Ok guys... Another cause, but this time we don't need your money we need your talent.

Kenny (Orange914) needs our help. On his way to West Coast Ramble he dropped a valve. Mike is getting the parts and the machine work together and this will be a great way for young Kenny to learn to build an engine but we need some knowledgable guys to look over Kenny's shoulder and make sure this thing goes together and he gets his car back on the road.

The bonus is that we get fed some tasty BBQ and spend some 914World time together.

The date is to be determined but I want to gauge interest in helping young Kenny out?

Kenny lives just South of Modesto in Ceres. So this is Central Valley. Fairly close for both South Bay guys and Sacramento guys...

Who might be able to help with this???

BBQ?? sounds like fun. Depends on the date. Is the engine out of the car??

My understanding is that the engine is out of the car. Date is pending...

yes the engine is out and ready for surgery! the date will be around your scheduls. its in an inclosed equipt shop in the back, so should all be good. if i have someone experianced in splitting the case for a cam we'll do that too. i just need to know so i can order the appropiate parts.
thanks all, mike

i'll be there. pretty much any day works for me ...

Andy

Anyone have a 2.0 liter crank? I have a set of rods. We might as well make a 2.0 liter out of the thing. The thing is Mike and Kenny, it would be best if the engine is taken apart and all cleaned up before the BBQ occurs. Then all the tin is cleaned and repainted, the engine is clean... Kids going to learn to build an engine he might as well learn to build an engine and not just put bandaids on one...

One of the major wear items on these engines is the cam... I would take it all the way down. That way you don't get it taped and bandaided together and find out the cam has flat lobes...

i got a 2.0L crank and lightened flywheel. rods and cylinders and 3 pistons and some other stuff ...
i can let the whole lot go for very cheap. it's just collecting dust here.
even have a GA 2.0L case ...

Andy

thanks guys this will be great. are you going to drive your 914 andy? by the way my oldest son (andy) had a mohawk, i'll have to find pic's. we'll start tear down and cleaning asap. i'm open to new repair/rebuild possibilities, so far i've got 2 i've plotted out i'll list them below. keeping in mind while repairing the dropped seat we're looking to:
1 keep or improve reliablity/cooling (HOT central valley)
2 extra power is great but not at too much expence to m.p.g. or drivability
3 long life build
here are my ideas:

Repair #1 $1350 ---1911cc---

-new heads
-new 96 mm cylinders and pistons
-gaskets
-rod bearings

Pros
-least expensive (new top end)
-larger displacement-horsepower 1911 cc./95 h.p.(23.2:1power to weight)
-easier installation that other repairs


Cons
-poss. Heating issues
-decrease of m.p.g. from stock
-cam issues?
____________________________________________

Repair #2 -$1800? ---1911cc---


-new/rebuilt big valve 2.0 les w. modified head set $1200
-96mm cylinders and pistons (~$200~[45 min. old])$600 new!
-2.0 engine tin (2 piece)
-2.0 intake manifolds and plenum? needed?
-2.0 injectors?needed?
-jake raby cam
-2.0 gaskets
-crank/rod bearings

Pros
-larger displacement- MOST h.p. 1911 cc./ 115 hp.(19.1:1 power to weight)
-resale, reliability and, effeicency of Les W. 2.0 heads
-no cam issues
-matched parts

Cons
-most expensive(-$1800?)
-more difficult build-would need outside help
-decrease of m.p.g. from stock

I can be there to hang out if it's on a weekend.

Central Valley heat is a factor. Jake puts combos together that reduce heat and increase reliability... If you have a 2.0 liter crank and rods and the P&C's you have at least a 2.0 if not a 2056 in the works. Of course, you will have to carb it unless you can come up with DJet and that is its own set of problems these days...

I would consult with Mr. Raby, the combo is critical and with so many recipes you don't know what you will come up with... PM Mark too... He might be able to advise you if you go the 2056 route.

I have 2.0 liter rods, Andy has a crank and other stuff... or we can just keep it a simple 1.7 rebuild... I have seen a lot of rather quick 1.7 engines around NoCal... Just be glad it isn't a 1.8!!!

i just found jake raby's web site and got his phone no. i'll be on the phone mon. cant p.m. him its full. i'm thinking to do option #2 (1911cc) with the stock d-jet (great shape). seems it will work fine acording to AA. maybe an inline risister to cht and fuel pressure tweek. the ga2.0 case possiblity is a great idea but i think too involved for what we want and i'd hate to see a 2.0 go to anything less than resto. or all out hipo. but offer appreciated nontheless.

this has been quite a process but i'm learning alot about these build combo's. i should be at the point mon. to order parts, then try to get the engine tore down next week. in 2 weeks i'll attempt to have parts for the weekend of july 7th or 8th if that works. you all let me know so i can kill the fatted calf

by the way is the 1.8 mechanically much different from the 1.7 or 2.0?

Kenny, what's the list of parts you have right now...

If gas mileage is a major issue, you prolly want to stick with the D-jet. That will effect your cam decision. Not sure how the 1.7 djet would handle 1911 or 2056cc. Jake or McMark can help there. Most of the people here are performance oriented...I'm surprised no one has suggested a six!! Or a suby? A good solid 1.7 should be fun.

