Time to time, the Porsche Certificate of Authenticity (CoA) is referenced and not infrequently the data is deemed inaccurate or inconsistent.

I applied and received mine almost 12 years ago and the specification contained therein, though sparse, is accurate. I don't know if the fact that my car was an early example (when record keeping was of more importance), because I applied a (relatively) long time ago, that I had a pretty basic car (compared to later editions), or was just plain lucky that my CoA was not botched.

Here's what it looks like, issued October 1995........

I have not ordered mine (yet).

What it doesn't look like is a document that costs more than 100 bucks!!!

Meanwhile, I had F&R sways put on my car so the best I could hope for
is my COA had sway bars and the previous owner removed them! (lol)

Paul

I got me first one on 1991. It was an outrageous $20. Lost it & got another one in 2004 ($90) - they are about $100 now. And, as is always the case, found my earlier one about 6 weeks after getting the current one.

My 914 is a '72 & I'm the original owner.

Both COA's list my car as having "Norwegian equipment". Now, if I was supposed to get a tall, young blonde with my car, I was screwed! If not, anyone (DavePlnow what Norwegian equipment is? I bought the car in Cincinnati, which, last I heard, doesn't have a large population of Danes, Swedes, etc.

Pat

I ordered both, the COA as well as the german pendant back in 2001. These days, the german "document" was free ... and I also got the COA for free, although I've no idea why? PCNA told me to send a cheque of US$ 30 and so I did - but they never charged it

Anyhow, interesting details are that both docs list the same optional equipments, but the german paper says the transmission number and tan leatherette, and the COA says no tranny number recorded and the interior should be black with partial leather

Gustl

I have seen a few dozen of these newly-issued COAs over the last few years from LE owners...and I dont recall ever seeing one that was correct the first time it was issued.

So I spoke with PCNA about the process and they told me that the factory production records are like an excel worksheet listing code numbers for each vehicle/equipment and they have to translate them iinto the text they list on the COAs. Their method of translating the factory data and the lack of consistency is flawed and it seems like they just guess sometimes. At the least, they are not careful enough to us pinheaded types requiring accuracy. It is somehow 'better' for them to issue 2-3 COAs and revisions, than for them to get it right the first time. I think their inefficiencies have everything to do with why they are so expensive.

PCNA is however very willing to do whatever it takes to make the COAs right and they seem like they are at least attempting to do their best, but the process could definitely be improved.

I have to say Jeff my LE COA hit it dead on, the very first pitch. Never got another & seems pretty accurate to me, except for the DOB. Ths six is another story.

Jeff,

Thanks for the real COA story. I also believe the earlier COA's were more accurate. I suggest everyone go back to Porsche for more detailed info if your not satisified. For what they charge you deserve accurate information.

Tom
BTW: I know this is a little off subject, but here is my take on the current status of Porsche.
About 5-6 years ago Porsche had a top executives visiting a PCA Parade event. All he could talk about was how much money Porsche made to a group of people buying these overpriced cars. All he could do was smurk about record profits & poke fun at the people buying Porsche cars. I heard he was taken to the wood shed for this speech and quietly hushed up. At that time I realized the Porsche factory is no longer about history & tradition, it's about making money$$. I believe many groups like the 914 don't fit their sales expections for potential sales, because we are the bottom feeding owners. They play to the deep pocket groups for future sales. They are smart marketing people & use historical history to sell Porsche cars. Things are now changing at top mgt. & they are mainly concerned about taking over VW to blend into the Porsche origanization for world sales. I don't feel bad about this, I am just glad I understand the Porsche factory. When I decide to buy a new car I'll treat Porsche like they treat us. I will buy the best car value for my money. Porsche is just like all the other car companies today. Times are different today. I don't have loyalty with them anymore. I forgot to mention I still like my 33-year old 914.
Tom (my opinion & 2-cents worth).

Here's mine from 1992 & it's accurate.

Tom

The COA thing used to be reasonable. Now it is just a cash cow for Porsche. Sure they don't sell a bunch for old cars, but at the price they are charging, c'mon it doesn't take a hundred bucks to provide the scant info they do.

