Some discussion recently about the rocker panel/door sill rivets, indicated the white ones are NLA. I bought a large supply of these in the eraly 80's, because I remove the rockers every couple of years for cleaning & replace them because they seem to be good for one use only.

I have 4 left & need to do my removal/clean operation, so I obviously will have to change. I'm assuming that the factory replacement rivets are readily available, but color are they? Anyone get these recently? What's pricing like? Do they do a job equal to the orig's, or are they better (better, I hope)?

Pat,
The translucent/clear ones seem to be the ones still available. I had to use them on one of my sixes when I was restoring it some 7 years ago. I think I bought them from Stoddard at the time. I still see them listed with Performance Products so I'm sure they are out there. I was pleased with the design to match up with original whites or blacks. It's just a neutral color that you'll have to deal with by dying or painting them. I have done neither on my six. Visually they look white at 1st glance, but they are not the original white.
I do not fully remove my rockers for that reason. I just remove the lower screws and pull back the panel without disturbing the rivets. If it's dry underneath, then you can use an air compressor to blow it out.

Don

So the OE fasteners for the TOP of the rockers were those push pin plastic rivits in
White or black? How about a Pic?

I asked the owner of this car here if he wouldnt mind checking when he had the opportunity. http://www.sloancars.com/vs1/detail.asp?CarID=80

He said next time he goes to his warehouse he'll take a look for us.

Too bad about the chrome strips down the sides! Hope those are glued on, rather fitted with clips. Ruins a perfect car.

Hi Pat,

I am 99% sure those chrome side strips are glued on. They were on my 74 when I bought mine (dealer installed). They peeled off & just had to remove the sticky stuff with solvent. I still have them & available "free" to anyone who puts them on his 914 .

Tom

BTW guys,

Here's a picture of black rivets for the rockers. I posted once before & here's another pic. They are a bugger to install because when you push the pin they have a tendency to bend. I believe the factory probably had a special tool to install. Don't know how many I damaged when installing mine with damaged ones thrown in the garbage can. I should have kept them. I believe I paid $1.25 each about (8) years ago. Now NLA. I have a few left if someone wants to use as samples to find replacements???? Pat???? or ????

Tom

I heard that these were available at NAPA auto parts. The black ones.

Tom,
I'd love to have one for a sample. Hope to find at least the transluscent ones, but will go with black if I need to. What do you suppose it would take for someone to repro these things?

I'll try to see if NAPA has them. By the way, I've always used a small drift pin to install mine & had no real problems - just slow & steady.

Jeff & Pat

I'll send both you guys a sample (East Coast & West Coast).

I have Jeff's address but need Pat's.

Pat, send me your address to my personal email tjbliznik@ameritech.net

Tom

Tom here's an earier thread on that car... Im under the impression they are riveted on. http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?show...16987&hl=berber
probally a few more threads on it, that was the 1st one I came upon.

Regarding the black rivets at NAPA, I tried 2 years ago and was a no go. Maybe you'll have better luck.

Pat,
The ones on my 75 were not glued but, pop rivet. When removed we spot welded the holes up and the job turn out like they were never there! I do have pics before and after if someone would like to see.
Gary

Just alittle spot paint in the area then Gary?

Nope, a hole repaint but there is more to the story and we can save that for another day when we want to talk fire and 914s!
Gary

I'll check with some plastic manufacturers and see if any of them have a match or can reproduce it. Maybe just the black being the clear are close enough to the white??

I had a discussion about the rivets on my 76 at the Danbury CT Zone One event last month. Sorry, I don't remember who I was talking too, but he noticed I had standard aluminum "pop" rivets. He asked me whether I had changed them and I told him it's been like that since I bought the car new. Is there anyone else out there with a 76 with the same thing?

Dave

How soon we forget.

What spurred my question was that the threshold piece has secured with the black plastic push pin, and the rocker with the aluminum rivet. I would have expected both to be the same.

Odd that Porsche would use white on a black rockers while using black on threshold plates. Thats way mine was anyway. early 75. Be interesting to note with production dates when some of these changes took place.. rivets, coil being moved to fan shroud, ECU moved to firewall etc.

Tried 2 NAPA stores today. Both pimple-faced guys had NO idea what I was talking about. Asked to talk to the manager, who was all of 20 - he didn't even know what a 914 is! I run into these problems all the time - is it just because I live outside Philly & these guys only know zoomy Hondas? Or is it because the 914 to them is like a '40 Ford was to me when I got my 914? Either way, write NAPA off on the east coast.

