With only enough knowledge to be dangerous, any chance of someone walking a relative newbie through a Concours prep and showing for both a low key event and a full blown insane sadistic effort?
How do YOU go about it?
Full Version: Concours DIY
I think the first thing we need is some info & photos of your 914 - it's a 6 I believe, the one from Switzerland?
If it is, I've seen exterior photos but need to see f&r compartments, engine compartment and, if possible, underside. If you're not planning on having the undercarriage judged we don't need photos of it.
With good photos I think we can provide some direction on prep. How seriously do you want to approach this? Do you want to try to win? just place well? or just show off the car & have fun?
If it is, I've seen exterior photos but need to see f&r compartments, engine compartment and, if possible, underside. If you're not planning on having the undercarriage judged we don't need photos of it.
With good photos I think we can provide some direction on prep. How seriously do you want to approach this? Do you want to try to win? just place well? or just show off the car & have fun?
OK, let's look at this from the point of view of the person who's considering councours for the first time. Not sure they want to do it at all, but thought it might be interesting to try.
First, no one loses! The WORST outcome for you is a really well-detailed 914. I've never seen anyone's car ragged on because it isn't the best on the field. Concours people are pretty well mannered & are great sources for improving your chances in the next event. Ask us for guidance - but you may have trouble getting us to shut up!
Next, decide how far you want to go with your first attempt. Are you going to go the "fully prepared" route - everything on the car is scrutinized? Or, the "touring" route (similar to topside-only), where the undercarriage (& sometimes the engine bay) are not judged? Unless your 914 is freshly restored, I'd advise getting your feet wet with the latter. I started with full concours from the beginning, but my car was only 2 years old then. I can't imagine, now 32 years later, doing it from scratch now, unless the car had a fairly new resto.
Start with a regional event for your first concours. Doesn't matter whether you're restored or not. If possible, do your first one in your own PCA region. The folks judging your car are usually those people who weren't able to run away fast enough from the event chairman who was looking for judges. These judges will probably know you & your car, are your friends, and may not be so critical on the little things. There are always hard-core participants at these things, so ask them to critique your car. Most will be happy to help.
Enlist the family members, if you can. Especially the "better half". They have smaller hands & can get into spaces we guys can't with our clutzy bigger hands. Maybe I'm just lucky, but I got my wife involved early & she got as serious about it as I. She's probably judged at least two dozen events avoer the years. Here's a photo of her hard at work at one of the PCA Parades (damned those chrome wheels!).
Just remember the most important part. Have FUN. Nobody loses.
Let use know how far you want to go with this. Shall we get into the nitty gritty of prep, or keep it to the basics?
QUOTE(Pat Garvey @ May 4 2006, 08:15 AM) 
Enlist the family members, if you can. Especially the "better half". They have smaller hands & can get into spaces we guys can't with our clutzy bigger hands. Maybe I'm just lucky, but I got my wife involved early & she got as serious about it as I. She's probably judged at least two dozen events avoer the years. Here's a photo of her hard at work at one of the PCA Parades (damned those chrome wheels!).
Just remember the most important part. Have FUN. Nobody loses.
Let use know how far you want to go with this. Shall we get into the nitty gritty of prep, or keep it to the basics?
Start with the basics of prep, and if you can't help yourself, ya the nitty gritty. Skip the use of the various products, they all have instructions (unless you have little known tips.) A list of essentials for prep and those you take to the day of event would be nice.
Is there a sequence that you've found better than another? What items are worth spending the extra time on preparing.
Just what does it take to draft someone to help? A diamond or a couple of beers?
Start with the basics of prep, and if you can't help yourself, ya the nitty gritty. Skip the use of the various products, they all have instructions (unless you have little known tips.) A list of essentials for prep and those you take to the day of event would be nice.
Is there a sequence that you've found better than another? What items are worth spending the extra time on preparing.
Just what does it take to draft someone to help? A diamond or a couple of beers?
