I corded my front tires this weekend.

It's true, the Hoosier A3S04's are good for about 60 a/x runs

I got 65.

I'm torn between these tires:

Hoosiers again
Kumho 710's
Avon Tech-RA's
Yoko A048-R's
Yoko A032-R's ( ran them within .5 sec of the Hoosier's )

Did I miss anything.

What should I get and why?

KT

I keep buying Hoosier because I'm afraid of being slow, my friends will laugh. Why aren't Toyo's on the list, a lot of the POC racers like them. I thought about Avon but the feedback on Tirerack doesn't sound so good and they don't have many good sizes. If you really think the Yoks are as fast as the Hoosier it depends on how much $ you save. So like a junky I keep going back to Hoosiers and whine about how much it cost me to race, as I drool over my new sticky rubber.

No personal experience, but if you look at the national results you will see: "Hoosier, Kumho, Kumho, Hoosier, etc." In our club, the guys competing at nationals are about 50/50, Hoosier (S05)/Kumho (V710). From what I've heard, the Kumho's last a little longer than the S05, but the S05 lasts much longer than the S04. If I were shopping for R-compounds, I would just buy a set of V700's...might not be quite on the same level as the hoosier or the V710, but they last a lot longer. Just like everything, It's a compromise.

QUOTE

whine about how much it cost me to race

I can do that

Got my A3S04's for $500.
That's $500 per hour ...Hello?!?

A3S05's are $800

KT

A number of Arizona PCA guys like the Toyo RA1, say it is good for both autocross and DE.

I am looking too, so interested in what others have to say.

Or about 9 bucks and change a run.
I have 10 runs on mine still Hope to get my 60 out of them as you did. I am saving them for the TLAC series. Gonna stomp a mud hole in the competition.

187 runs on V700's they are just about gone and getting fairly slippery compared to when new. still better than streets.

I wanna try the Hankook tires slick tread with 2 DOT grooves also not sure of the tread wear.

Some of the guys here have found a source for "take offs" Hoosier road race compound. about 200 bucks or so for 4 tires. around 3/32 tread on the average. Hot shot racers guys do qualifying run in them and take them off. they are getting around 80 runs before cord show. Not something to take to Nationals and be top gun but, good for the regional seat time. I DO NOT KNOW THE CONTACT.

Its a tough call. You know Hoosier AX slicks are stickiest and best DOT rated tire. Kuhmo 710 is supposed to last a little longer but you give up a little grip from everything I have read. You see the improvement in your times, Alberts times and mine since we went to the Hoosier AX tire.

I hear good things about Kuhmo Victor Racers in terms of incredible wear, but I dont think they will match the Hoosier.

I think Yokohamas are over priced unless you find them on sale which is rare.

You might take a look at the new Hankook slick.

Also the DOT road racing slick from Hoosier seems to hold up better than the AX compound. You just need to get them heated up.

I would steer clear of the Toyo RA1 for AX.

DO you REALLY need Hoosiers A compound? Just so you can whip a few more cars? I don't think I will spring for them again. The surfaces here are pretty tough on tires. V-racers are probably the best choice here. HOT and gritty.
Then there is AVON don't forget. I think it is more of a road race tire too which reguires heat to stick. We just can't build heat in these little cars for AX events.

We have Avon Tech R's on full caged 2.0 four. We run two day AX's here in Western MD. (nationalroadrally.com) and we have four drivers and five runs a day/driver. So on a normal AX weekend the tires see forty passes of around 60 secs.

This set of tires has run eight AX weekends, two test & tunes, plus 3 days at Summit Point, 3 days at Watkins Glenn, and two days at Shenandoah.

They are not quite as quick as Hoosiers but last much longer. We'd use up Hoosiers in a weekend.
They aren't as cheap as Toyo's but they stick much better.

Good bang for your buck.

710s & a water spray bottle.

