Trying to tear down my rear brakes and suspension to start a rebuild but I have hit a stone wall with the hub nuts on both sides. Are these things torqued with a 3ft cheater bar or something? I have already tried penetrating oil and heat cycles. The threads are not rusty nor are the nuts. Nothing is rounded off..... yet. Is there a secret here or what?

The nut is torqued to 250 lbs. - So yes a 3 ft. bar would help.

I took a 4 ft. piece of angle iron and drilled two holes on each end, for 4 lug and for 5 lug. Then I bolt this to the hub, and use a breaker bar with and 2 ft. pipe on the end.

Comes right off.

Good Luck,

I used a breaker bar, then I used my dads 3ft jack handle, then I topped it all off with a 6ft piece of copper pipe..

Jumping about 4 times with lube seemed to do the trick..

I think its like 330lbs from the factory... Years of rust will increase that number


2ft breaker bar with my foot and weight, jump once to tighten it...

Thats how I do it....

Only done it 5 times (2 hubs were off the car. especially difficult)


Impact wrench will not get it.

QUOTE (Andyrew @ Mar 13 2006, 02:55 PM)

Impact wrench will not get it.

Oh yeah, tried that too.

Ok then, I guess if I go ahead and drop the suspension from the car I can multiply the dificulty by say 50 or more.... great. Oh well, thats easy enough to mount back up... Thanks for the help, cheater bar fab time.....

QUOTE (mrdezyne @ Mar 13 2006, 03:59 PM)

QUOTE (Andyrew @ Mar 13 2006, 02:55 PM) Impact wrench will not get it. Oh yeah, tried that too. Ok then, I guess if I go ahead and drop the suspension from the car I can multiply the dificulty by say 50 or more.... great. Oh well, thats easy enough to mount back up... Thanks for the help, cheater bar fab time.....

home depot sells a 600+ft lb rated impact gun...wonder if that'll work....

We bought a 450lb one..

One way.. ON

no off...

The other thing you might look into is renting/borrowing an air-powereed impact wrench. The torque you apply by hand (foot, etc.) builds up and falls off very graduallly. And once (if) the nut starts to turn, there's a good chance of it turning farther/faster than you (or you knuckles) really wanted. An impact wrench OTOH can slam an insanely high amount of torque for only an instant (10's of millisec ?) without the risk of slipping and going too far. The pulses are harder on the sticky crud that's holding the nut on, and easier on the nut, socket, etc.

But 914 owners are stingy, mean-spirited bastards, so don't even think about looking around thuis club for someone with an air impact wrench to borrow

You can "drop the suspension" w/o undoing that nut, just unbolt the CV from the hub. You only need to remove that nut if you plan to remove the hubs, and you only need to do that if you plan to replace the rear wheel bearings.

If you ARE planning on replacing the rear wheel bearings, then you really MUST remove those nuts before you disassemble anything else, or you'll never get them loose.

If by rebuilding the rear suspension, however, you only intend to replace bushings and shocks/springs, then you can leave the hubs in the trailing arms. Note that removing the hubs often destroys the rear bearings, so if those bearings are in good shape, don't remove the hubs.

I've gotten all mine off with the impact.

I do them off the car too. I have a large piece of aluminum that I bolt to the hub using a couple lug bolts. That stabilizes it. Then I prop the MAPP torch in such a way that it blasts the nut for about 5 minutes.

I've only had one that I had to use acetylene on. We got it cherry red and it finally came off. Proper amounts of serious heat seem to be the ticket.

Cheater bars should do the trick.

Try removing the cotter pin... that always helps

QUOTE (LvSteveH @ Mar 13 2006, 03:15 PM)

Try removing the cotter pin... that always helps

Steve,
you stole my line: I was going to say: make sure the cotter pin is off !

QUOTE (Eric_Shea @ Mar 13 2006, 03:13 PM)

I've gotten all mine off with the impact.   I do them off the car too.  I have a large piece of aluminum that I bolt to the hub using a couple lug bolts.  That stabilizes it.  Then I prop the MAPP torch in such a way that it blasts the nut for about 5 minutes. I've only had one that I had to use acetylene on.  We got it cherry red and it finally came off.  Proper amounts of serious heat seem to be the ticket. Cheater bars should do the trick.