[/quote]
Well, and this is just my method (chime in here all you others veterans), I'm a full-concours guy, so I always begin with the belly of the beast. But that part is started weeks before a serious event, with a quick once over the day before and again at the event. We can go into that if needed, but I'm going to assume that most people are not full-concours people. We'll skip the belly for now.
We'll also assume everyone's read the threads on this Forum about cleaning tips & tools - there are ome excellent ones there. So, we'll start with a pretty clean car, topside areas only, and the day before the event.
I start with the engine compartment . It's already been cleaned up with your goos of choice & looks fairly good. Get out the Q-tips & cotton cloths & go after everything you can reach - including seams, cheeseheads, etc. Air cleaner & battery should be out so you can reach everything possible. Unless you have REALLY long fingers & arms, you won't get everything, but you will be surprised at what you keep coming up with from your "clean" engine compartment. (Sidebar: I have been frequently judged by a friend I call Jon "long fingers" Lowe - many of you know of Jon. He has fingers that can reach everywhere & he loved to come out of my engine compartment with a smile & a smudge to show everyone).
There are many sharp edges in this area. You will finish up with bloody knuckles & scratches (tetanus shots updated?). Polish all painted surfaces with the same material used for your exterior. After the first time you've done this, use unscented Pledge for maintenance. There are a LOT of painted surfaces in this area. Don't forget the compartment walls, the sheet metal, intake tubes, underside of the engine lid (remove the drain pan first), etc. Don't leave any polish residue or dust behind - & redo the Q-tip thing.
I like to polish my fuel rails a little, not too much. This is also a good time to check all the fuel hoses & dress them up. Clean up the injectors & the associated mounting hardware. If you have non-original items, replace them with factory pieces. Obviously, if you have carbs (4 cylinder), they can't just be replaced - you'll have to live with the deduct. Don't forget to clean inside the drain tubes from the drain tray - that's another good use for procto-tips. Do whatever you have to to make sure that areas of your battery tray that are visible and clean & un-corroded. Before you replace the darin tray, clean it up & don't put any slick looking goo on it. Just remember, most goos are dust attractants & will come off on the judges fingers. Natural finish everywhere.
OK, we'll break here. At this point, your fingers & nails should be black, cuts & abrashions cleaned bandaged & hopefully unstitched! You engine bay is almost ready to show. The rest can be done at the event. You ARE planning on getting there early aren't you?
On enlisting help.....Yes, I have used gemstones as a reward, but not a promise! Once your helper is into it, they'll either say bye-bye or become a part of. At least that's my experience. The only thing I promise is a fresh nail job and a pat on the back.
Next episode - compartments, wheels & tires.
Is there a sequence that you've found better than another? What items are worth spending the extra time on preparing.
Just what does it take to draft someone to help? A diamond or a couple of beers?
[/quote]
Well, and this is just my method (chime in here all you others veterans), I'm a full-concours guy, so I always begin with the belly of the beast. But that part is started weeks before a serious event, with a quick once over the day before and again at the event. We can go into that if needed, but I'm going to assume that most people are not full-concours people. We'll skip the belly for now.
We'll also assume everyone's read the threads on this Forum about cleaning tips & tools - there are ome excellent ones there. So, we'll start with a pretty clean car, topside areas only, and the day before the event.
I start with the engine compartment . It's already been cleaned up with your goos of choice & looks fairly good. Get out the Q-tips & cotton cloths & go after everything you can reach - including seams, cheeseheads, etc. Air cleaner & battery should be out so you can reach everything possible. Unless you have REALLY long fingers & arms, you won't get everything, but you will be surprised at what you keep coming up with from your "clean" engine compartment. (Sidebar: I have been frequently judged by a friend I call Jon "long fingers" Lowe - many of you know of Jon. He has fingers that can reach everywhere & he loved to come out of my engine compartment with a smile & a smudge to show everyone).
