I bought one of those infrared heat-measuring guns and thought I was really pretty cool out there measuring the temperature (inside, middle, outside) on my tires, only to discover from Tony that the infrared guns are not the way to go. It was also fun at Buttonwillow to measure the blacktop temperature (140).

Now, in order to get a more accurate temperature reading, I have to get one of those probe-measuring devices. Which unit has worked for you and where do you find them?

The key is.. infrared works. It's not as consistant as the probe mainly because you wont hit the same spots over and over again bending over the fender pointing it. Once you use the probe style.. you will hit the same spot every time.


I know a lot of pro teams who use a infrared. They dont really care about the actual number. They are looking for consistancy around the car across the tire. They are looking for a number not the real to life temp.


B

Infrared is fine, like Brad says. Just be consitant in using it, try to shoot the same spots on you tires. The temp is important, more important though is having the temp even across the tire.

Ok, I'm having a related debate about tire temps and pressures on a dutch bbs

The temp of the thread is highest where the thread is loaded most right?
So, if the inside is hotter than the outside, the inside is doing more work than the out side

Correct me if I'm wrong please... This so called tire expert I'm chatting with is so full of bullshit that I'm starting to confuse myself

cheers,

Jeroen

Um... yeah. Pretty easy common sense answer. Heat is generated in the area doing the most work. The whole idea is to have a tire that is evenly distributing the load across the tire.

Too much inside heat and I would say too much negative camber. Stand the tire up.


B

Yeah, that's what I thought I knew
This guy is supposed to be some head-huncho at a tire chain, but he's so full o shit...

Thanks for clearing it up

cheers,

Jeroen

Tire chain ?? He runs a tire store ??


b

Top-management posistion...
You won't believe the crap he's telling people... but hey, he's the expert

cheers,

Jeroen

For a tire store ?? correct ??

You made reference to 'tire engineer' earlier. Ask him how much time he has spent with Yokohoma/Michelin/Goodyear tire engineers who support professional racing events.


B

No, he's not an engineer... just a self proclaimed expert
And even I was enough of an expert to see right through him... scary

The time he spent with the engineers (if any) was probably wasted on chit chat about the weather

cheers,

Jeroen

Ha ha. So far.. the Yokohama rep for SoCal is one of the best around. He actually goes out of his way to get different compounds for the teams.

B

Geez, that's funny boys, I have NEVER seen an infared unit in ANY tire engineers hands. I firmly stand on what I told Randal. Don't belive me call Hoosier, Toyo, Kumho, ect and speak to their tech department.

-tony

I think it will work fine for Randal. It doesnt work for engineers (you are 100% correct... I have never seen one walking around with one either) I say it will work fine for him because he is limited in his adjustments at the track. The teams rely on the engineers info to make hasty changes at a pro event... Randal is ways off.

Had he asked me or you prior to buying his infrared gun.. we both would have told him to buy the stick version. I had good luck with the small Longacre setup that Frey sold.


B

Hi,
I just recently attended a tech session at Tech Art in LA and there was a rep from Michelin there. He recommmended the probe type. He said when the car comes in the heat starts to "wick away" from the tire immediately and you can't get an accurate reading with the infra red type. I don't know much about tire temps myself but it seems infra red would work ok if you just wanted a camparison temp. I was interested to learn that he also recommended an analog tire gauge rather than a digital gauge. I thought the digital would be more accurate. It was a good tech session. There was a guy there from Brembo who was very knowlegable and I learned alot. I can't afford any of the stuff they had there but I learned alot just the same.
Cheers, Elliot

Yes. I have a problem with my tire engineer.

As soon as I pull into the staging lanes after an AX pass, he's on them tires like flies on sh....
Then starts the harangue......" You need .342 deg more negative camber in the left front, 2 psi more & 3psi less in the left front & left rear respectivly, both the jounce & rebound are too stiff in the right rear, aaand your washing out the front end by over braking into that hairpin. I don't know why I bother with such an oaf"

I give him my best dumbfounded stare....even manage to drool, sometimes.

Jeroen,
I would simply say that the laws of physics states that friction causes heat. The area on the tire that is experiencing or producing the most friction will generate the most heat.

I would love to see his response to that...

Rich

I already mentioned him that...

His response?
"The contact patch will cool down faster because the heat will sink into the road/track surface... The non-contact patch will hold the radiant heat"


He ain't a racist (AFAIK) but he sure sounds like Alfred

cheers,

Jeroen

Sound like he's spending to much time at the "coffee shops" in Holland.....

The debate went on for 5 BBS pages...
In the end I told him he was full of shit... He was pretty pissed

cheers,

Jeroen

Can you say bullshitter....er... I mean Marketing Manager" boys and girls?

Don't have to know anything about the product, just talk a good line.

We Engin-nerds call em "Sales Weenies" cuz that's where they come from....

Ken

[Yes. I have a problem with my tire engineer]


Actually I'd love to have someone out there telling me that I just drove way to hot into the hairpin. How to adjust tire pressures to make the car handle better.... now that would be unbelievable.

What I've found is that in the heat of battle it's very hard to slow down and figure out the best approach. AutoX certainty doesn't reward those that "slow down," but sometimes that is what you have to do (in certain place) to get faster.

This is especially true when your driving a 2.0 914 and chasing all the zoomie guys. You always have to drive smarter and faster, otherwise you simply get your butt kicked.

You know what is interesting - the amount of time it takes to really understand suspension stuff.

And just when you think you understand what does works, you go to another venue and the car doesn't work. Of course I admit making changes in between, but this kind of thing can drive you nuts. Next time someone tells me that a 260 compound will work about as good as a 210 in an AutoX situation...

What's the best advice you ever got from someone (in your camp) in an AutoX?

Mine: Look ahead. Breathing throughout the entire run.

I don't think there's any particular advice that has really stuck, except practice, practice, practice.

I do remember the answer to a semi-question....it may have been a whine.....that I uttered.
I had a hot dog drive the ulf for 2 AX sessions. On the second day I finnaly said something like...."where am I loosing time". He was 3-4 sec quicker. He said "Everywhere"........pretty hard to argue with that

I also like having a co-driver. Lottta that goes on at he Nationals and with good reason.

Having someone really good drive your car is a gud plan....if your ego can take it. It tells you exactly where the big problem is or if there is a problem with the car.....that's my experience, for what it's worth.
Doug said "the car is great" (translation: you're an oaf)

Compared to my regular co-driver, I have been getting better. At the start of the season, he was consistently 1.5-2 sec quicker . Now we're neck & neck......so there's hope.
I just hope he ain't slowing down.