I concur. I have always gotten them off with my impact (Sears 1/2", nothing really fancy) and I have stripped a couple real rust piles. Had to heat the hell out of one car, but only that time.

Make sure you have a lot of line pressure too. I have cranked the regulator up if it is really stuck. I think I have gone up to almost 150lbs line pressure (IIRC that was about the max I could get out of my compressor). tools typically call out something like 90 psi line pressure max, but I have gone over it. In fact, a couple of the shops I worked for back in the day would run line pressures in the 120-150psi range all the time. I will follow up with proceed at your own risk to CMA but I have yet to see a gun break due to line pressures in that area. I've seen a socket or two split of course.

Take off the rear wheel to soaked the nut in oil. Remove the center cap on your rim. Re-install the wheel and put the car back on the ground with the wheels blocked. You can still get to the nut and now the car's weight will keep the assembly solid. You can reach for an impact wrench, or, I've used a 1/2 inch craftsman ratchet slipped into a piece of piping about 4 feet long. 2 people can crack that nut loose pretty easily, and if you break the ratchet, it's craftsman! get another for free.



-Rob

Can't you use the VW tool that looks like a bow tie . Put it over the bolt and hit the other end with an ax. Can't remember if the nut size is the sams. Al

QUOTE (michel richard @ Mar 13 2006, 03:52 PM)

QUOTE (LvSteveH @ Mar 13 2006, 03:15 PM) Try removing the cotter pin... that always helps   Steve, you stole my line: I was going to say: make sure the cotter pin is off !

Ever had to get one off with a frozen inplace cotter pin. Yup I have. Not fun, you have to break the pin by turning the already over tightend and rusty nut, and then get the nut past the pin remnants.

Hey.. I weigh 240... I'll jump on the breaker bar for you!!

As always.. hit that nut with some liquid wrench, and or a torch don't get it cherry though.. don't want to take the temper out of it...

I had that happen on a VW bus years ago and we used a six foot piece of iron pipe and a jack and actually raised the bus off the ground. When the nut broke loose it made a huge bang and the neighbors came out as they thought it was a gun shot.

Get yourself some Kryoil - this stuff rocks. I removed my entire exhaust system with a 1/4" ratchet and this stuff. Many of the nuts looked like they would snap the studs off and they just came off without any drama. I got mine at Eastwood at a nice markup and it was still worth the price.

Aero Kroil was the cats ass. PB Blaster is the new cats ass. Squirt the crap out of it, and let it sit for a bit. Then, use the breaker bar/ impact gun. Don't let that little nut kick your ass.

IR 2135Ti 1/2 impact will do 700Ftlbs in reverse. Will knock that nut loose in no time. Even with the cotter pin in. I have done the lang breaker bar too. It works.

Kroil is the best stuff out their, followed by PB Blaster.

Aerokroil can be bought directly form Kano Labs if you can't find it locally. when i bought mine there was a 2fer deal.

k

QUOTE (pek771 @ Mar 13 2006, 09:23 PM)

Aero Kroil was the cats ass. PB Blaster is the new cats ass. Squirt the crap out of it, and let it sit for a bit. Then, use the breaker bar/ impact gun. Don't let that little nut kick your ass.

This might be dragging us towards the sandbox, but did this quote remind anyone of the climax of the movie "Team America, World Police" by the South Park duo ? The speech about how some people are D**ks and others are A****les, but OTOH some are just P****es, and, ... well if you saw it you'd remember.

When I read pek771's post, I just had to wonder :

* Did the old cat get a new ass, or is it a new cat ?

* Squirt the crap out of what ? the new cat ? the new cats ass ? or the dude's big nut ?

* Let what sit for a bit ? The new cat ? The new cats ass ? The crap ?

* How is a little nut gonna kick his ass ?

* etc.

Man, I really gotta get out more.....

