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Sounds like a great way for EV's to pay their fair share
SirAndy
https://dot.ca.gov/programs/road-charge
shades.gif

PS: Y'all get exactly one warning: Do NOT make this thread political.
Optimusglen
edit - nevermind, found the other page with FAQs.
windforfun
This reminds me of the old NY State Thruway. Your toll was based upon how many exits you drove past. They even took personal checks if necessary.

nathanxnathan
I think a better idea would be to make weight of a vehicle play a bigger part in how much it costs to register a car. It directly affects how much impact the car has to the integrity of the road. Also, the heavier the car, maybe the more safe you are, but it makes others less safe. Cars getting bigger, heavier, taller makes driving a normal car more difficult. I generally can't see anything backing out of a parking space in my daily VW Golf on account of every other car here being an suv. Cars are just getting bigger and bigger every generation. The new electric trucks coming out are absurdly heavy.
Montreal914
Without getting political, it makes sense to me; you use, you pay.

But, shouldn't this also be based on the weight of the vehicle, or is that portion handled on the yearly registration fee?

EDIT: I guess Nathan you replied to my question.

WOW if we want to get into the size of cars trucks/SUV, this will turn ugly (and political).

WTF.gif
Click to view attachment

https://www.theverge.com/2020/10/19/2152295...afety-oversized

Steve
They have been talking about this in CA for quite awhile. We pay several dollars per gallon of gas in taxes. EV's pay nothing. Hopefully they will you use this to even things out.
mb911
That’s sounds like a good thing.
flipb
Virginia implemented something like California's Road Charge a few years ago. They assume 11,600 annual miles driven and calculate the equivalent gas tax that would be paid by an ICE vehicle getting 25mpg.

I agree with the idea of making it based on miles + vehicle weight. Not sure about other states but Virginia already has a mandatory annual inspection of all registered vehicles (except historics). It would be pretty easy to record the odometer, and then mail a bill based on miles driven * GVW.

Also, somehow I can't help but laugh that a forum of 914 enthusiasts all agree that vehicles should be taxed based on gross weight. happy11.gif
burton73
From California’s own Road Charge site


Best Bob B
Click to view attachment
VaccaRabite
Hah. If adopted nationally I could see this absolutely killing EV sales almost overnight.

And if they REALLY feel that every vehicle under 10,000lbs does the same damage... I don't see how my 6000 pound 4Runner could possibly do less road wear then a Honda Civic.

Zach
technicalninja
The interesting data would be the percentage of road wear the under 10 crowd creates VS the above 10K.

Does it step up dramatically at a higher weight?
Might it will be a multi-tiered rate that is the fairest...
How did they test this?

The transport crowd will pitch a fit!

Not really fair to have the Electrics pay nothing however...

Glad someone else has the job of coming up with this stuff.

Not one I want...

nathanxnathan
QUOTE(burton73 @ Jun 3 2024, 10:39 AM) *

From California’s own Road Charge site


Best Bob B
Click to view attachment


Just a little research on that as it makes no sense, "The standard calculation is that road wear goes up as the square (conservatively; fourth power is well documented for heavy trucks) of the weight. So the Hummer (9500 lbs) causes about 100 times the damage of a Prius (3000 lbs). Even at the conservative second power, it causes 10 times as much damage. Heavier vehicles of course also require that bridges be built for heavier loads, increasing their built cost as well as maintenance."

according to this articlehttps://gettingaroundsac.blog/2023/12/16/road-charge/

Hard to swallow that it would be the same. Easier to believe 10x or even 100x imo
wonkipop
the govt. just attempted such an EV levy in my state down here.
it was challenged in court successfully by the hybrid vehicle owner lobby and has been withdrawn.

the govt. messed up its levy. it applied the same levy to hybrids as it did to battery EVs.
hybrid lobby proved the formulas were unjust as they did not account for fuel excise they already paid when they filled their tanks covering road use.

battery EV owners got a reprieve.

but its coming for sure. just that bureaucracy down here needs to exercise a bit more brain power in terms of fee scale.
the first go at it was fixed as part of registration fees. odometer declerations were required as part of annual road registration fee.

