I am in need of some,alot of technical help regarding the fabrication of a 914-6 GT(clone) SCCA GT-3 club racer. I have decieded to have camp 914 put the project together. Craig knows what he is doing with respect to the flares, roll-cage, coolers, suspension etc.. I need help with some of the tricks you SCCA guys have developed with regards to engine type, displacement, set up etc.. What would be the best, longest lasting, most bang for the buck motor I could run? I have a GCR hand-book from the SCCA but I am finding it hard to determine the best route to take. All technical help will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your time.

Regards,

John Zimmer
FF/FC guy until Sep. 2006

It's not that we're unfriendly, but speaking for myself, I'm not qualified to spend all your money

If you had some specific questions, you would prolly get some answers. A quick look at the rule book tells me you have a tough road to hoe. We could have a huge fight over what engine to use, for instance

There are a couple-3 SCCA Production guys here that probably know those ropes best.

John,

I really don't want to rain on your parade, so I will ask a few questions first.

1. Do you want/plan to be competitive on a national level or a regional one.

2. Is this build going to be a maximum effort build or an affordable one.

3. Are you okay with an open top car, or must you have a roof over you head.

Here are my intial thoughts.

In GT3 the 914-6 is not competitive. It may be possible to build a GT3 car that will handle as well as most of the current cars, but it will not be a car that you add a rollcage to a current tub and retain a rear trailing arm. With the current spec line I would say you might be able to attain 230-235 hp, but it would not be a long lasting engine, and the price would be very expensive, 20-25 K. The current Toyotas will make in excess of 265 hp or better. This is a significant difference. The car that will have any chance in GT 3 will have to be a complete tube frame car, and very well built, so you are probably talking Huffaker. also big coin. GT3 can be either really competitive or hardly competitive, depending on how many cars are in your area, also you want to consider that GT3 many times runs in the same group as GT1. So it is possible you could be on the track at the same time as some extremely fast V8 powered tube frame cars that will have closing speeds at Road America that are prolly over 80 mph. No thanks.

Now, I am not trying to get you to do what I am doing, but to consider E Production. Heres why.

1.The car is competitive if built well

2. The cost to build one will be much less than a competitive GT3 car.

3.I will provide all information you will need to build at least what I have, If you have an interest in a car like mine.

4. The build will retain a "tub" whereas a GT3 car should be a tube car.

5. The development time for a tub car is reasonable, especially when several of us are running them.And we have alot of info.

6. I only know one guy that runs a Gt3 car and it is horribly uncompetitive, I would hate to spend my money and not even be close, and I think that is the case.

If you are interested please PM me

Erik Madsen
914-6 EP

I'd have to agree with Eric... GT is not the way to go with this car. If you do modify the suspension to get the dual a-arms, you get a weight penalty... and in my mind you can't make up the difference (if your suspension is optimized to the production rules).

It's clear that nobody's tried to run a 4cyl 914 in GT in quite a while since the rules really favor the -6. You'd face a serious uphill battle getting the rules modified to put you on a level playing field, while I believe that the 914 in production is classed competitively already.

I'm here to help, too....just realize that each of us have different opinions about what this vehicle needs to go fast. There's at least one opinion for each race car out there.

I think GT-2 would be a better choice. Granted, the competition may be even tougher....them National level boys are good and spend money as if it were water, but at a local club level you have a shot.

With a 2.8 or 3.0L there would be enough power to make you learn to deal with the car for a while. With the new twin plug rules, 300hp+ is easliy attainable ($$$$ tho). In a 2080lb car that would get & keep your attention.

If you really want a bunch of fierce competition without getting your ass waxed by a large majority of the Toyotas, Mazdas, and Nissans, you should look at the HSR 2.0 Challenge series. The rules are pretty simple and they require a treaded tire, but you will be racing against some serious 914s and 911s. Those guys race really hard and it is clean. You will have some great racing and it will probably be less frustrating for a new entry into Club racing.

If you are serious about this I would look at buying Blakewell's old car. That car has a Preston built chassis and has been a front runner for many years in GT2. But be warned you will spend a large fortune to compete in the GT classes. A top GT2 competitor listed his championship car for sale at $350K.

Good luck. NOt trying to pee in your cheerios, just trying to lay out the facts.

Brett is very right, as is Kevin,

I do not agree with the idea of a GT2 car, you are talking about huge dollars to build a GT 2 car not to mention the cost of 16 inch race rubber at about 350 plus each. VS Bias ply Goodyears at 175 each. Major difference, even though there certainly a big diff with radials. But again you will be dealing with a car that will need to be a tube car to be competitive in GT 2 even at the local level. Plus all of the engine components will be more money, except the standard stuff like rods, bearings etc...

Blakewells car may be an interesting idea though. It is a preston chassis, but it also has an FT 200 Hewland in it, and it goes like stink, I did not know it was for sale. It would be a good buy, it is competitive. As opposed to building one. But I know you really want to build a Gt lookalike. Stick with EP, HSR and VSCCA and you will have the time of your life. Well, maybe.

Erik

what they said, to be competitive even in HSR with a 2.5 l 6 we are talking in the neighborhood of 250-300hp at the rear wheels!!!

They have a new class, FIA, a more stock like class... I in know way know much about the SCCA side and while I never made it to the HSR side thats what I built my car for and have friends that have so some what familar with the "rules"...and the $$$ to race there....fun 12-15k motor, win $40k motor.....

QUOTE (Brett W @ Dec 5 2005, 07:35 PM)

If you really want a bunch of fierce competition without getting your ass waxed by a large majority of the Toyotas, Mazdas, and Nissans, you should look at the HSR 2.0 Challenge series. The rules are pretty simple and they require a treaded tire, but you will be racing against some serious 914s and 911s. Those guys race really hard and it is clean. You will have some great racing and it will probably be less frustrating for a new entry into Club racing. If you are serious about this I would look at buying Blakewell's old car. That car has a Preston built chassis and has been a front runner for many years in GT2. But be warned you will spend a large fortune to compete in the GT classes. A top GT2 competitor listed his championship car for sale at $350K. Good luck. NOt trying to pee in your cheerios, just trying to lay out the facts.

We race a 70 914-6GT 2.0L in PCA and HSR.
We just won the PCA race at Roebling Road the last weekend in GT5R.

Don
You and Charlie need to get out and challenge Tim Lewis and Bill Riddell for the Championship. I think they gave out Rolexes this year at Daytona.

QUOTE (Brett W @ Dec 6 2005, 01:16 AM)

Don You and Charlie need to get out and challenge Tim Lewis and Bill Riddell for the Championship.  I think they gave out Rolexes this year at Daytona.

Hey Man!
We came in 3rd in points the dash series in 2003.
But we don't run all the races. Bill and Tim do.
Were gona run a few HSR races in 06 so watch for us.
We will be running mostly PCA races thou.

Here is a pic from the PCA race at CMP in November.
We won the sprint and the enduro that weekend in GT5R.