WOW! I can tell by the responses that this at the top of the list of favorite things to do on a teener.

Sounds like I just haven't put enough umph on it yet. I bent the crap out of a Craftsman breaker bar but didn't use an extension. I'll add some length to the thing and give it another go. And yes, the cotter pins are out, in pieces, but out. I was sweating having them stuck in there!

This will be a complete rear rebuild since the car has been sitting for 14 years. The rotors will have to be replaced due to use and pitting and just for peace of mind.

I just couldn't imagine those nuts were supposed to be that tight. I'll give it another go this weekend after I hang the suspension back on the car temporarily. Thanks again!!!

QUOTE (john rogers @ Mar 13 2006, 09:09 PM)

I had that happen on a VW bus years ago and we used a six foot piece of iron pipe and a jack and actually raised the bus off the ground. When the nut broke loose it made a huge bang and the neighbors came out as they thought it was a gun shot.

Back on topic...


I'd say the next step after the six foot pipe with the jack would be to put the six foot pipe over a Craftsman ratchet wrench. Set the ratchet to "tighten", turn the pipe in the "loosen" direction until the end of the pipe is a couple of inches off the ground. Have a friend hold the pipe in this posistion, and when you get the car up to around 40 MPH have them flick the little lever to the "loosen" position. vwalla

So it sounds like you are gonna be removing the hubs from the wheel bearings ? For me, that was the real eye-opener. My car was a "rust-free" California car and the axle nuts came off fairly easily. But one of the bearings had already been squealing for some unknown number of highway miles when I got the car, and it was fused into the trailing arm. It took way more pounding than I could manage from under the car, so I removed the trailing arm (which needed a re-paint anyway after a brake fluid mishap) and brought it into the shop where I could get medieval on it.
You will definitely, 100% sure, destroy the bearings when you take the hubs out. Also, be sure to search around for tips on how to re-install the new bearings and getting the hubs into them : little pieces of pipe, threaded rods, freezer, etc. It's not a bad job, but you'll be wasting time if you start it without getting all the right bits and pieces together first.

p.s. If you think you might ever be switching over to 5-hole wheels, this is the time. You can (I think) just put the 5-hole hubs in, or you can have your 4-hole hubs drilled to accept either flavor. I didn't know/care about this at the time I did mine.

I used C-4 to get mine off...course I had to replace the entire car afterwards...But i got those sons of bitches off allright.

QUOTE (jsteele22 @ Mar 14 2006, 09:53 AM)

So it sounds like you are gonna be removing the hubs from the wheel bearings ? For me, that was the real eye-opener. My car was a "rust-free" California car and the axle nuts came off fairly easily. But one of the bearings had already been squealing for some unknown number of highway miles when I got the car, and it was fused into the trailing arm. It took way more pounding than I could manage from under the car, so I removed the trailing arm (which needed a re-paint anyway after a brake fluid mishap) and brought it into the shop where I could get medieval on it. You will definitely, 100% sure, destroy the bearings when you take the hubs out. Also, be sure to search around for tips on how to re-install the new bearings and getting the hubs into them : little pieces of pipe, threaded rods, freezer, etc. It's not a bad job, but you'll be wasting time if you start it without getting all the right bits and pieces together first. p.s. If you think you might ever be switching over to 5-hole wheels, this is the time. You can (I think) just put the 5-hole hubs in, or you can have your 4-hole hubs drilled to accept either flavor. I didn't know/care about this at the time I did mine.

Yeah, replacing bearings, bushings, brakes, you name it. I'll be sure and do that search on the bearing install, sounds like a PITA.

And for now I have the correct bolt pattern for my application, but thanks for the heads up. I don't foresee going to 5 lug in the near future....

I invested in a HD ingersol Rand Ti impact gun with over 1,000 lbs of nut busting torque a few years ago to remove stubborn wheel and axle nuts I had a 600lb impact gun before this one that I had no luck with. I used to use a 3/4 drive socket and breaker bar with the floor jack handle on it and pounding pushed and pulled like crazy trying to loosen things up. The new gun has not let me down yet.