What are your thoughts on people who just use the classifieds and dont contribute to the community?

these are just my thoughts.

I mean, its a free service, and these people are benefiting from it... why cant they at least give back to the community? you know, hang out here, peruse the board, contribute tech data where needed, or show up to events and things?

seems pretty selfish to me.

just my thoughts.

am i off base?

mainly the people who just endlessly "pimp their stuff". you know?

I think as long as they're not charging $250 for a shift knob they are an asset to the community.

I went through this with another forum I'm on, but if their prices are fair, they are honest people, and have parts in good shape then they provide quite a service to us guys trying to rebuild/repair.

what if their prices are kinda steep? ala just here to make money on people?

73 2.0 on 7" and 8" fuchs, 1900 lb's and 110 HP

you're always gonna have those types.

no biggie. IMO they do contribute by posting stuff for sale, that's stuff that some of us may need and may not otherwise have seen available.

even if it's priced on the high side - it's an open market and if it's too high, it's easy to just pass.

(that's just casual sellers though, running a full blown business through the free board shouldn't be allowed unless some agreement is reached).

I'd rather have the stuff here posted for sale, then have to look around for it. I don't have a problem with it at all.

Zach

Aaron,

There are many types of members and a list of high posters. You and many of them are what attracts members. Instant information, don't bother to search just post a question. Nice for some but it gets old if you keep giving the same information over and over. I know alot of people who prefer not to visit this club often or at all for various reasons.

I see no problem with a low poster using the classifieds. People have parts needs and this is a means to fill them. I go to many forums when I look for information or buy and sell parts but I happen to primarily participate here.

Whats all this talk about charging fees? Besides I just come here for the free donuts, but the coffee is lousy!

I can certainly empathize with what your saying....give back to the community a little and don't just take take take all the time.

But as others have said, mandatory participation in the forums could lead to a dimished marketplace....tough call.

i should clarify. low posters are great! if they are asking questions and stuff in the garage. thats awesome.

everyone starts somewhere.

i guess im leaning on ratio of garage to classified posts........
like 1:50 LOL

Some people are just shy.....or afraid of letting people know what town in Southern California they are from.....for obvious reasons. So maybe they are reading threads and doing searches and working on their cars and selling stuff in the classifieds but not posting much otherwise. As far as running a business in the free classifieds goes, well then as a decent sort of fellow I would want to make sure that I contributed in some way shape or form, just to say thanks and make sure that I continued to be considered a "member". But that's just me.

I've posted my share of WTB's....and got many PM's.

Some were from those that are just here to sell stuff. Most were reasonable priced. Only a couple weren't.

I've gotten a good education from this site so I could tell the difference.

I got to say that there are some very generous 914club members. Saved me lots of cash and got parts to me so I could keep progressing on my project.

I have a feeling Aaron is refering to a few posters who have an actual parts biz where they use the vendor section exclusively.

I don't like it...most the parts sellers tend to be buttheads and the prices are steeper than what the usual enthusiast sells for.

The regulars tend to know who's straight and who isn't.....the newbies will be the ones who get hosed.

We either should charge "vendors" for the right and/or put up a disclaimer and/or make the vendors have a label or badge that says they are a retail or parts seller by trade.....

I do remember getting fucked or an attempted fucking by some people when I first started doing internet parts buying and selling. Fortunately I have a pretty good bullshit detector.

Some vendors have straightened out....I hear Patrick Motorsports is less of an asshole now....butt I still won't buy spit from heem....AA STILL sucks.....

Well, I say "No Soup For them! I think any business that advertises on ANY site should have to pay. Whether the site is free or not. Unless it is a plastic surgeon and they are given to the community in there own silicon way

These guys put a lot of time into the site and have run it for free for a long time now.

Maybe create a "vendors" group or something and work out a reasonable fee system.

I've been a long time member over at www.probetalk.com when I had my last project. I have almost 9000 posts over there and still post even though I don't have the car. Let me tell you how it went down over there.

-First, sell whatever you want, free.
-Then, there were legit business owners who were vendors and paid a fee.
-Then since they paid fees, it was illegal to mention or refer members to non member vendors.
-Then some people started selling parts all the time and had few posts, they soon became considered vendors and weren't allowed to sell anything anymore without paying the fee.
-Then it was illegal to "advertise" items for sale in your signature, ebay links, off-site links, or even whisper about good or bad dealing with vendors or non-vendor members.
-Then people started low-balling vendors prices to members by offering parts through PM. Those people were banned for good, or temporarily.

Basically, the original idea was sound. But then it turned into protecting the vendors' rights since they pay their fee to promote/sell their stuff.