QUOTE (ninepfourteen @ Aug 16 2005, 05:23 AM)

We have Avon Tech R's on full caged 2.0 four. We run two day AX's here in Western MD. (nationalroadrally.com) and we have four drivers and five runs a day/driver. So on a normal AX weekend the tires see forty passes of around 60 secs. This set of tires has run eight AX weekends, two test & tunes, plus 3 days at Summit Point, 3 days at Watkins Glenn, and two days at Shenandoah. They are not quite as quick as Hoosiers but last much longer. We'd use up Hoosiers in a weekend. They aren't as cheap as Toyo's but they stick much better. Good bang for your buck.

DAMN that's alot. actually cuts the dollars per run to a somewhat reasonable level. The way I see it Hoosiers are 3X more expensive.

QUOTE (J P Stein @ Aug 16 2005, 07:28 AM)

710s & a water spray bottle.

Based on observation and testimony of driver's using them. Most are claiming them to be stickier than Hoosiers if you keep them cool.

They will be my next set of tires.

That's it?

I need more reports

KT

QUOTE (trekkor @ Aug 16 2005, 10:18 PM)

That's it? I need more reports KT

You want reports?...get off your ass.
Go to some SCCA AXs & see what the big dogs are doing.
See why the staging lanes look like lakes

If your ass is glued to a chair, go to the national SCCA web site and look up the National Tour event results....prolly about a dozen of them have been held this year. They list the tiremaker of the cars that trophy.

Here's a local (to me) one.

http://www.scca.org/_Filelibrary/File/solo...ackwood-sun.pdf

710s are kickin' ass at these events in classes where they are allowed.
Hoosiers are taking the slick tired classes....mostly.
What more do you need to know?

Kinda looking for testimonials...

Thanks for the link.

KT

If I had to win and price was not a concern, I would not buy the RA1s.

I buy the Toyo RA1s for the simple reason that they last a long time, stick great and cost $159 each mounted and balanced. They are used for both track and autocross events. On my old 914 1.7L, they lasted for 1 1/4 seasons of a combined 7 autocross and 8-9 track events. On my large displacement 914, they last for 1/2 of a typical season's events. This includes hundreds of miles of flat-towing to and from events.

I have several TTODs on the Toyos vs the Khumos, Hoosiers and M-Pilot Sports. This is not entirely due to tires, it's really hard to beat a light-weight 3.6L 914.

P.S The previous owner of this car had lots of TTODs (PCA GGR) on M-Pilot Sports vs the other tire companies. The Pilot Sports are also great combination ax/track tires, but they cost twice as much.

Thanks!

The Toyo's are a great tire. The Speed GT sports cars all run them and so do the 911's in the west coast Spec class called "ToyoCup".

Treadwear of 100.

KT

I believe the RA1s have a tread wear of 40. I'll check when I get home tonight.

You're right. The tread wear is 100. It's amazing that they are so competitive.

QUOTE (Wild 6 @ Aug 17 2005, 05:36 PM)

I believe the RA1s have a tread wear of 40. I'll check when I get home tonight.

With cooler temps in California and lighter cars the RA1's dont appear to get up to operating temps in AX. I have talked to a couple people about these tires and general consensus is they are a good track tire, but a poor AX tire compared to similar r compounds.

Trekkor,

It all depends on what you're looking for.

The Avon's, Yoko's, and Toyo's all fall into the same category: "They suck for a really long time". They're great track day and DE tires. They last long, provide predictable grip throughout their life, and tollerate abuse pretty well. The Toyo's are great tires, and they were chosen for the Speed series partly for their durability, and partly because Toyo ponied up the right amount of dough to be the series sponsor. They used to run the Toyo Proxes (street tire) in the speed series, but have recently switched to the RA-1 (DOT Race Tire) probably because in par tthe drivers were getting fed up with driving full blown race cars on street tires.

