2 weeks ago I picked up a super clean 71 with a 2.0. Other than the motor, the car is bare-bones stock. Already fixed the horns and some minor stuff, but what scares the heck out of me is the lack of brakes with the stock setup. I know this has probably been beaten to death, but in order of cheap improvements and going up the scale, what would you guys recommend.

The first thing that comes to mind is stainless steel brake lines, but really doubt they would make any significant improvement.

Would Pagid pads help or do we need to go for a bigger master cylinder, or step up to bigger calipers and what would the prices be approximately for those? I have heard about BMW calipers but that sounds rather pricey.

Any help would be appreciated.Click to view attachmentClick to view attachmentClick to view attachment

I also added a third brake light for a little extra security...

Your stock brakes are not set up correctly.

First, bleed them...many times..replace the old fluid.
Second, set the venting clearance in the rear brakes correctly, this makes a huge difference.
Third, more aggresive brake pads..

There is no need to replace any hardware if the system is set up correctly, unless you plan on racing the car...but for street, you just need to set it up.

Most of the cars I have seen, the rear brake venting is not correct, this gives you a low pedal, and it feels like you will never stop.

Rich

if your brakes scare you they're not working right ...

the by far cheapest solution is to fix your stock brakes. they are more than enough for a 2.0L car, if in good working condition ...

rebuild calipers, flush old brake fluid, new brake pads and you should be good to go ...
Andy

stock is more than adequate.

go thru it all. new lines, rebuild the calipers, new fluid etc...

i LOVE porterfield R4S pads.

what they said.

your brakes are broke - fix 'em.

unless your front disks are somehow WAY above the minimum (marked right on the part...) they coule probably stand to be replaced - along with the new berings and grease seals they contain.

this can easily start the dreaded As Long As spiral, so take stock of what makes sense to do all at once and what can wait. but if your dampers are dead, the alignment is bad, and the tie rod ends and ball joints are loose, you still won't have good braking. but for stock cars driven on the street, the factory stuff *set up as new* and working correctly doesn't leave much on the table.

most "upgrades" are BandAid fixes for symptoms and avoid the real problems (which mostly is worn parts...)

I agree. only thing scary about my brakes is I hit them at the last possible second. and have tons of room to spare at the end.

Stock brakes good pads and new fluid. good tires too.

I brake later than most any other car at the Autocrosses.

Welcome to the club, nice looking car.

Guys thanks for the quick replies.

I have time to put in fresh fluid and change the pads. Rebuilding will have to wait a bit.

I am not quite familiar with the term 'venting' in regard to rear brakes. Is this something unique to a 914?

Thanks,
Rick

I agree with all of the above. The stock brakes are adequate. But, if you don't know the last time they were serviced, they are due to be serviced.

First, I wouldn't screw around trying to figure out how to recondition the rears. Use Eric Shea's rear brake rebuild service. It is well worth the time and money to have this done and be sure the calipers are working correctly.

For the fronts, I would just buy remanufactured calipers. Last time I bought some, they were around $50 each loaded. (includes pad and pins)

Then, get new rubber brake hoses. They should run about $15-$20 each.

For around $400 and an afternoon, you'll have brakes that perform well. (unless you need new rotors)

If this is your first 914, and perhaps your first early Porsche, it may also be your first car without power brakes. This often takes newbies aback some, and I suspect is one of the things that causes so many people to think the 914 brakes suck.

Recalibrating your foot to non-servo brakes can sometimes take awhile. If you can't lock the tires, no matter how hard you push, something really is wrong with your brakes, and you need to fix them. If you can lock the tires, no amount of brake upgrades will make the car stop any faster, and you really need better tires. If you can lock the tires, but it takes a great deal of pedal effort to do so, then it's possible that some PO has replaced the stock 17mm master cylinder with a 19mm master cylinder from a 911. This is a common "upgrade" that improves pedal feel, but requires more pedal effort. The only way to tell if the MC has been swapped out is to remove it. A 17 or 19 is cast into the body of the unit near the mounting flange, but it can only be seen with the MC out of the car.

The car has been sitting off an on for 2 years and probably been driven a dozen times by the PO. Doubt he changed the fluid and who knows how long it was before he had it that the fluid was changed.

Based on your advice, I will:

1. Change the fluid and upgrade the pads.

2. Take it out and see if I can lock them up. If no...

3. Look at reman front calipers and new rubber brake lines all around.

I do have an early 911 with S calipers and that car stops fine, so I am familiar with no power assist.

Part Pricer - where did you buy your remans from?

Thx

pretty car!

yes rear brake venting is unique to the 914
(and the ferrari that shares the same calipers)
it is discussed in the manual
it is the space that is manually adjusted between the pad and rotor.
if it is not set accurately then it will be such a large space that you will have little or no rear brake.

make sure you set this venting clearance also
brant

Note that some editions of the Haynes manual have you set the venting clearance to 0.008", which is wrong. The correct venting clearance is 0.004" (per the actual Porsche specs).

What more can I add?

It's awesome to see the collective wisdom grow here. I like Gint's old comment, "Stock 914 brakes should be enough to throw you through the windshield."

The "only" brake upgrade I recommend for a narrow body car is 911/914-6 M-Calipers and that is only if you are using the narrow body car as a very aggressive DE/Road Course machine (are you listening Trekkor? ). This is only for cooling with the vented rotor.

Almost all upgrades I've seen are downgrades at worst and a compromise at best.

What you have shall 'rock' once again. Beautiful ride

Show us your Neunelfer!

For a 'newbie' I am overwhelmed by how welcoming you are and the amount of info you are providing. On other boards, I see the newbies regularly ignored until they are a known. Glad to see you guys don't have the 'tude' or ego probs of the other boards. Looks like I have found a home.

Twist my arm for pics of the 911.


This is what it looked like when it first purchased 3 years ago.Click to view attachment

This is what it has been changed to:Click to view attachmentClick to view attachment

That's bcause the other boards S-U-C-K

Slick leben. Is it an S or S badged? I think the biggest impovement to a 71 car is the H1's or Euro light housings. Those early ones blow.

Looks great.

We forgot one of these... the official

Here's mine...

Eric,

Very nice looking ride. What year? What did it start life as?

Nice to see owners who can 'swing both ways' when it comes to owning a 914 and 911.

I consider my 2.0 914 the ultimate retro-cruiser. It is great just to tool along with the top off and the tunes cranked up and enjoy the scenery. It also gets astounding gas mileage compared to the 911. I was considering dropping a 2.4 911S motor into the teener, but with gas prices, I need a more economical car.

The 911 has a highly modified suspension and a 2.7 RS Spec motor and feels like a caged panther ready to leap; kind of like restrained agression, just waiting to be unleashed.

I love both cars for completely different reasons. The 914 is uber-kuhl and gets a lot of looks because they are so uncommon.

Mine started as a 71T. It's currently in the shop getting my 914-6/GT clone motor and a 915 installed in it. The 914 is under construction and parts collection phase and I needed a platform to keep the 2.5S motor alive. The 911 was it for now.

I'm building a 3.0 MFI motor with S-Cams and 36mm ports for the 911RS clone. Nothing too radical, just basic factory goodies on a 930/07 motor. JE's for the cams and MFI. Keeping it around 9.5:1

Once the metal work and paint is finished on the 914, the 2.5 goes in there...