There are many sharp edges in this area. You will finish up with bloody knuckles & scratches (tetanus shots updated?). Polish all painted surfaces with the same material used for your exterior. After the first time you've done this, use unscented Pledge for maintenance. There are a LOT of painted surfaces in this area. Don't forget the compartment walls, the sheet metal, intake tubes, underside of the engine lid (remove the drain pan first), etc. Don't leave any polish residue or dust behind - & redo the Q-tip thing.
I like to polish my fuel rails a little, not too much. This is also a good time to check all the fuel hoses & dress them up. Clean up the injectors & the associated mounting hardware. If you have non-original items, replace them with factory pieces. Obviously, if you have carbs (4 cylinder), they can't just be replaced - you'll have to live with the deduct. Don't forget to clean inside the drain tubes from the drain tray - that's another good use for procto-tips. Do whatever you have to to make sure that areas of your battery tray that are visible and clean & un-corroded. Before you replace the darin tray, clean it up & don't put any slick looking goo on it. Just remember, most goos are dust attractants & will come off on the judges fingers. Natural finish everywhere.
OK, we'll break here. At this point, your fingers & nails should be black, cuts & abrashions cleaned bandaged & hopefully unstitched! You engine bay is almost ready to show. The rest can be done at the event. You ARE planning on getting there early aren't you?
On enlisting help.....Yes, I have used gemstones as a reward, but not a promise! Once your helper is into it, they'll either say bye-bye or become a part of. At least that's my experience. The only thing I promise is a fresh nail job and a pat on the back.
Next episode - compartments, wheels & tires.
How important is it to remove the tarnish on carbs? If so, any tips on the removal (short of tearing them down)?
QUOTE(Jasfsmith @ May 5 2006, 08:28 AM)
How important is it to remove the tarnish on carbs? If so, any tips on the removal (short of tearing them down)?
I don't know how effective it would be while they're on the car, and I have no direct experience with cleaning carbs, but I probably would use brake cleaner, q-tips (the foam ones), tooth brush. I'd also envelope the carbs in something like dry cleaning plastic to keep spatters in place.
I'd also wear a respirator.
OK, Jasfsmith. Being being way up downeast in Bangor, where are you planning to show your 914?
Don
Don
Maybe just start with a trunks, exterior and interior concours. There will be plenty to do there to keep you busy cleaning for a season. A partial dismantel makes things easier. I pulled the door panels, took off all the knobs, removed the striker plates, and the the knee rest in order to remove the air vents for cleaning. The plastic parts i soaked with ZEP (home depo citrus cleaner.. super cheap and works great, but do not get it on paint and let it dry) in warm water. Also pull the door jam vents. On those pull off the foam pads on the back and toss em.. they hold water. The vents will also trap water so its a good idea to pull them and dry in there after a washing. I pulled the carpets too and cleaned them in the tub with oxy scrub. Speaker holders, pull and soak. A tooth brush works great for cleaning these plastic parts. To me the biggest PIA is the door jams.. Took a long time to get the grease out. The rest of the interior is pretty straight foward.. take off the arm rests and clean.. etc. By having the car apart, it really makes cleaning it easier. Clean all the painted areas and wax before assembly. Once you do it once, its just a matter of light maintence for the most part. Regarding the vinal, it should look like it came from the factory (ie no armoral !!). Same with the tires. Try the Vinalex.. a damp cloth and spray some vinalex on it and wipe it down that way. Seats come out easy too, allows easy access for cleaning once they are out.
Focus on one section at a time, get it to the best of your ability then goto the next area. Interior, then rear trunk, then front trunk. The front trunk will probally take you the longest time. Access can be difficult. Pull out the windshield bottle, take off the head light motor caps, remove the latches. The hood latch again, soak it in zep and clean it with a toothbrush and qtips etc. Access under the blower motors is difficult. I took some of that out and cleaned the plastic, then the body paint.