If, on the otherhand, you're looking for a winning autox tire, it's hard right now not to go with the Kumho. Hoosiers have had the stuff for a number of years now, but Kumho has 'em out done this year. The 710 is THE killer tire in autox. Even for the small cars. It needs to be sprayed down if it gets too hot though. The Hoosier has fallen from its roost. To give you an idea, I know at least 5 *Contract* Hoosier drivers that dropped 'em in favor of Kumho's because they kept getting beat by K tires...

When a 10 time National Champion drops a tire from a tire maker that's giving him FREE tires, there's something going on...

-Josh2

Wild 6,

Can you tell me where you get Ra1's mounted & balanced for $159? What size were they? I am trying to grind my local Les Schwab tire store for a deal.

Thanks

QUOTE (J P Stein @ Aug 17 2005, 05:27 PM)

QUOTE (trekkor @ Aug 16 2005, 10:18 PM) That's it? I need more reports KT You want reports?...get off your ass. Go to some SCCA AXs & see what the big dogs are doing. See why the staging lanes look like lakes If your ass is glued to a chair, go to the national SCCA web site and look up the National Tour event results....prolly about a dozen of them have been held this year. They list the tiremaker of the cars that trophy. Here's a local (to me) one. http://www.scca.org/_Filelibrary/File/solo...ackwood-sun.pdf 710s are kickin' ass at these events in classes where they are allowed. Hoosiers are taking the slick tired classes....mostly. What more do you need to know?

Here's another link... If you want to go fast, run what the fast people run. A couple people from our club on the list: 4th in C-stock on Kumho's, 5th in E-stock on Kumho's, 3rd in Street mod on Hoosiers, and 2nd in Street mod II on Kumho's. Pick your poison...

http://midivsolo.stlsolo.org/Default.aspx?tabid=315

QUOTE (retrotech @ Aug 17 2005, 05:51 PM)

Wild 6, Can you tell me where you get Ra1's mounted & balanced for $159? What size were they? I am trying to grind my local Les Schwab tire store for a deal. Thanks

Try www.froogle.com it will get you pointed to best prices.

This is all very interesting.

I was talking to a Toyo distributor today.
I told him my YokA032's we're only a half second off pace of my Hoosiers.
He said the Toyo's grip better than the Yok's.

As for the 710's, one of my local 914 competitor run's them and has consistantly beat me by 1.5 seconds each event.
This last a/x I got him by over a second.
Even on the Yok's I got him.

The Toyo's and Yok's are tempting due to their wear, abilty to work in the wet and dual use as track/ax tire.

Still not sold.


KT

Just got a call back from Am Tire Co.
$150 plus tax each mounted. Toyo...


KT

how about some *real* schlicks?

I beat a guy on them, too...

KT

BTW, I'm also considering Hankook schlicks as well

QUOTE (trekkor @ Aug 19 2005, 04:51 PM)

I beat a guy on them, too...

just wait until i get my suspension worked out ...

Andy

PS: yes, you beat me. by 1/10th of a second. with my swaybar broken. don't get used to it!

QUOTE (trekkor @ Aug 19 2005, 03:37 PM)

This is all very interesting. I was talking to a Toyo distributor today. I told him my YokA032's we're only a half second off pace of my Hoosiers. He said the Toyo's grip better than the Yok's.

Well there ya go.. Get the Toyos.
Salesmen always give me the straight scoop.

The best price for Toyos in Metro Phoenix is Chapman BMW. My tire size is 17 x 255. They are $159 mounted and balanced. The smaller sizes are $20 cheaper per tire. Chapman sells over 300 sets of Toyo RA1s each month. Ask for Brian Shakleford.

P.S. If you are wondering, I get no benefit out of this so buy the tires that are best for you.

Hey Guys,

What do you know about the Dunlop Super Sports? They have a 60 treadwear rating...

