is actually doing.

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And for really bright lights I use this one, it's a 1.5m sphere that's good for measuring light,... or if you're a Terminator fan you can climb inside and use it to travel through time!


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And what good is something on a car if it can't withstand a bunch of shaking.

This is a vibration tester that I developed to literally shake the DUT (Device Under Test) to death. The springs and motor speed can be adjusted to provide up to a 10G impact force which helps to find any weak points in the design. During the test a 3-axis accelerometer datalogs the forces to ensure that various DUTs are tested at the same levels and the power source datalogs any power variations in the DUT.

This is actually really fun to use and it's amazing to watch how it destroys things, but boy is it loud!

Also, BONUS points if anyone can identify what was used as the core to make this (Look close for a hint)!



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And who else hates it when something gets wet or a little bit of salt and fails. This is a small water spray/salt spray test chamber that I put together to measure how the device will hold up to the normal stuff that our cars will see in the winter.

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Well if you came from my family that Village would probably reside in the insane asylum, so I'm not the one to make a call on that one!


Funny part about the OEM level that I've learned, car people like us are so small on a % level that what we like/want/need doesn't even go on their radar because they just want to make the vehicle for the masses. That's why groups like here are so great, people can find out what works for a niche and try to make something that the big boys won't even touch.

Very impressive setup, for sure! Awesome.

Don't even get me started on the blood! Was testing a 10,000 lumen (20,000 lumen Set) name brand top selling LED bulb sold on Amazon. Knew it was BS based on wattage but tested it anyway, bulb only achieved 42% of it's rated output @ 25C ambient so I thought "let me take it apart, bypass the driver, and see if the LEDs will handle the company's rated output".

Long story short, the LED couldn't achieve their advertised output and at ~65% of the advertised output it caught on fire and then shot a chunk of LED at me and burned my arm, so yeah, going to add in missing skin to your list above!


Just really irritates me when companies aren't honest about what they sell, told my wife it's like if you went to the gas station and paid for a full tank of gas and they only filled your tank up 42% full, would kind of rub you the wrong way.

Glad you found it funny, its goal was mostly in good fun! Mainly wanted to get some general input from everyone on about 3 of the questions but yet keep the rest entertaining.

Thing we've learned from 2020, life is too short to take non-life changing stuff too serious, so if you got a chuckle out of it and if I received some feedback then it's a win-win in my book!

Thanks for helping!

Glad you mentioned the main 7" lights, that's one of the other things on the radar for development. Aiming for a DOT LED assembly with a classic old school look, but with a modern beam pattern. Can't go into a lot of detail but if the design works they'll be pretty cool!

@vitamin914 Those use an H3, lots of LED options out there for those, the driving lights themselves are pretty rare these days, note that although they look pretty close overall to the US Fogs, they're a little different in size (larger by a couple mm).

Also, I'd found BA20S bulbs and had swapped them on my 4 cyl car---for the LED 'look' they were great however the light scatter was terrible and no longer focused like the fogs were with the incandescent so consider that if trying to retro the US Fogs...it might need optics on the bulb to cast properly.

I think there's a market for this, as I have yet to see a good product in this vein.

Chalk me up as one more person on 914World running the Euro 9114 fog lights. They do indeed use H3 bulbs, and I'd be curious to see an LED bulb and/or reflector for these. As seen here, the lenses are very clear enough compared to the US fog light lenses, but I'm not sure if that's better or worse for an LED conversion?

I took the survey. More importantly, I read through this entire thread. I am thinking LED Fog lamps as I can then forego headlights (electric car, and lights use kW).
@SchantzMD , very impressive experimentation and testing setups. Keep it up.

Survey completed. Looking forward to the output of your efforts. Thank you.

Very impressive setup!

Type IV out of balance crankshaft?

Survey taken, but a bit biased for some questions...

Looking forward to seeing the progress!

I'm sure looking forward to you doing this type of work for other bulbs (like H4 and other modern bulbs). I have researched and watched videos and so far have stuck with my blinding BiXenon set up. Sorry to all the night drivers in Santa Maria.