If you do one section per event, you wont be overwhelmed. And, by next year it just be a matter of light maintence. Then maybe you can focus on the engine bay and wheel wells.
I take a bucket of water and sponges with me so i can wipe down the car at the event. Tons of pollen this time of year here.
Just a tip... do your rubber and vinal cleaning/coating before you do your glass and paintwork. regarding your trim.. DO NOT get window cleaner on it.. it eats the finish over time. Use a paint cleaner like PS21 cleaner then a coat of carnuba wax and buff it by hand. Turns out real nice that way.
Focus on one section at a time, get it to the best of your ability then goto the next area. Interior, then rear trunk, then front trunk. The front trunk will probally take you the longest time. Access can be difficult. Pull out the windshield bottle, take off the head light motor caps, remove the latches. The hood latch again, soak it in zep and clean it with a toothbrush and qtips etc. Access under the blower motors is difficult. I took some of that out and cleaned the plastic, then the body paint.
If you do one section per event, you wont be overwhelmed. And, by next year it just be a matter of light maintence. Then maybe you can focus on the engine bay and wheel wells.
I take a bucket of water and sponges with me so i can wipe down the car at the event. Tons of pollen this time of year here.
Just a tip... do your rubber and vinal cleaning/coating before you do your glass and paintwork. regarding your trim.. DO NOT get window cleaner on it.. it eats the finish over time. Use a paint cleaner like PS21 cleaner then a coat of carnuba wax and buff it by hand. Turns out real nice that way.
QUOTE(tod914 @ May 5 2006, 03:38 PM)
Maybe just start with a trunks, exterior and interior concours. There will be plenty to do there to keep you busy cleaning for a season. A partial dismantel makes things easier. I pulled the door panels, took off all the knobs, removed the striker plates, and the the knee rest in order to remove the air vents for cleaning. The plastic parts i soaked with ZEP (home depo citrus cleaner.. super cheap and works great, but do not get it on paint and let it dry) in warm water. Also pull the door jam vents. On those pull off the foam pads on the back and toss em.. they hold water. The vents will also trap water so its a good idea to pull them and dry in there after a washing. I pulled the carpets too and cleaned them in the tub with oxy scrub. Speaker holders, pull and soak. A tooth brush works great for cleaning these plastic parts. To me the biggest PIA is the door jams.. Took a long time to get the grease out. The rest of the interior is pretty straight foward.. take off the arm rests and clean.. etc. By having the car apart, it really makes cleaning it easier. Clean all the painted areas and wax before assembly. Once you do it once, its just a matter of light maintence for the most part. Regarding the vinal, it should look like it came from the factory (ie no armoral !!). Same with the tires. Try the Vinalex.. a damp cloth and spray some vinalex on it and wipe it down that way. Seats come out easy too, allows easy access for cleaning once they are out.
Focus on one section at a time, get it to the best of your ability then goto the next area. Interior, then rear trunk, then front trunk. The front trunk will probally take you the longest time. Access can be difficult. Pull out the windshield bottle, take off the head light motor caps, remove the latches. The hood latch again, soak it in zep and clean it with a toothbrush and qtips etc. Access under the blower motors is difficult. I took some of that out and cleaned the plastic, then the body paint.
If you do one section per event, you wont be overwhelmed. And, by next year it just be a matter of light maintence. Then maybe you can focus on the engine bay and wheel wells.
I take a bucket of water and sponges with me so i can wipe down the car at the event. Tons of pollen this time of year here.
Just a tip... do your rubber and vinal cleaning/coating before you do your glass and paintwork. regarding your trim.. DO NOT get window cleaner on it.. it eats the finish over time. Use a paint cleaner like PS21 cleaner then a coat of carnuba wax and buff it by hand. Turns out real nice that way.
Tod914 - you are a pro! You have NAILED so many of the nuances of getting a car ready for consours, BUT....
