Im looking for butt time. I am flirting with the idea of doing SCCA AX but they have so many fucking rules (plus they make you buy a rule book) that it is almost overwhelming. I cant just be in a group and run, I have to fill out a sheet! Is it worth it? PCA AX's are simple, I know what group I run in and thats that. Everyone has a good time. Should I sivvy through the questionaires and do it, or stick with a few PCA events a month betweemn Seattle and Portland?

not to jump to the defense of SCCA, however i have worked with a few different types of events (not ax) and one thing i've found is that if every rule is not detailed fully, someone, somewhere will cry or argue about it until you are forced to amend it 200 times, knowing what group you're in a just running is nice, unfortunetly there are those people who have nothing better to do than nit-pick the rules...just a thought, good luck with the ax

Good insight. I agree about making sure every rule is laid out well, but PCA is not so finicky and there has been little to no problems this year. I want to do more AX, but it really makes it a PITA when i have to sivvy through every little detail to figure it all out. Oh well, gotta do what they say in order to play

The SCCA is ORGANIZED. They must comply with the national rules or .....can't play.

Your car would prolly be in C street prepared.

They usually divide into a morning and an afternoon session....with 2 run groups per session. The local region limits entry to 175 drivers....so they better be organized. It is not nearly as laid back as the local PCA.

If you want more butt time, you almost have to go SCCA, here. You have the Bremerton club up there as an alternative.

I ran 9 SCCA AXs this year. It gets better as you gain experience with them. Actually, I like certain rules. If you wanna run, you gotta work. They assign run group and course work while going thru tech. They keep track.
If you don't work, they'll blackball your ass.

BTW, them Miatas are gonna kick your ass.....I gots the boot marks to prove it.

That couple from Oregon who runs a Miata kicked everyones ass last week. I'll prolly join SCCA, I ahve no prob working my share

Run it Chris. It will make you learn faster. The PCA feels.. "half ass" to me compared to SCCA. They are on the stick and they take this stuff seriously. Fun is after the run with them.

Is your car a stock 2.0 injected ?? I dont think we are in C street anymore.



B

In my region you are not required to purchase a rule book. Although, if you want to compete seriously, it would definitely be a good idea!

I have this feeling that about half the autocrossers out there are in violation of some rule infringement. Not that I am of course!

I'm competing in my local SCCA club this year and I've never seen a big fuss. Of course, that goes out the window if you progress to regional/national events.

I do some of the local PC AX events. They have two classes: street tires....competition tires. Period. They just want to have some fun, get in some seat time (we do 80+mph AX), and be home by 1:00pm.

AX has "grownup" and I agree with you that it has a lot of friggin' rules. But I guess I have to say, do the paperwork and ENJOY the ride.

Speakin' of which, I gotta go ta bed.....I got a AX @ 7:00am tomorrow!

Here is the car classification form:

My set up (the only changes that have been/will be made): 7 inch wide wheels, koni yellows(adjustable valving, right?) bigger front t-bars, coil over rear springs, Bigger front sway bar, header, camber maounts for the front, Victo racers, smaller than 225, lowered

Yes, the only changes are suspension with the addition of a header

I think that is a new import classification Chris. See if you can dowload the GCR. Your looking for classifications like ASP/CSP.


B

That download is downloading funny...

Chris,
With the exception of your wheel width, your car description sounds like C stock. And I'm not even sure about the wheel width. I'm sure someone will chime in on that.

Which one ?? the one you uploaded to our server ?? You have to do a "save as" and save it as a PDF. ..then open it from your computer. You cant just click on it. Our server doesnt have Adobe on it.


B

Thats what I was thinking.. one of the stock classes. We run the same class as you would. We just have a full cage. Basically stock 914 2.0's with Panosports and headers.


B

I ain't that good at parsing the rule book.
As I read it, your springs (& t-bars), adjustable perches & wheels say non-stock.....CSP.

SCCA has a little rule. If something is not speficially permitted, it's illegal.....trickey SOBs, eh?

You can always.....mumble....it's stock. Nobody will protest you. The Miatas will still kick your ass

Jim Daniels (CSP Miata) is pretty quick, ain't he.
He tole me that he did 40 AXs last year.

No wonder he's a fast fucker. So is his wife. She was kicking my butt, and I was jawing with her while we were working corner 4. They are both smoooooth drivers, make AX look th eway it should

Buy the rule book. Class your car. Run with SCCA.
Get seat time. Have fun. Get faster. Have more fun.
SCCA rules have always been unfair for 914's.
Plan on getting beat by 21st century rice.
If you really want a trophy Buy one at the thrift store.