SirAndy
QUOTE(nathanxnathan @ Jun 3 2024, 11:18 AM) *

Hard to swallow that it would be the same

I think what they are really trying to say here is that anything under 10k pounds is peanuts compared to a loaded semi truck (40k-80k).
idea.gif
wonkipop
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 3 2024, 01:36 PM) *

QUOTE(nathanxnathan @ Jun 3 2024, 11:18 AM) *

Hard to swallow that it would be the same

I think what they are really trying to say here is that anything under 10k pounds is peanuts compared to a loaded semi truck (40k-80k).
idea.gif


yeah

road crews are always out fixing the left hand lanes of the interstates here.
(read that as right hand lane in your mirror world).
they get pounded into destruction by the semis.

as an aside the cops down here are pushing for bikes and electric scooters to also pay a road use registration fee. ok they are pretty light weight, but the argument is that portion of the road dedicated to bike lanes etc still requires maintenance.
the rise of the dedicated bike lane has opened new cost obligations and cars can't use it.
Montreal914
laugh.gif What next, sidewalk and pedestrians? Dogs?
914_teener
I have a 2022 Maverick registered and plated in CA. It weighs 3,600 lbs and gets 29mpg regularly.

It has a bed on a unibody chassis. Since it has a bed in is a commercial vehicle.


If I'm not using is as a commercial vehicle I shouldn't have to pay the extra tax.


I agree with a use tax but it's gonna be hard to justify to commercial tax when you have a general driving use tax.

You should pay what you use and that goes for the electricity too.

IMHO.
wonkipop
QUOTE(Montreal914 @ Jun 3 2024, 01:48 PM) *

laugh.gif What next, sidewalk and pedestrian? Dogs?


easy to do. tax your shoes. biggrin.gif biggrin.gif biggrin.gif biggrin.gif

dogs are taxed already down here. no tag = fine - even if leashed.
its illegal for a cat to be outside the house --- period.

jokes aside.
the bike lane one is interesting and probably has merit.
bike lobby pushed very hard for the dedicated network of bike lanes rapidly expanding across the city. roads everywhere have decreased in capacity to accomodate.
and serious numbers of bike and scooter users now commute using them.
so.......some kind of charge even nominal is perhaps appropriate.
everybody walks on the pavement. you pay your regular tazes for that.
the question of the road and its users is perhaps more particular.
for local councils there is the question of revenue loss from less on street carparking too.
so its getting kind of complex down here.
Shivers
QUOTE(wonkipop @ Jun 3 2024, 12:58 PM) *


its illegal for a cat to be outside the house --- period.



Wow, not here, they're all over the place. My neighborhood keeps them inside at night or the coyotes and the great horned owls get them.
nathanxnathan
QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 3 2024, 12:36 PM) *

QUOTE(nathanxnathan @ Jun 3 2024, 11:18 AM) *

Hard to swallow that it would be the same

I think what they are really trying to say here is that anything under 10k pounds is peanuts compared to a loaded semi truck (40k-80k).
idea.gif



That makes some sense. Here's a chart to sort of back that up — 18,000 lb big rig compared to an 8500 lb Hummer — does 20x as much damage.

Click to view attachment

My VW Golf is about 3000 lb though, according to the same chart is doing a 64th the damage of the Hummer.

So I propose I pay $1 road charge, hummer guy pays $65, big rig company pays $1213 — per 10,000 miles. Seems fair?
Montreal914
NARP 914 fits into the "smart car" category. biggrin.gif

Kind of obvious! sunglasses.gif
wonkipop
QUOTE(Shivers @ Jun 3 2024, 02:21 PM) *

QUOTE(wonkipop @ Jun 3 2024, 12:58 PM) *


its illegal for a cat to be outside the house --- period.



Wow, not here, they're all over the place. My neighborhood keeps them inside at night or the coyotes and the great horned owls get them.


yeah - feral cats that have escaped domesticity are devastating to australian marscupial wildlife. and native birds. the cat bans came in probably 25 years ago.
its had quite an effect in the city. alley cats have completely disappeared.
but they are still out there in the bush.

you still see cats sitting inside at windows sills staring forlornly out at birds hopping around in gardens (Thinkin their thoughts of you know what biggrin.gif ),
bkrantz
QUOTE(nathanxnathan @ Jun 3 2024, 03:02 PM) *

QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 3 2024, 12:36 PM) *

QUOTE(nathanxnathan @ Jun 3 2024, 11:18 AM) *

Hard to swallow that it would be the same

I think what they are really trying to say here is that anything under 10k pounds is peanuts compared to a loaded semi truck (40k-80k).
idea.gif



That makes some sense. Here's a chart to sort of back that up — 18,000 lb big rig compared to an 8500 lb Hummer — does 20x as much damage.