I'm a reteried chemist/accoountant/etc. And one thing I learned is that citrus based cleaners are NOT necesarilly good for plastic of our vintage. Frequent use wll degrade the materials. Quite frankly, all you need is a few drops of commercial dtergent in a bucket of water to make the cleaning easy & have no after afffects. No dis intended. but these parts clean up just fine with 4 drops of Ivory Liquid to a gallon. No damage to parts - organic or man-made. My $.02, and who the heck am I?
Good stuff!
LOL ok Pat, well the dirty work is done on mine.. I'll keep the ZEPs on the back shelve so I dont get tempted again 
Don't have time to do it now, but will post pdf's of the PCR judging forms tomorrow. Got em late last night & they will be a big help AND very specific!
Will be out all day/evening or I'd do it now.
Oh, what the heck, just go to these links:
http://www.pca.org/members/library/pcr/200...reservation.pdf
http://www.pca.org/members/library/pcr/200...Restoration.pdf
[url=http://www.pca.org/members/library/pcr/2006/Appendix%20IV.3%20-%20Concours%20Score%20Sheets%20-%20Preparation.pdf
That should keep you busy for a while!
QUOTE(sixerdon @ May 5 2006, 02:07 PM)
OK, Jasfsmith. Being being way up downeast in Bangor, where are you planning to show your 914?
Don
Headed to the Zone 1 Rallye & Concours the 20th/21st of May in Danbury, CT. The more I prep the more I find needs cleaning. My goal is to arrive, make a showing (dead last won't bruise me to much), and soak up what knowledge I can from others making an appearance.
A crash course of sorts in advance of our planned attendance at this year's PCA Portland Parade.
Three hours of hell last night.
Attempting to clean the firewall in the engine compartment that showed a discoloration of the original paint in sevveral areas.
It appears to be a film with a bit of rough texture. Almost like a cream colored spray adhesive.
Tested standard citrus and chemical degreasers, a couple chemical solvents, steam and a fair amount of elbow grease, nothing touch it. Even tried Blue Majic and Semi Chrome. Nada.
Areas without the discoloration buff up nicely.
Before I get out the 1000 grit paper, any other suggestions?
Attempting to clean the firewall in the engine compartment that showed a discoloration of the original paint in sevveral areas.
It appears to be a film with a bit of rough texture. Almost like a cream colored spray adhesive.
Tested standard citrus and chemical degreasers, a couple chemical solvents, steam and a fair amount of elbow grease, nothing touch it. Even tried Blue Majic and Semi Chrome. Nada.
Areas without the discoloration buff up nicely.
Before I get out the 1000 grit paper, any other suggestions?
QUOTE(Jasfsmith @ May 9 2006, 05:27 AM)
Three hours of hell last night.
Attempting to clean the firewall in the engine compartment that showed a discoloration of the original paint in sevveral areas.
It appears to be a film with a bit of rough texture. Almost like a cream colored spray adhesive.
Tested standard citrus and chemical degreasers, a couple chemical solvents, steam and a fair amount of elbow grease, nothing touch it. Even tried Blue Majic and Semi Chrome. Nada.
Areas without the discoloration buff up nicely.
Before I get out the 1000 grit paper, any other suggestions?
Don't you have a sound pad on the firewall? If thats missing it could be remnents of glue that held it on?
Which car are you working on? If it's your six, it never came with a sound pad. But if someone added one in later years, it's probably old glue. If it's gritty, it could be from a factory application. I had the same on mine. I would have to see it in person.
I was planning to go to Zone 1 concours in Danbury, but personnal matters are preventing that this year. You should get some good feed back from the judges. I am a co-chair for next years Zone 1 to be held in Newport RI.
What's your VIN on your six?
Don
I was planning to go to Zone 1 concours in Danbury, but personnal matters are preventing that this year. You should get some good feed back from the judges. I am a co-chair for next years Zone 1 to be held in Newport RI.
What's your VIN on your six?