I'm thinking of mounting them on my S2000 and making the rest of the GGR / LPR / Zone AX's for the remainder of the year...I don't want to waste out my Bridgestone SO3's...so I could mount the Dunlops and still drive the car around town, auto-x and then throw them away when the rain starts.

And Tire Rack has a close out on them for $115 for the fronts and $125 on the backs...

What's the collective say?

Bill P.

honestly, i'm thinking i'm gonna go 'back' to Vracers for now, as i'm trying to budget kart racing in '06. Vracers are just plain indestructable, and stick "okay". plenty durable for trackdays, at that. i'm thinking i can squeeze 225/50s under my fenders.

Bill, fantastic! Can't wait to see you back out there.

Joe Hoppa put up a 6th place overall in his S this last a/x at Marina.

KT

I'll look at the Dunlop's, too.

Anybody want to sponsor/semi-sponsor me?

You get the prime space on the sweeper dam.

KT

Bill,
I had two set of Dunlop SSRs on the Boxster. Last year had 225 and 245 17s and this year had 225 and 265 18s. Pretty good tire. Not quite as sticky as Victoracers or others at the AX, but not bad. Better than streets and they wear pretty good too.
Actually a better tire for the track. Did great on the Boxster at TH and BW.
Larry Sharp and I ran nose to tail at Both tracks, me in the Box and him in YPAF.
I would get him into and thru the corners, he would pull me on the long straights. Overall our cars were probably within 1 second per lap.
Good tire at a good price.
Trekkor, they didn't make SSRs in 15s. They were intended for the new cars with larger wheel diameter. Unfortunately Dunlop decided to discontinue them so there aren't many left.
Sorry about slight hijack Trekkor.
Going to buy some Fuchs tomorrow from Tony in SC.
By the way Trekkor where did you get the 4 bolt 7s from. I might be interested in those for track tires next season.

The 4 bolt 15x7's were a quirk find at Parts Heaven.
they wanted $100 and I offered them $50. They bit.

They are custom welded stock steel centers into 7"rims.

KT

Dude those are absolutley gorgeous. I know you will really like the wider wheel what do you thin they wiegh? what tire is that? SWEET!!!!

Glad you like 'em.

They weigh in at 22#'s and those are my Hoosiers before cording.

KT

QUOTE (nebreitling @ Aug 19 2005, 05:06 PM)

honestly, i'm thinking i'm gonna go 'back' to Vracers for now, as i'm trying to budget kart racing in '06. Vracers are just plain indestructable, and stick "okay". plenty durable for trackdays, at that. i'm thinking i can squeeze 225/50s under my fenders.

Wouldnt you want to go with 225/45/15? I know quite a few of the R compound tire makers make that size and you would have more choices. That was going to be my next choice in tire size.

Will the 225 fit?
With 5"backspaced rims I think it would be ok up front.
More rear fender rolling, huh?

KT

I seriously don't know how you guys are getting those tires under your fenders.
my 205/50 Hoosires required ALOT of fender bending. Yea I spread them out on a 15x8 rim with 4 1/2 inch back space. But the damn things were like 2 inches past the fender with rolled lips.
the fronts interfered too.

QUOTE (Joe Ricard @ Aug 21 2005, 12:16 AM)

I seriously don't know how you guys are getting those tires under your fenders. my 205/50 Hoosires required ALOT of fender bending. Yea I spread them out on a 15x8 rim with 4 1/2 inch back space. But the damn things were like 2 inches past the fender with rolled lips. the fronts interfered too.

Not all 914's are created equally and are you sure your rims have 4 1/2" of backspacing.

Yup 4 1/2 inch back space and the tape don't lie. There really isn't THAT much room to the inner fender well either. Less than an inch. I think the only difference is my car is REALLY low and the top edges of the tires further up into the fenders. I just got my 15x8 Diamond wheels 5" back space and it is 3/4 inch to the inner fender well. I am pretty sure anything over a 205/50 Hoosier will rub.

AUGGH.
Sure, they'll fit, no problem.