Who's doing the head repair for the dropped valve?

If the goal is to stick to DJet then mixing things up is beyond my expertise. I wouldn't try to trick DJet into thinking it is home when it is at a hotel if you know what I mean...

I assume that your DJet ran well to begin with? If it didn't then you are simply bolting your old problems on to a new engine.

If you want to go with the parts Andy has then you get a two liter out of it and you could go with a cam that will work with DJet or Carbs.

A question for Mr. Bowlsby or Mr. Anders would be if the 1.7 DJet will work with the 2.0 with only an MPS change. Mr. Bowlsby is busy with a move further North in the Bay Area I understand... Maybe others know?

if i go with the 1.8 heads/96cc cyls/rod bearings i'll get that thru AA, i've already talked to them for about 1/2 hour.

if i have repair help i can do cam and basically do complete engine. (and several have said they can help). then i'll need to buy the set of 2.0 heads and appropiate f.i. cam from jake raby. a set of 96mm cylinders. 2.0 tin. do i need 2.0 intake, plenum and injectors? i have a great running d-jet system presently, arent they the same? i know 73 ecu is for both 1.7 and 2.0. this is my prefered route. i'll get the parts ordered monday after i call jake raby. the tin and other misc. i'll have to hunt down asap. in between we'll be tearing down and cleaning parts.
mike (kenny's dad)

Just a warning Mike,
Jake has worked out his cams based on engine combos he put together. He knows they will work with what he puts together. What he wants to avoid is the grief he gets when people buy his cam and put it with who knows what and get bad results. People always blame the cam. Jake has recently stopped selling cams altogether but may have restarted.
I have nothing against Jake or George, but Jake wants to make sure that if you buy from him your result is great, not just ok... He may not want to sell just a cam not knowing what you are going to do with it.

My suggestion, call McMark. He may have a 2056 kit sitting waiting for que or call Jake and get one of his. These come with heads, pistons, cylinders, all the gaskets, and pretty much everything else you need.

My very strong suggestion is you call Mark for advice.

yes i really like the d-jet and here in ca. with smog checks the way they are i like to stay with the origanal as much as possible. sneaking in some h.p. is nice though. i'll talk to jake about the cam tomorrow keeping in mind d-jet and heating. AA and many others have given great feedback on using d-jet with this 1911 cc set up. i've been told much bigger/hotter engines have used it with great results. we have a 95 maxima with 3.0 dohc/5 speed that would make a cool tire smoking conversion just not this time. this build should change the power to weight ratio from 27:1 to 19:1! at the same will hopefully keep the m.p.g. to a useable level. cone dodger, sir andy, hammy, borderline have said they are intersted in giving a hand. the more the merrier i'll buy the bbq! i do need commitment though if i go the cam route.

i used to work on a lot of different f.i. systems as a mechanic before my accident so i'm real familiar with modern systems. i did own a 76 bus l jet and now i've gotten somewhat familiar with kennys d-jet. the feedback mostly i've gotten is a little tweeking and it wil work fine. yes the d-jet ran great, no issues. we even changed over to front fuel pump and steel lines, so should have no suport issues.

i'll be asking jake raby about 1.7 d-jet cam, but am open to 2.0 bottem end. i need to talk to sir andy today anyway. (andy if your reading this my # is 209-537-3749)

who is mr. bowlsby? f.i.guru? maybe i should talk with him. i got a load of parts to buy next week. i really need to buy appropiately.

i plan on going with a set of heads from jake (low mile rebuilt 2.0 l.e.). i want to go with any engine combo he suggest for my needs. the research he and others have done is invaluable and i dont want to screw my engine up thinking i know more than these guys. can you p.m. me marks number i would like to talk to him. i really need to lock in my direction soon so i can get on ordering parts. i hope jake will sell an appropiate cam that will match the 2.0 heads i'm planning on buying at this point, i'll be calling this monday.

none purchased yet, i understand you sell kits? could you p.m. or better yet call me? 209-537-3749
thanks, mike

Say a day and I am down like a clown Charlie Brown, unless it is my anniversary or something. We could maybe carpool down, Rob is pretty close to me.

I would say go with a kit that Raby has, heads and cam, he already has done the R&D

I agree. Let Raby do the recipe. He knows what will work. He has already tried to and in many cases broken combos. He eliminates the bad ones and goes with the good ones.

thanks toby would july 7or 8 or more realistically 14 or 15 work tenitively for all?



trying to contact them tomorrow

Mike: You seem to be in a hurry. Engines don't like to be assembled in a hurry. Too many mistakes can be made. Take your time and make an informed decision, get the parts on order and when they get here, schedule the assembly date. This group is all about helping other teeners. We'll be here when your ready.

