Looks like I might actually finish the 5 lug conversion if the weatherman is even remotely correct on the lower temperatures around here this weekend.

I'm gonna take the car in next week for a 4 wheel alignment and need to know what to tell them.

Aggressive street driving with the occasional A/X and track event.

Negative camber?

Toe-in/out?

Lemme know....

Suspension parts? (Sways, torsions, springs...) Tires? Ride height? Driving style? Handling preferences? All of them play a big part in what kind of alignment settings you want.

Typically you want a little toe-in at the rear. The front could be a little toe-in (more stable) or a little toe-out (more darty, wears tires faster, but changes directions quicker). You usually want some negative camber all the way around; more for more-aggressive driving, and less for less such.

--DD

1st thing you need to do is confirm that the shop CAN align (properly) a 914 !!!!!

A few extra shims for the rear might not be a bad idea (see Resource section)

We need a how to for us home jobbers. They have measuring tape wheel guages for the front and I think they might work on the back also. On a flat floor, could we not use angel finders to do our own cambering?


Mechanisnipanicsbblaaaah

There are only 2 places in town that know how to align a 914. This place is one of them.

I have extra shims thanks to Thomas aka one914racer...

What kind of negative camber should I look for?

1 - 2 degrees?

Well since no one is gonna reply...

I would try 2 degrees all around with 1/8th toe in

If you still drive it on the street toe out on the front can get kinda annoying

What is the rest of the suspension like? What about the tires? If you want reasonable answers, we need to know more details.

--DD

Ask JOHNMAN. He has set up several 914s and has tested the settings on the track and street. First you should corner balance the car. This will establish ride height at front. The diagonal weights should be as close as possible with the normal load on the drivers seat (say 150 of weight in the seat). Then set alignment. He as done his car and my de car over the last several years. He bought an alignment machine (Bear) a couple of years ago and has tested a lot of settings. I think a little front toe in (maybe a degree), and very little toe in at the rear (less that factory) (.5 degree ??). A little negative camber at front and rear and all of the front caster you can get..........Our cars are very stable and neutral.

2 degrees negative camber and 1/8" toe-in all around?

Well it may work for someone out there, but NOT ON MY CAR!


What do you want to do with your car?

Autocross?
Track Events (Drivers Ed/Club Racing)?
Street?

If I had to recommend something without knowing how you want to use the car, I would opt for agressive street.

With stock springs/shocks, I would recommend similar to stock settings (with a lower than stock ride height).

With stiffer springs all around and a stiffer swaybar, I would give it some more negative cabmber and a little less toe.

On our race car, I set camber to achieve uniform tire temps across the face of the tires (both front and rear) The rear has little negative camber with 400# springs and the front runs approximately -1.5 degrees with 23mm tortion bars and a 21mm sway bar.

On my street car, I run less agressive. I have -.8deg camber front and -.5 deg rear.

On both cars, I shoot for 1/16" toe-in all around.

Be sure to first set ride height close to what you want and then do a corner balance with weight in the drivers seat. When aligning the car, keep the weight in the drivers seat. It will make a difference in how the car handles.

For a street car (where looks are more important), It may not be and advantage to add weight to the drivers seat as this will undoubtedly require the car to sit slightly crooked while unloaded and static (drivers side will sit slightly higher than passenger side to shift weight to the lower (passenger) side.

Do not reset ride height AFTER an alignment as this will nullify any alignment work that was done.

5 lug, 911 struts, stock 914 torsion bars, front & rear stock sway bars, koni reds all around, 140 lb rear springs (wanna go 180). Right now tires are just cheapo v rated 205-55 directionals....

I can post actual alignment settings for the street car and the track car if you want, but your milage may vary. The track car has been developed over the last 18 years.

Tires will make a big difference in how you want to set the car up.

For instance slicks are set up with vastly different amounts of camber than are DOT street or track tires. (Hoosiers are set up differently than Kuhmos) Street only tires that never really get hot and sticky are set up differently yet again.

Autocross setups can be even more aggressive than big track/high speed tracks as they are typically more violent on the suspension components (smaller, tighter courses have more abrupt transitioins than do high speed race tracks).

Where do you want to go today?

Mostly street driving with a few A/X's and maybe a DE here and there. I want to go to either Falken Azenis or Yokahama AD48's for the tires

I set up my street car similarly to yours (except I have heavier rear springs).

I set ride height to slightly lower than stock and corner balanced it with 175# in the drivers seat. I ended up in the neighborhood of 5-3/4" to the donuts in front and about 6 1/2" to the donuts in the back.

With the 175# removed from the drivers seat, my car sits approximately 5/8" higher on the drivers side (plus my battery and my spare tire are on the drivers side).

Front:

I ended up with as much caster as I could get (5.80 +/- 0.10 degrees)
I ended up with front toe-in of (0.07") on each front wheel for a total toe of (0.14")
I ended up with (-0.80 +/- 0.05 degrees) camber.

Rear

I ended up with rear toe-in of (0.05") on each rear wheel for a total toe of (0.10")
I ended up with (-0.40 +/- 0.05 degrees) camber.

Getting the rear toe equal on both sides is key.

You MUST get the thrust line set to as close to 0.00" as possible. (Thrust line is how far off center the rear axle alignment is) This is usually the setting I try the hardest to get dead nuts. This keeps the car stable when jumping on and off of the accelerator (I have a 3.2 in the track car and my street car).

The second most important setting to get as close as possible is the front toe and you want to keep it to a minimum, but you don't want to go positive with toe on the steet or you will feel the car want to change lanes on you.

The third setting I work hard at is caster. Getting the caster set for 6 degrees makes for an easy car to drive.

The last setting I work at is camber. You want to get camber set very close side to side, but on a street car, it is slightly less critical.

On a track setup, I opt for closer camber settings and punt on the caster settings as I can live with a slightly less stable straight line much better than I can live with a car that handles better in one direction than the other.

I hope this helps and that others don't pound me too badly because their "setup" is so much better than mine.

just my $0.02

With stock suspension components all around, and 140 lb/in springs in the rear, the car will be tail-happy. Probably significantly so. I would use even more negative camber on the rear end of the car than I typically recommend to keep it behind you.

At a guess, front camber -0.5 degrees; rear camber -1.5 degrees. You might even cheat the front closer to zero, to make sure the back end likes staying behind you.

Toe-in about 1/16"-1/8" all the way around.

Max caster that you can get while still being even from side to side. (Stock spec is 6 degrees, IIRC).

--DD

An otherwise stock 914 front suspension with heavier rear springs will not necessarily be "tail happy" with the weight of the 2.7 back there (unless your right foot wants it to be).

Perhaps with the lighter weight of a 914-4, heavier rear springs could overpower the car and make it oversteer, but I have found different real world results when it comes to 914-6's.

Thanks for the advise guys.

How about the Koni's?

Full soft all the way around?

Start 'em all off in the middle, and tweak to get the handling you want!

Uhh, of course exploring the limits of adhesion on public roads can be Very Hazardous to your health (not to mention others!) so it might be best to find an autoX or similar environment where you can't hurt anyone/anything.

--DD