I gave the picture of them to my son. He's going to ask the parts guys at work and see what they come up with.

Late breaking news!
In my mini parts bin, I found a small package of push pin rivets I bought a few years ago at my local Auto Zone. When I first saw them in the store, I thought they were about the right size and they were (are) white! I bought a packet of 4 (cheap) to measure up to the real thing. They are close but not exactly the same.
The rounded head is slightly flatter than original.
Here's the info on the box;
on the front;
RIVET-TITE push rivet nylon .187 dia.
#47901 qty 4
on the back they indicate they are available in 4 different sizes; 3/32", 1/8", 5/32", 3/16"
(now the key)
MADE IN USA
BY MOTOMITE Mfg. Div of R&B, Inc.
P.O. Box 1800 Colmar, PA 18915-1800
copyright 1992

So who knows where this place is?? Who wants to initiate first contact?

Don

It's 1/2 way between Philly and Allentown (Mapquest)

No phone numbers listed for either business name

The Motomite line of parts is now owned by Dorman. Here is a link to the rivets:

http://www.dormanproducts.com/cgi-bin/vm91...ategory_list=:0

I have a couple other sources I'll follow through on. I'll mail out the samples tomorrow and see if they can match them with something in their product line.

Hey, any of you guys who need a sample rivet contact me & I'll send you one.

Tom

Little clarification here. Motormite is the house brand name for R&B Corp, of Colmar Pa. R&R bought Dorman in 1995. Long story short - I was Dorman's controller & that's how I wound up in Pa. My affiliation w/R&B lasted a few short months after the takeover & we parted ways with no love lost on either side.

I do still have many friends @ Dorman & I'll see what I find out. Regardless, R&B and Dorman are strictly packaging operations & do not manufacture. So, if those are still active parts they're probably made in the third world. By the way, Pep Boys also carries the line from R&B/Dorman so that's another posibility.

Can't believe all these posts about a stupid plastic rivet!

It's bout 5 miles from me (R&B), but that place is not where the fasteners are packaged - they're packaged by Dorman Products in Warsaw, Ky. Anyone in that area? That's the place to get them. Forget Colmar.

Hi Guys,

I did a little more research on rivets. I stopped at my local Porsche dealer and special ordered (12) black rivets for my car. The dealer checked Porsche and said white are NLA, but the black ones part # P999-591-550-40 will be in next week. Paid .96 cents each. I'll let you know next week if they match the ones I have in my car.

Note: Dealer had some larger ones in stock, part # P999-507-499-40 @ .30 cents each so I took them at that price. Never know if they can be used in a pinch. Hey, Judge Gary is half blind anyway.

Summary: Looks like 914 original size rivets (black only) are still available from Porsche. White ones are the problem, so keep looking.

Tom
BTW: Here's a copy of my invoice for reference.

better picture

Stoddard has those in stock. $0.80 each.

http://stoddard.com/shop/shopsearch.asp?se...ord=99959155040

Part Pricer, By the time you add shipping say $4.50 USPM or more you might just go to a dealer and pick them up! Tell them that Stoddard has them $.80 and see why theirs is more. But if no Porsche dealer is in driving distance , ship away.

Man those DO look big! Maybe not much diff when in place & they may even hold tighter. S'pose a halfay good judge would notice?

pricey little buggers, i thought the clear ones where fairly inexpensive. I'll follow through on aftermarket as well... white and black

The samples went out today to various vendors. I'll keep you all posted and see if they have a match.

Hmmmmmmm Well pulled some rockers a while back on a friends Nov 75 car...And they were aluminum..
BUT did not know if they were original...Looked as if they had NOT been drilled before..
Hmmmmm the mystery thickens....
They seemed to be pretty small and 'black'.....
Couldah been factory....

I was wondering how long it would take for this to come up. Seems there are differentt definitions of what the 'rockers' are. Rockers...what an undescriptive name.

There are the 'side valences', the long black exterior metal trim panels under the doors that need periodic cleaning. I cannot for the life of me understand why these are called rockers...somebody help me out and tell me. the side velences are attached with aluminum rivets and screws from beneath.

Then there are the 'threshold plates' or 'door sill plates' at the door opening sill, bright aluminum in the early cars, black plastic on the later cars. These were installed with the plastic rivets.

