i plan to switch engines next week and am asking for those bits of experience not found in the manuals. the rebuilt is a 10k short block, ceramic lifters, euro p/c honed and new rings, stock d-jet.

what grade oil should i use for the start up? how long before i should change it?

since it's built on a short block w/10k and has ceramic lifters, i don't think i need to do the 20 minute at 2500 rpm break-in of the cam.

what to do about building up oil pressure on first turn-over of the engine? i was going to have the plugs out and turn the starter until the light goes out and the gauge registers.

does a rebuilt ever not build up pressure? what then?

any other words of experience?

If your engine doesnt build up pressure, ive heard of people taking OFF the oil filter and pouring oil in the crankcase while starting, supposedly it works, but i dunno.

Just use enough assembly lube.

b

i did read a post that implied to me that someone, on start-up, did it with the filter removed. interesting. i would fill the filter with oil before putting it on but not sure i'd start without the filter.

i did use assembly lube and greased the oil pump for priming the pump

Then you shouldnt have many problems.

I fill up the oil filter with oil when i do a oil change. I think it helps.

b

I pre oil mine. I use an electric drill to run one of those cheap pumps with a quarter inch shaft. I syphon out of an oil bottle and I have a pressure gauge between the pump and the male nipple that I run into the oil pressure sensor hole. I see about 25psi.

If I picture this right you are usinng the old cam with new ceramic lifters, right? I know old cams and new lifters are a bad idea but I'm not sure with ceramic. Ceramic are good but not perfect. I had 2 new cams go flat with ceramics. As far as I know, I'm the only person so far to do that. I hope it works. Keep us posted.

Dave

i bought the ceramics because i would be using a "used" cam (10k on short block) and the ceramics were not supposed to wear out or have a wear-in problem according to the supplier of the ceramic lifters. they were significantly more $ so i hope they do what i bought them to do. i read about the problem of recent supplies of lifters so i "bellied up to the bar"and put the money down.

how about break-in oil grade or brand?

When i rebuild mine, i'll run regular 10W-30

then switch to AMSOIL.

b

Jim

I don't know what to tell you. The 3rd cam seems to be doing OK. My cam grind was very aggressive and ramp rates were very high. We backed away from that with the 3rd one and so far so good. Like I said I think I'm the only one so you'll probably be fine.

I guess this is an example of "Nothing is for sure" and everything needs scrutiny.

I think most people recommend 30wt Non-detergent for breakin and seating rings but I would ask the ring supplier first.

Dave

I would suggest running it for 20 min at 2500-3000 rpm. It won't hurt anything and if anything will help seat the rings and lifters. No sense in taking unnecessary chances.

As far as oil, everyone has a different idea. I would just run 20w50 dino oil. Change after 500 miles and you are ready to use whatever you want.

Matt

30wt non det oil with new filter, preoil by turning over motor with plugs out until you build good oil pressure.


Then run the 20-50 Mobil 1 AC Motorcycle oil, damn it really does make a difference.

You got it right Jim.

Build oil pressure with the starter with the plugs out. Since you don't really need cam break in you can just go out and start driving it. I favor the hard break in school of thought. Definitely don't keep the engine at a sustained engine speed under load (i.e. while driving) for awhile. Driving it hard forces the rings against the cylinder walls and helps get a nice seat. But engine break-in is one of those extremely controversial subject.

that's why i keep replying and ing this to the top. i needs to know...

i have the feeling i will be doing the high revving thing as i try to set the timing. i forgot how much all those wires and hoses get in the way and look like spagetti

thanks for all replies

Ceramics do not require a break in period at all..

Dave had an issue that was MY fault- The cam I set him up with was still somewhat experimental and was not compatible with the lifter diameter as well as it should have been..

He is the ONLY person that has had any issues and I feel that even with his issue the engine would have never suffered any further wear.

Ceramics are worth twice their cost, the manufacturer wasn't lying to you at all. I use them in every engine I build . Now that the suplies of their material is drying up I am swapping to roller cams/lifters for all my engines- the development of this has priority now since we only have enough ceramics to build 15 more engines in stock, thats about 10 months of work for us, so I have 10 months to FULLY develop the roller program..

as far as oil goes, I have used all types and never saw any benefits. I don't believe in babying engines during break in- run it like it'll be driven, taking it easy won't make a difference at all!

Pre oiling. Has anyone noticed the slick set up that is pictured in Hot VW this month?
Our man from Georgia came up with neat set up that I am going to copy for my next motor build.

Now you got to go buy a copy of the rag to see it.

$8.44 a quart at local FLAPS

Someone mentioned 10w30. For most of us, especially in the spring and summer months, that's too thin. 20w50 would be my choice. I leave the filter loose until oil leaks out while cranking it with the plugs out and the coil disconnected, then tighten it up and wipe it off. It's worked for me for over 35 years, and I don't see that changing. The Cap'n

Cap'n, did you get that PM about the ECU bracket? i sure would like it.

I'll touch a little on the break in. Ask 10 people and you get 10 different answers.

My version:

Rings are the critical part since it takes VERY little time to glaze the cylinder walls and once that happens it may never break in. DO NOT USE SYNTHETIC TO BREAK IN!!! Don't let the engine sit and run a long time after it first fires up. The cam guys want you to run at high RPM but they only care about their cam and warranty and could give a squat if your rings break in.

Get on the road as quickly as possible. Rings work by gas pressure behind them pushing outwards against the cylinder walls and you have to get on the throttle and load the engine for that to happen. That generates heat. The idea is to load and unload the engine. From a dead stop, run it through the gears briskly and frequently with a light cruise inbetween runs for cool down Don't baby it!. Do this 10 times, each time increasing load and rpm between shifts and then shut the engine down for a complete cool down. Repeat 5-10 times. Change the oil, you're done! Do whatever you want .... The cool down is an important thing to do as it allows the parts to move and become stable. We always used to build racing engines with "seasoned" blocks.

Unfortunately, the guy that baby's his new toy and tries to be easy on it, is typically the guy that suffers with an oil burner....my .02

I like honesty and forthrightness...

In my Type 1 rebuilds I used a good quality Dino oil. Varied the rpms at startup from 1500 -2000 rpm for cam considerations. Shut down after 20 minutes and let it cool. Changed oil and filter then. I would take the car out and do a ring seating procedure by accelerating and decelerating number of times in an intermediate gear then cool and change the oil/filter again. Next oil change came at 500 miles or so. I had good results with this method.

Mike T

nice point jake.