Click to view attachment

My VW Golf is about 3000 lb though, according to the same chart is doing a 64th the damage of the Hummer.

So I propose I pay $1 road charge, hummer guy pays $65, big rig company pays $1213 — per 10,000 miles. Seems fair?


The "big rig" is not even close. A loaded 18-wheeler weighs 80,000 lbs or 40 tons. You need to recalculate impact.
Chris914n6
QUOTE(Montreal914 @ Jun 3 2024, 12:48 PM) *

laugh.gif What next, sidewalk and pedestrians? Dogs?

Concrete is expensive these days. Put it in the air and it costs $40 million

IPB Image
technicalninja
I think they are talking about a tractor in the semi.

Lots about the list look bogus to me.

The impact of a Smart car versus a Prius seems un-believable. The Pruis does 9 times the damage and a simple Rav4 is twice as bad as the Prius.

Sounds like the author has a soft spot for Smart Cars.
If you get a chance drive one!
The first time it shifts you'll swear something broke in the drive train.
Be careful when following one. It completely drops all power before the shift and delays power return far longer than necessary. The car "nose dives" and decelerates between shifts.
Feels BROKEN when that happens.

Years ago, I banned all French cars from my bays, Peugeots and Renaults are impossible to fix and parts are rare and often don't work when brand new. The Smart Car is made in France.
Some of them have 3 bolt wheels...

"Not a Car" in my book.
There was an EV model.
One review stated, "It was so quiet that you could hear your regret!"

Who-ever came up with the chart appears to know little about cars...
They also have NO idea what a loaded semi rig weighs.
nathanxnathan
QUOTE(technicalninja @ Jun 3 2024, 06:08 PM) *

I think they are talking about a tractor in the semi.

Lots about the list look bogus to me.

The impact of a Smart car versus a Prius seems un-believable. The Pruis does 9 times the damage and a simple Rav4 is twice as bad as the Prius.

Sounds like the author has a soft spot for Smart Cars.
If you get a chance drive one!
The first time it shifts you'll swear something broke in the drive train.
Be careful when following one. It completely drops all power before the shift and delays power return far longer than necessary. The car "nose dives" and decelerates between shifts.
Feels BROKEN when that happens.

Years ago, I banned all French cars from my bays, Peugeots and Renaults are impossible to fix and parts are rare and often don't work when brand new. The Smart Car is made in France.
Some of them have 3 bolt wheels...

"Not a Car" in my book.
There was an EV model.
One review stated, "It was so quiet that you could hear your regret!"

Who-ever came up with the chart appears to know little about cars...
They also have NO idea what a loaded semi rig weighs.


It's not my chart. I got it from:

https://www.profitgreenly.com/p/road-damage-fees-and-profit

who got it from here:

https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-...-damage-levels/

In the first link the author actually corrects the big rig number, and explains that the math was wrong on account of the number of axles. The chart is based on:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AASHO_Road_Test

which I only skimmed. It's claiming that total weight divided by number of axles is where it's at to calculate damage, which seems logical. The weights check out at least. Smart Cars weighed about 1800 lb, base prius weighs about 3000, average car in the US weighs about 4300, so not far off there.

I didn't do the math, but like the first article I linked says, the damage goes up exponentially — conservatively estimating to square, up to the 4th power — somewhere between is probably the reality.
dhuckabay
The joke we have in South Africa is that the smart cars were banned from the parks. Seems like the elephants were trying to mate with them.

I have a picture of a tourist in a rental Golf. Elephant was sitting on the hood. Can bet that was a fight at return




QUOTE(technicalninja @ Jun 3 2024, 06:08 PM) *

I think they are talking about a tractor in the semi.

Lots about the list look bogus to me.

The impact of a Smart car versus a Prius seems un-believable. The Pruis does 9 times the damage and a simple Rav4 is twice as bad as the Prius.