Don
FYI - PCA Zone 7 puts out an excellent concours handbook - highly recommended; expecially since the rules changed recently adding the new Preservation class - kind of between Street and Full. Also includes lots of info on how to prep your car; the author has won numerous concours in the SF Bay area.
http://www.pca.org/zone7/index.php?page=text&id=concguide
Also the forms for the various classes are downloadable at:
http://www.pca.org/zone7/index.php?page=te...d=concourcat#jf
These judging standards may vary from region to region, but it will give you an idea of what is involved.
Also, most Regions have a "Novice" class for newbies (no scoring involved for you in that concours). Recommend you do the research, prep your car for whatever class you're interested in (recommend Wash 'n Shine standard to start) and go thru the judging. During (and after) the grading the judges will provide tips on where improvements can be made. Then the next concours you're more preapred to be judged nd have a greater amount of comfort re: what is expected.
Bottom line - have fun and don't take yourself too seriously!
http://www.pca.org/zone7/index.php?page=text&id=concguide
Also the forms for the various classes are downloadable at:
http://www.pca.org/zone7/index.php?page=te...d=concourcat#jf
These judging standards may vary from region to region, but it will give you an idea of what is involved.
Also, most Regions have a "Novice" class for newbies (no scoring involved for you in that concours). Recommend you do the research, prep your car for whatever class you're interested in (recommend Wash 'n Shine standard to start) and go thru the judging. During (and after) the grading the judges will provide tips on where improvements can be made. Then the next concours you're more preapred to be judged nd have a greater amount of comfort re: what is expected.
Bottom line - have fun and don't take yourself too seriously!
QUOTE(sixerdon @ May 9 2006, 08:08 AM)
Which car are you working on? If it's your six, it never came with a sound pad. But if someone added one in later years, it's probably old glue. If it's gritty, it could be from a factory application. I had the same on mine. I would have to see it in person.
I was planning to go to Zone 1 concours in Danbury, but personnal matters are preventing that this year. You should get some good feed back from the judges. I am a co-chair for next years Zone 1 to be held in Newport RI.
What's your VIN on your six?
Don
I don't think it's old glue. It is located on the top have of the firewall and most noticeable on the top quarter. I'll run it by John Paterak. Perhaps he has a suggestion.
Vin on the 6 is 9140431113
Sorry to hear that you won't be at this year's event.
John will help you in preperation, but I don't know his level of knowledge in 914's. I DO know he's worked on several in the past including sixes. Also, the Zone 1 concours is not set up for authenticity like the parade. My experience has been they are looking for cleanliness.
Don
Don
Some of you have been asking about Jim's car. Well, I happen to have one picture of it from the Zone 1 concours. Unfortunately, the other pics I took were lost. This is a very nice, original 6.
QUOTE(Part Pricer @ May 23 2006, 06:57 AM)
Some of you have been asking about Jim's car. Well, I happen to have one picture of it from the Zone 1 concours. Unfortunately, the other pics I took were lost. This is a very nice, original 6.
Glad to see that you lost the engine pictures. Mine came out to dark as well, must have been the poor lighting.....
And yes there were no shock tower covers when I obtained the car. I have a mixed results on my research on whether they should be there or not.
James,
My sixes also did not come with the rubber shock tower covers. My two are earlier than yours, #0137 & #0876. (I have owned them for more than 15 years) If you look at the many early photo's from the early mag road tests, they too did not have the covers. If you have your owners manual there are photo's without the cover's. However, some of the photo's were of prototypes.
There were many other little details that Karmann added during the first months of mfr.
Don
My sixes also did not come with the rubber shock tower covers. My two are earlier than yours, #0137 & #0876. (I have owned them for more than 15 years) If you look at the many early photo's from the early mag road tests, they too did not have the covers. If you have your owners manual there are photo's without the cover's. However, some of the photo's were of prototypes.
There were many other little details that Karmann added during the first months of mfr.
Don
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