I also have a '75 (11/74) with the black aluminum rivets on the rockers. Unmolested car. At some point between '74 and '75 the factory made a change from plastic to aluminum. My '74 parts manual still calls for the plastic ones. Now we need some unmolested '74 owners to step forward.

Don

Well Jeff, you are the first one I've heard using the term "side valance". The term "front and rear valance" is used all the time. Rockers is just a short for rocker panel or rocker cover. No big deal. It's in all the books I've read. Been around since '69. P. Paternie uses the phrase in his book as well as numerous articles I've read over the years. Or, we can always call it what the factory called them. "Outer covering for longitudinal member".
Also, not all were attached with aluminum rivets along the top as you state. Only the later ones as we are discussing. The early cars had white plastic rivets (NLA) for the first several years. Check out Johnson's book which is consistant with my cars.

Don

so now im confused,
the black plastic rifvits are for the threshold plates only ?
and standard alum pop rivets were OE to secure the the tops
of the rockers
I can only recall ever seeing the Alum rivits but just assumed that
they had been replaced at suome time.
Jeff what about on the LE's?

Rich,
Black plastic rivets for black threshold plates only. (If that's what your car has)
We are trying to determine when plastic rivets were changed to aluminmum "pop" rivets on the rocker panels. Maybe an unmolested '74 LE could provide an answer.
Don

This is getting very interesting

Today I picked up the rivets ordered from the Porsche dealer. I expected them to be black, but they are clear. Now what?? How do we judge rivets now that Porsche only supply's clear????

Tom
BTW: We are becoming the new 356 crowd.

Here are my 100% original 74 Bumblebee rivets, the day I picked it up. Black plastic on the threshold plate, aluminum for the side valence. I bought it from the son of the original owner, he confirmed that the side valences had never been removed until I removed them to inspect the car before purchase. The car was from dry SoCal and the longs are pristine...whew...!

I went through this 3 years ago. I was told by a Porsche Parts personnel that black is NLA and was superceeded by clear. I was surprised to hear that there "were" black in stock @ .80 per. It was suggested to me that dying the clear ones might be an option. I'll see how they turn out with a permanent ink marker if the vendors fail to come up with a match.

Well now, ain't this a fine kettle of fish? (my grandmother's saying, not mine - but suits the meaning). We now have a plethora of potential rivets!

By my recollection, so far:
a) white plastic
black plastic
c) opaque plastic
d) clear plastic
e) natural aluminum
f) black aluminum

I wish my parts manual went beyond 73. Anyone have a more usable revision level? Might help if someone had a revision through the end of production.

I think we can safely assume that these parts, for the thresholds and "side valences" (I like that term) were plastic through at least 73, maybe into 74. Then came the dawn of aluminum, which makes better sense for the "side valences" only - valences remained plastic, though black. I've noticed the aluminum rivets on some 75/6 cars at concours events but (not knowing they were supposed to be aluminum) never deducted for them because they were on topside-only cars & the competition wasn't that heavy that that level of scrutiny was necessary - glad I didn't!

What we need badly is to know just when the transition from plastic to metal took place.

From a hardcore standpoint, does it really matter what color the plastic is, so long as it's a Porsche replacement part? If I were to put the clear rivets on my 72 (assuming I changed ALL of them to clear), should I be gigged? They are an authorized replacement part, and surely a better part by virtue of their more recent manufacture. Sure, I'd rather stay with white, but unless someone has a stockpile of them & wants to let some go, I have no choice. True, I could leave my "side valences" alone for now, but sooner or later they'll need to come off for cleaning.

That said, Nomex on - let the flames begin!

I'm with Tod. That was my experience 8 years ago doing my resto. After install, The rivets look like white anyway.

Jeff has the best info on an original LE for '74 even if my '74 parts manual says "plastic rivets" on the rocker panels.

And I agree with you Pat that I wouldn't gig any car with the latest Porsche replacement part.

I'm satisfied with the findings. Confirms my suspicions for many years. The '74 was the change over year.

Don

Should have some samples in white and black by next week.

McMaster car lists "off-white" plastic rivets. Inch sizes only, but might be worth a shot to order a few. They also list a tool to install them, but no picture of it.

Here are two rivets I found that might be good matches:

http://www.kent-automotive.com/webapp/wcs/...catalogId=10001

And how about these from Skiffy...

http://www.skiffy.com/docs/menufr.cfm?ID=x...2.cfm&img_id=12