Sounds like the author has a soft spot for Smart Cars.
If you get a chance drive one!
The first time it shifts you'll swear something broke in the drive train.
Be careful when following one. It completely drops all power before the shift and delays power return far longer than necessary. The car "nose dives" and decelerates between shifts.
Feels BROKEN when that happens.

Years ago, I banned all French cars from my bays, Peugeots and Renaults are impossible to fix and parts are rare and often don't work when brand new. The Smart Car is made in France.
Some of them have 3 bolt wheels...

"Not a Car" in my book.
There was an EV model.
One review stated, "It was so quiet that you could hear your regret!"

Who-ever came up with the chart appears to know little about cars...
They also have NO idea what a loaded semi rig weighs.
mate914
QUOTE(nathanxnathan @ Jun 3 2024, 05:02 PM) *

QUOTE(SirAndy @ Jun 3 2024, 12:36 PM) *

QUOTE(nathanxnathan @ Jun 3 2024, 11:18 AM) *

Hard to swallow that it would be the same

I think what they are really trying to say here is that anything under 10k pounds is peanuts compared to a loaded semi truck (40k-80k).
idea.gif



That makes some sense. Here's a chart to sort of back that up — 18,000 lb big rig compared to an 8500 lb Hummer — does 20x as much damage.

Click to view attachment

My VW Golf is about 3000 lb though, according to the same chart is doing a 64th the damage of the Hummer.

So I propose I pay $1 road charge, hummer guy pays $65, big rig company pays $1213 — per 10,000 miles. Seems fair?



Have any idea what that would do to your price for groceries?
Matt
Shivers
Yesterday I paid 5.05 a gallon and now they want to add .30 a mile. Ouch
Spoke
There was a pilot program in the Infrastructure bill in 2021 to charge everyone by how many miles they drove. It was put in place since cars are now powered by an energy source other than gas. Taxing gas basically taxed folks on miles driven. If the Govt goes to a per mile tax then some of the gas tax should be removed.
VaccaRabite
QUOTE(mate914 @ Jun 4 2024, 07:08 AM) *

Have any idea what that would do to your price for groceries?
Matt

IF (and this is a BIG IF) a use fee is done correctly, truckers should be paying no more in the use tax then they are in fuel tax.

But that is assuming that the fuel taxes are REMOVED, and its not just an additional tax.

Zach
Craigers17
While this might be a step in the right direction to share the burden between EV's and ICE vehicles, the burden can't be put overwhelmingly on the "Semi's" just because of weight. I agree that they are responsible for the most wear and tear done to the roads, but they also deliver the lionshare of the goods, like groceries, construction materials, etc. so that every other industry can thrive. As mentioned above, if their industry is gouged by both gas tax and mileage tax, everything we buy will go up exponentially. Just my 2 cents.....and I have no skin in the game for the trucking industry.
VaccaRabite
The issue that I see are the people (and long haul truckers) that spend as much if not more time driving outside their state as in it.

In my case, I live on the border of 2 states (Maryland and Pennsylvania.) PA is already getting screwed for me as MD gas is about 25cents cheaper a gallon, so I fill up there.

If MD sets a use tax: 1) I start paying way less in fuel and 2) MD is getting no recovery from the wear and tear I am putting on their roads. I tend to drive more in MD then PA.

If PA were to set a use tax, I probably start filling up in PA as the gas price should fall below MD - so a benefit to the gas stations in my home area. But then I get hammered with all the miles I drive in MD and other states.

I will laugh at any fool who expects to put a GPS in my car to track my mileage for the state...

Zach
nathanxnathan
My work is 25 miles from where I live, so driving to and from 4 days a week (I work from home 1 day a week), that's 200 miles a week (10,400 miles per year). I average 45 mpg so 4.44 gallons of gas/week @ $5/gallon that's $22.22 per week. If they want to charge $0.30/mile that's $60/week — almost 3x what I pay for gas already on top of gas price.

Like Spoke says, some (or all) of the gas tax should be removed, but $.30/mile seems like a lot.

California taxes $0.80/gallon, federal gov taxes ~ $0.20/gallon so say they remove it all (unlikely) so $4/gallon. 200 miles/45mpg = 4.44 gallons/week @ $4/gallon = $17.76/week in fuel, but still $60 road charge = $77.76. I could buy 15.55 gallons of gas @ $5/gal with that — more than 3x as much.