I understand what your saying, but I would just hate to see the non-club travel down that road. It's funny to see people talk about overmoderation here, but over on Probe forums with 26,000 members and 1000 members online at any given time, you can't even sneeze in the wrong forum without a 3 day ban. It's become rediculous. This forum is a breath of fresh air compared to over there.

Dan

But as soon as you've got paying vendors, you'll have venders bitching about vendor bashing. Just watch...

This was exactly what happened to our very own asshole on rennlist. Not that he was a vendor, but he said something about a product that was sold by a paying vendor of rennlist, and promptly got a verbal lashing. A club's gotta protect it's bread & butter.

Jen

I agree. It does seem selfish. It always kinda bug me. Especially when they list multiple items and everyone elses items get pushed down

How do you distinguish "classifieds users" from "lurkers"? I'm not sure there's a difference. In every Internet-based community I've seen over the past 15 years, the ratio of people who lurk to people who post is roughly 10:1, almost without exception. Most people just feel they don't have anything to say, or can't say it well. Some of this is simple shyness, some is intimidation. All too many feel they'll be flamed or even mildly criticized for what they post. A great many just don't feel engaged enough with the community to participate.

Of course, there are also those people who post a great deal w/o saying anything useful. Every community has those, too.

DO NOT charge for the classifieds section. It is why people post here..
Would you rather have to hunt on ebay, or every local PCA/POC web site..not me.

Vendors should also have free listings.
I like the vendor resource area..I think folks that make a business selling parts...I can name a few, should keep there listing exclusively in the vendor area, and not twenty individual listings...maybe a link to their web site...

I like the classifieds for what it is...enthusiasts are trading parts for cash...simple system.

Making money on classifieds will drive alot of people away.
It the Renn list mistake, dont repeat history.

rich

I don't mind if people use the classifieds section solely for making a profit and contribute nothing else to the board. To me the question comes down to "does what they are doing detract from everyone else's fun?" I frankly look at the classifieds pretty rarely, and post there even less often. To me its not interfering with my 914club experience.

The 914club seems to have been founded on the idea that a bunch of 914 owners get together here as friends and have a community. So I can understand how someone might be offended if a vendor comes in and just starts using the community to make money, especially if things are being sold at higher than "friend prices."

It seems that as the 914club gets bigger and more popular, more people will be attracted to sell things here. If 914club wants to regulate that, it will be a lot of work and create a lot of issues, contention and so forth. More rules, more structure means more maintenence required to keep things in order. It seems that as it is, 914club is a huge thing to maintain.

Mo money mo problems.



-Tony

I sold my purple roller to someone who's only post has been in reply to my classified ad. I'm glad he was around.

I don't think it is justified to place limits on the classifeds, because you may be limiting a contributor, or a future contributor. I'm sure many people find this place because of the free classifieds, stick around for a while, and eventually become regular garage/sandbox posters.

As far as high prices and taking advantage of newbies... how else are they gonna learn? When a big problem comes up, it gets taken care of.. Also, I've seen plenty of times where someone posts an ad with a high price and someone else posts a reply that says "I think that's kinda steep, I just sold one for $X.XX."

I think it's a non-problem.. and "buyer beware" always applies.

no one is talking about taking away free classifieds or anything.

this was just something that irked me and i wanted to know your opinions....

AAAH

There's a couple haunting there right now. Post a WTB and watch them come in like seagulls on a fish head.

Maybe post a sticky at the top for people to read: READ THIS BEFORE...

It bugs me but, I think we keep it the way it is. We've seen before how the lack of responsability of others has limited the freedom of the masses. This club is cool "as is"...

i must be a psychic as i instantaneously had the same name floating around in my mind ...

he'll grow up eventually ...
Andy

PS: as for the classifieds "lurkers", i don't mind ...
as for the parts pushers, if they have something of quality to offer, we *want* them for the new and improved eComm!
if they sell crap, it's up to you guys to let everyone know. there is no special "protection" for members.
i can call brad an asshole all day long. of course he's an admin, so he can delete this sentence and no one would ever know. unless i delete his account and post it again. in which case he could turn off the domain name.
then we would have to start all over again ... ok, what was i talking about?

There are people that give and people that just take.
I have sold a few parts that someone wanted, did not make a cent on deal i have given more parts free, because when i first got the car
i had guys sell me parts that i know now i payed way to much. i see some
parts that i know a way out of line. lets help the new guys
also if guy is buying a part do not PM the seller and offer more money.
that happen to me. just my thinking . don,t write this much very often.


Robert

Howbout some lowered expectations???