This website gives a brief look at the SCCA soloII rules. Chris, you would definitely be CSP. And yes, those Miatas are quick......
http://www.moutons.org/sccasolo/

All too true, I'm afeard.

The last bastion of all Porschedom was/is F Prepared.
Now the Modified M3 Beemers are showing up.
High winding, 4 valbe suckers, with 6 speed light switch shifters designed in THIS century. ......and a 914 is specificily limited to single plug, 2.8L......seems fair, eh?

The SCCA has seem the light, and it ain't a bunch of 30 year old cars....if you don't include the Production
road race classes ....go figure.

Lotso rice is the future....front drivers plowing around an AX course, with their 19 & 20 inch wheel/tire combo squeeling their asses off... .

strange Region ... Reno sure wasn't like that.

if all you want is seat time, class yourself in 'E Modified' and be done with it.
you will be last in class, but all you want is seat time.

in Modified you *can* run race tires, any engine you want, radical suspension -- whatever.
you can run a 100% stock street car there if you want.

Haven't run ax in a couple years, went road racing instead but it's no where near as intense as ax. I'm not a fan of SCCA because of the way they class 914's. OTOH you have to admire a group that will print a organized rule book with minor changes from year to year so it's pretty easy to follow the rules, build it once, build it right. Don't be pissing and moaning when you do something to your car that puts you in another class.
Chris, sounds like you're in CSP. You can't relocate suspension points or tie them into the cage, no internal motor mods, stock steel body, and you're in decent shape.
JP, I don't like the rule in FP that makes 914's run carbs but because of update-backdate it allows tail draggers to have a early lite weight car, stuff a 3.6 into it with FI and it's OK.
A well set up and well driven 2.0 with FI is still pretty competitive in CSP.

Chris, run with the Bremerton AX Club in Novice class for the rest of the year and kick ass. That's what Blair did last year and slaughtered the other cars by 4-6 seconds. You are lookin for more seat time right?

Geoff

The biggest problem with SCCA AX in the bay area is the size of the events. You stand around all day for three or four runs.

If you want seat time I've heard that you can often do lots and lots of fun runs at PCA AXes.

Hey Dude;

Just go run. Class your car as best as you can. It'll probably be a CSP kinda car. No one will worry much about the class unless you happen to win...against highly prepped Miatas and MR2s and the like. In my reading of the book, the rules between zone 8 PCA and SCCA have some incompatibilities that prevent you from being competitive in your class in both places. Pick your preference and use the other group for seat time.

I've enjoyed running the few (3 or 4) SCCA events I've done. I only run the practice day - more runs less waiting and I've got no interest in my in-class placing w/SCCA. I do think that there is a pretty strong element of p-car descrimination in the SCCA which made it even sweeter at one event when a beautifully done '72 911 2.4 layed down TTOD against all kinds of SCCA monstrosities.

Have fun,
Kevin

gotta ask - are you referring to the ex-Jim Hayes dove grey 911?
the multi-Parade TTDO 911 ?

if so - that car hasn't been a 2,4 for a long time; last time i saw it run, it had 50% more displacement than that ...

there -are- other very quick 911's out there - including almost anything Jerry Sturm or E. Paul Dickinson are driving ...

No, yellow. I believe the driver's name is David Palmquist

I'll give that a hale and hearty NO SHIT! The 9 elebens can also run twin plugs and a 914 can't.

The biggest motor you can run in ASP in a 914 is a .040 over
2.0L six....with carbs, thank you very much (the early 9elebens can run up to 3.2L)....otherwise it's off with you to FP...."there be monsters here" (sorry for the repeat).

Oh well, I deal with it. I just got "Offical" notification that I won the local SCCA FP class. Best 8 of 10
events...I showed up for 9..all my competition did 7 or less....good thang to, cause they wuz quicker. Once again, stubborness wins over talent

Hey man, just showing up is 90%

There's a couple of results snippets. Mr. Skinner was kind enuff to drive the little shitbox for a couple events.....it ain't slow...cept when I'm driving

1m BM 123 Janne Boone Wheeler 49.913
2m FP 41 Doug Skinner 74 Porsche 914/6 50.116

And the next day.

1m XSS 1 Tom Kotzian 01 Corvette Z06 47.695
2m FP 41 Doug Skinner 74 Porsche 914/6 47.876

I WANT SLICKS !!