More math, I'm thinking I'd have to be getting 15.76 mpg presently to do that badly. Average mpg for normal suv driving people is probably 25 so .30 seems again like a lot.
mrholland2
QUOTE(Spoke @ Jun 4 2024, 07:31 AM) *

There was a pilot program in the Infrastructure bill in 2021 to charge everyone by how many miles they drove. It was put in place since cars are now powered by an energy source other than gas. Taxing gas basically taxed folks on miles driven. If the Govt goes to a per mile tax then some of the gas tax should be removed.


Here here!!

The question would then be-what about non-residents of whatever state you are in?

Continue with fuel taxes at the current level and somehow use that to offset your mileage fee?

Let me get my abacus.
rhodyguy
I don’t know about where you guys live, but studded tires tear the roads up something fierce. And folks get to run them for months out of the year. Never seeing a bit of snow on the roads.

I don’t know how people put up with commute drive times. Now, the morning commute to points north, or south, around 30 to 40 miles takes as long as driving to Portland Oregon used to take me.

I think the used electric car market will be in the toilet within 5 years. Worthless vehicles. Pretty gd expensive when new. Then there’s the whole electricity generation thing. Burning coal to charge cars?
ClayPerrine
QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Jun 4 2024, 09:56 AM) *

QUOTE(mate914 @ Jun 4 2024, 07:08 AM) *

Have any idea what that would do to your price for groceries?
Matt

IF (and this is a BIG IF) a use fee is done correctly, truckers should be paying no more in the use tax then they are in fuel tax.

But that is assuming that the fuel taxes are REMOVED, and its not just an additional tax.

Zach



I normally refrain from commenting on anything even vaguely political, for obvious reasons.

But I will say this. No politician, left or right, will remove any tax that gets the state/federal government money. In 1964, the feds implemented the "chicken tax" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax) on trucks because France and West Germany put a tax on imported US Chicken. It is still in effect. It's stupid, and deprives the US of some really nice light trucks.


So dreaming about getting the fuel taxes removed is a pipe dream. They will just add road use taxes to existing tax infrastructure.



VaccaRabite
QUOTE(ClayPerrine @ Jun 4 2024, 12:47 PM) *

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Jun 4 2024, 09:56 AM) *

QUOTE(mate914 @ Jun 4 2024, 07:08 AM) *

Have any idea what that would do to your price for groceries?
Matt

IF (and this is a BIG IF) a use fee is done correctly, truckers should be paying no more in the use tax then they are in fuel tax.

But that is assuming that the fuel taxes are REMOVED, and its not just an additional tax.

Zach



I normally refrain from commenting on anything even vaguely political, for obvious reasons.

But I will say this. No politician, left or right, will remove any tax that gets the state/federal government money. In 1964, the feds implemented the "chicken tax" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax) on trucks because France and West Germany put a tax on imported US Chicken. It is still in effect. It's stupid, and deprives the US of some really nice light trucks.


So dreaming about getting the fuel taxes removed is a pipe dream. They will just add road use taxes to existing tax infrastructure.


In that case Nate would be spot on correct.
The new tax would be highly regressive double taxation, that would hopefully fail in the court case that was likely set to file the second the law took effect.

Zach
technicalninja
QUOTE(ClayPerrine @ Jun 4 2024, 11:47 AM) *
No politician, left or right, will remove any tax that gets the state/federal government money.

agree.gif agree.gif agree.gif

I did notice folks are heading the advice of SirAndy and I haven't noticed a political drift yet.

I try to stay "non-political" in all of my posts.

It's all about the cars anyways...
flipb
The double-taxation scenario is a pretty distant hypothetical right now. The states that have found a way to supplement gas tax by targeting alternative fuel vehicles are -- so far -- keeping those two things exclusive. I'm not aware of any state that's proposing to implement a flat road-use tax that includes gasoline (non-hybrid) vehicles. Not saying it won't happen, but I don't think it's a risk at least in the next 5+ years.

Of course if I'm wrong, you can all remind me of this post when the time comes.