just my $.02

thanks, i'm not trying to rush assembly. it may appear that way but my computor time is extreemly limited. i am aggressively researching proper repair due to curcumstances. i normally dont enter this into conversation but 4 years ago i had a motorcycle acident and am now a quadrapalegic with medical factors. i try not to mention this becouse i dont wanted others to feel im using this for personal gain. i was a mechanic and can fully appreciate the complexity of a well planned and assembled engine. i am asking alot of questions so i can get good results in end product (engine build.) i hope i dont seem pushy and really do feel blessed with the extra help offered from the club to assemble the engine. i do however feel a responsibility to my son for the best educated outcome as this is a lot of money and want to do this wisely.
i have excellent direction in what engine repairs are needed thanks to the 914 worlds great membership and now and need to order parts this week. things to do today:
1 jake raby's got 2.0 heads i promissed to give commitment to purchase today.
2 i need to get hold of (by phone) mcmark, sir andy (if your reading this post could you ring me at 209-537-3749?) i'll p.m. you too
3 i have to find/buy 96mm pistons/jugs
4 talk to jake about cam and order

thanks again to all, mike

i hate talking on the phone ... email gives me more time to spellcheck

anyways, i got a set of 96 cylinders and 3 (three) KB pistons to go with it. the 4th piston has a chunk broken off the sleeve and needs to be replaced.
i got the 2.0 crank, rods and flywheel.

that's almost all of the guts to make a nice 2056.

in fact, you can have my 2.0L GA case as well.

get a good cam and lifters from jake, and you're almost there!

like i said, i'll give you a smoking deal on the lot ...
Andy

PS: got some more boxes of stuff too. almost a complete 2056, except the heads and cam and lifters ...

andy
thanks for the offer, if i can go this route i know kenny will be loving it. could you give me a cost on the 2.0 case, crank, rods and pistons (basically 2.0 bottom end with and with out pistons). do you have a good set of 96's than just need rings?p.m., e-mail or post me please whatever works for you. do you think there is machine work needed to case? like line bore or other. bottom line is i'd love to go 2056 but may have to use my 1.7 and cam it. i'll be talking to jake tomorrow at 9 a.m. about a set of 2.0 heads, cam, pistons (maybe) that im buying. i'll need to know 1.7 or 2.0. to get parts. crazy how a dropped seat evolves into this! i want to do it right and appreciate all the good folks out there offering help, so i'm trying to get it right for all.
kenny is working to first tear down a spare 1.7 for any misc. parts/hardware we may need. then after i know if we're building a 2056 or 1911 we'll tear down (or not) his original. should be accomplished shortly between his summer school and work. i'll be ordering parts soon, so i'm shooting for both accomplished in 2 weeks? what do you think of july 14th sat. or 15th sun. to all get together? thats about 3 weeks from now.
thanks again, mike

you may notice i always forget to spell check
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Bastille Day, we can all eat French Fries

new update on engine build as of 7/28/07, just waiting to order jake raby cam/push rods and misc. to complete parts for build. i can then have idea of build date:
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PRE-ENGINE BUILD PREP things done and to do:
- sand blast tin, wash, primer, paint DONE

- remove heads/cylinders and any misc. needed from parts engine, clean bench DONE

- clean and lay out case, pistons, rods, bearings and set up table for extra layout of cleaned bolts/parts PARTIALLY DONE

- install new rod bearings, plastic gauge clearances, install and torque rods on crank to ready for build

- hone cylinders/clean pistons and soap wash/compress air dry/oil, have checked for roundness

- have 911 swivels machined .060 and shim rocker stands

- remove fuel injection, engine mount and misc. needed from original motor for new build motor, layout on spare table


2056 ENGINE SPECIFICATIONS: http://www.aircooledtechnology.com/cylinderheads.htm
71mm stroke x 96mm bore
- Len Huffman prepared .039 2.0 Porsche http://www.haminc.biz/vw/type4.shtml
- relocated and sized spark plug
- valve 42x36 mm
- improved seat material and machining process
- 55 cc ported and polished
- chromoly retainers (may have upgraded titanium)
- stainless steel valves

- 2.0 “GA” case
- line bored (0.50mm) .020
- balanced rotating assembly
- all 4 rods/bearings and nuts each at 29.0 ounce exactly
- lightened flywheel
- 2.0 crank turned (o.25mm) .010 main, (0.25mm) .010 rod, std.
thrust and micro polished
- 5 dowel pins flywheel to crank
- oil galleys drilled/tapped and plugged
- 96mm Keith black hypereutectic flat top pistons
- Jake raby RAT 9550 cam/lifters set
- D-jet fuel injection
- pertronix electronic ignition
- 1.7 stainless steel exhaust/monza muffler
- estimated 110-120 H.P.

plastic guaging clearances
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sub assembly awaitin'
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just wanted to confirm these as the correct rod nuts
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gettin tin ready
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Those are the right ones. I hope they are new its a good idea to use new nuts instead
of reusing the old ones.

Hey Mike and Kenny! I'm glad to here your going with a 2056. that's what mind is and can't wait to see what the differance is. I'm be dragging feet on painting engine bay almost there but been busy with other things. I hope to have done by at least by car show.keep us imformed on progress. John

use new fasteners whenever you can inside a motor, IMHO.

Use them in general on ragged ass cars like mine For stuff that is a PITA, like removing fuel tank, or motor, big things, I like fresh stuff where possible.