We've got enough posts by people that don't know what they are talking about, and the lack of discretion to admit it. Posts like "well I don't really know, but.....(insert bogus tech info here)" or "I was booking along in my 1.7 doing 140mph in traffic".

As for people posting outrageous prices, big hairy ass deal!! Does anyone think the bulk of this crowd pays outrageous prices??? C'mon.

no big deal.
the uneducated learn fast when money is involved.
the way its always been.


keep it an open forum.

I think the point is, it doesn't matter if anyone here "minds" the "problem" or not. It is what it is, and it's a very common thing. The 10:1 ratio shows up all over the place. 10% of people who have a problem with a product bother to actually complain about it to the vendor. 10% of people who listen to public radio give money to their local station. Etc. Etc.

Do we really have 400-500 active posters on this board? I'm not sure the number is even that high. What percentage of the accounts on this board have a post per day count greater than 1? Mine's pushing 5, and I know there are plenty with a higher rate that I have. What's our uniques per day here?

I'm fairly new to this board, I've done a fair share of posting- some good stuff, some very newbie-like. However it didn't take long to differentiate beteen average 914 owner selling stuff, and vender-type sellers. (Usually the price gives it away). However it never bothered me at all. Kind of like Wallmarts- they exist, but it doesn't mean I have to shop there- easy to drive by without a second thought. I could see it being an issue if their postings were intrusive somehow.

Maybe I'm missing something?

Well this discussion convinced me....I'm now for free ads. I just had a brain fart and remembered what irked me about Rennlist.

Jump on the dishonest ones and deal with them after there's a problem.

"Just keep swimming"

The sharks who hope to make unreasonable $$$ from the classified farm won't get very far.

What I appreciate about this community is good info rules and BS gets called out.

If anyone posts stupid prices, they will become a laughing stock.

There are more cases of club members helping each other out with rich benevolence than there are cases of loser rip-off artists.

The community will naturally flush the crap.

This club rocks!

I know english is not your first language Andy, but you messed up a few letters there. The word you were looking for there is "psychotic", and we don't use the 'personal "a"' in english. So, your sentence should properly have started "I must be psychotic. . . . "









Sorry man, had a very shitty last few days, and I have very little self control at the moment.

Oh, and I forgot: Happy 4-20 everybody!!!!!!

now what i really dislike is people jumping all over someone who's asking top dollar and then turning around and jumping on a way underpriced item.

If youre gonna carry the harpoon of honest prices then you shouldnt
swim with the sharks.

Andy

Kinda like you

I still think we need a forum to rate sellers, if they're good say so, if they're bad say so. I'm not talking about price, that's between you and them. I'm talking about crap parts, crap vendors.

how do you decide who has posts that are a value? there are classifieds ads with more value than some posts in the garage and otherwise...

it sounds selfish on paper, but come on....

My friend runs this site.
my friends site

Here are his rules
------------------------------------------------------------------
PLEASE READ **Your 1st Post SHOULD NOT be an ad**
Classified Rules

1. Any item for sale must include a price
2. Any person selling parts, must include 1 of the following:
Phone number
Email address

3. Norcal1320.com is NOT responsible for any transactions taking place between members, and is NOT responsible for damaged parts exchanged between members.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think he makes you wait until you have like 50 post I think.

Anyways, I agree with you. I don't care for leachers.
I don't care if someone is cleaning out there garage but the
guy who runs a small time business on side bothers me.

I really hope that is not directed at me....

These people are just here to sell the parts that X-19 buyers don't want. They just come here for a better price.

On the other hand, they don't seem determined to learn what TTIWWP means, and they are clogging up the parts pipeline with old round relays, and driving the prices down.



M

nah, I'm sure it's me

The people who have something to say, say it. How are you going to force people to have something to say? A community like this takes all kinds. Anyone who visits the site, even if it's just to sell parts, is an asset in my mind.

i agree. not quite what i said, but anywaym i agree.

For Me

Came here to sell my car on the classifieds. Found so much info here, I kept it.
Any type of paid access to the classifieds, is not a good thing for the club.
It just keeps people away. IMHO.

Thanx for asking

Later

totally agree with what mark said....hit the nail on the head.

I guess I'm not sure what you mean by "contribute to the community"..

Do you mean write a very nice how-to? Or post thousands of one liners and ?

I do neither. I will never know as much as many here, and therefore, could not add to anything that has not already been done. Just my 2 cents.

Whats wrong with someone only using the classifieds? That should tell you something about your site. Why did they NOT choose to go somewhere else? Then again, why DONT they post in the 'garage' or 'sandbox' ?

This site is different things to different people. I say don't sweat it.