Honestly, the gas tax has worked pretty well. It creates incentives to drive more efficient vehicles while providing a dedicated funding stream for highway infrastructure. As alt-fuel vehicles become a substantial portion of the roadgoing mix, there's a gap being created and the stopgaps are a bit clunky for now.
Amphicar770
An EV tax is simply an opening play towards moving to the alternative form of road tax many states want to implement. The cant get there all at once, so they will do so incrementally. The next logical step will be to tax all vehicles based on mileage and weight.

As the saying goes, "be careful what you wish for, you just might get it".
JeffBowlsby
The solution seems easy, just figure out how much extra to charge for EV usage and add that to the kWh rate at EV chargers (even home chargers) sim to how gasoline is taxed. So regardless of what fuel you need you pay the piper to dance.
Tbrown4x4
I’m a little late here, but WA charged me a “weight fee” on my 1979 Yamaha XS1100. I always that was unfair. Especially when the riding season is a little shorter .
Front yard mechanic
driving-girl.gif
KELTY360
QUOTE(Front yard mechanic @ Jun 4 2024, 06:59 PM) *

In New Mexico they charge you on the amount of guys you haul in the back of your truck


At least they don’t tax the number of guns in the gun rack.
mate914
QUOTE(KELTY360 @ Jun 4 2024, 11:10 PM) *

QUOTE(Front yard mechanic @ Jun 4 2024, 06:59 PM) *

In New Mexico they charge you on the amount of guys you haul in the back of your truck


At least they don’t tax the number of guns in the gun rack.


How does that change anything in this topic?
Matt
flipb
QUOTE(JeffBowlsby @ Jun 4 2024, 09:58 PM) *

The solution seems easy, just figure out how much extra to charge for EV usage and add that to the kWh rate at EV chargers (even home chargers) sim to how gasoline is taxed. So regardless of what fuel you need you pay the piper to dance.


I can't see a practical way for this to work. EV owners who charge at home simply plug into a circuit that's part of their main electric panel. There's no metering for individual circuits. And there's no rule that says your EV must charge on a dedicated circuit. You could share a 240v circuit that's also used by a clothes dryer or a 120v that includes several other lights/appliances/etc. Plus, there's pretty heavy overlap between homes that generate their own electricity via solar and those that have plug-in vehicles; would be difficult to tax the energy they're generating themselves -- some might even be off-grid.

In my area we're starting to see the proliferation of HOT lanes (Free for HOV or pay a toll to use solo). I kinda hate seeing so much infrastructure becoming toll-for-use but I guess that is another model.
mepstein
QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Jun 4 2024, 11:05 AM) *

The issue that I see are the people (and long haul truckers) that spend as much if not more time driving outside their state as in it.

In my case, I live on the border of 2 states (Maryland and Pennsylvania.) PA is already getting screwed for me as MD gas is about 25cents cheaper a gallon, so I fill up there.

If MD sets a use tax: 1) I start paying way less in fuel and 2) MD is getting no recovery from the wear and tear I am putting on their roads. I tend to drive more in MD then PA.

If PA were to set a use tax, I probably start filling up in PA as the gas price should fall below MD - so a benefit to the gas stations in my home area. But then I get hammered with all the miles I drive in MD and other states.

I will laugh at any fool who expects to put a GPS in my car to track my mileage for the state...

Zach

I agree, it gets tricky to think how to implement it on people who live in one state but mostly drive in another. And what about my daughter who drives one of my cars registered in PA but she’s in NY. She can’t register it in NY because it’s my car, not hers. She shouldn’t have to pay a PA mileage tax because the car isn’t in PA. Can’t really base it on an average, my cousin only drives a couple 100 miles a year, I drive about 20k. What if I charge my car at work in another state or charge at a friends house. Who pays the tax? I’m glad I’m not the one trying to figure it out.
technicalninja
I've got a way that it will work. devil.gif devil.gif devil.gif

Have the car broadcast it's GPS data, speed data, interior camera data, everything under the sun.

Set mileage costs via actual data...

You can also issue traffic tickets this way as well.

Insurance rates could be slaved to this.

Install "BIG BROTHER" and put him to use!

Sounds like science fiction?

Ford recently tried to patent crap like this. In Ford case they also wanted to implement auto recovery (for non-payment) and auto recycling. Your car drives away under its own power to wherever Ford decides that is best.

It's going to happen anyways...

I wonder what the politicians will do about old cars that don't have this stuff installed at the factory?

Probably ban them...
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