But its the only official proof for an 914 LE car.

Tom, I hear what your saying & agree. Porsche's profits are amazing, and it's not just from the sale of cars. Porsche realized before they built Weissach, that they were a small cog in the wheel of auto production, yet they had an extreme wealth of engineering. Through the years they've used that W facility as a testing ground for many of the things we take for grated on our daily drivers, and extracted serious wealth from consulting & designing for just about every manufacturer. They were truely the quiet conqueror amongst small manufacturers. Made & hoarded lots of cash during the 80's & 90's. Easilly staved off takeover attempts.
Back in '82, I was fortunate enough & had a wily broker to get 3 lousy shares of Porsche on the Euro market. It's not worth a huge fortune, but try to buy shares today!

The Good Doctor, I'm ceratin, never expected Porsche to become what it has. I'm also cerain he never thought, or dreamed, that they would become the overwhelming shareholder of VW. I just hope they inject what's needed to make VW a marque that people want to buy again, because I wouldn't touch one with a 10 foot pole ( & I've had seven).

What I see as a major problem with Porsche is getting the executive staff to stop listening to the bean counters (I am one) & let the engineers decided the course of the company. If they don't do this thing correctly...they WILL be taken over, probably by a very deep pockets private conglomerate (example, the goofy named company that bought Chrysler) who will destroy the company. Well, maybe not destroy it because it's very closely held. But, sooner or later, there will be realative who wants to break the mold & make some huge money.

We live in a time where gathering money is paramount to principle.

My opinion & I'm not particularly happy with it. MOINPHWI (think I just coined something new!
Pat
PS - I guess the cherries are pretty much gone now. I REALLY miss those July fat bastards!

If even one paper shows the transmission number (and providing it is correct), then it proves that the transmission number WAS recorded. Perhaps PCNA has a spreadsheet that is somewhat lacking in details, or they do not know how to read it. Whatever the case, the result is surely not worth the price they charge.

I corresponded with Brad Ripley, but he did not remember much about the 914 database. I think he spent his time rummaging through the 356 database looking for the nuggets in the gravel.

I think I need an 'old curmudgeon' smilie.

Does anyone have any "history" with 914's that were "converted" on the dealer's lot. Like, non-appearance group cars converted to appearance group?
And, would that conversion have been retro-recorded to the COA?

And, I'm still waiting, what does "Norwegian equipment" mean?
Pat

Lest anyone think I was joking about the Norwegian Equipment.....

Yet, the COA for my '73 911 is right on!

Guess the 914 really was the Porsche stepchild - they didn't even bother with accurate data for it!

There was discussion of Norwegian equipment a couple years ago on the 914club site, try searching there. I recall it was nothing more than a Norwegian owners manual. Memory could be fading though...

Just got my COA, body color and interior are correct. Listed options are:

Safety Steering Wheel - Leather
White Fog Lights Was there a choice??
Tinted Windshield and Side Glass Aren't they all this way?
Center Seat Cushion


I picked up the car last month and promptly put it in the back yard under cover. LEATHER STEERING WHEEL? I hadn't even noticed. Just went outside, lifted the cover and, yes! a leather wheel in good condition. Center seat cushion is there too. So far so good.

We do have a handle on Spanish equipment, but no others I know of. I have tried to contact the person that was able to obtain the info, but have not heard yet.

I suspect it has to do with a particular combination of options. Safety glass, sealed beam headlights, speedo in metric or miles, heated rear window. Such things as a national regulatory body would dictate. Same as smog equipment, seat belts, bumper horns and so on.

So why does it show up on USA spec cars? Perhaps that has more to do with the person interpreting the Cardex codes. It may also have to do with the recording of the optional equipment at the factory. It would all be in the codes used in the Cardex. I'd much rather have them give me the codes for my car, the key to the codes, and let me interpret it myself.

As far as tinted glass. That was certainly an option. Not very common in Canada, I had to get my door glass at Auto Atlanta years ago. OTOH heated rear windows were seen on almost all 914 in Canada. But lest you think that Canadian cars were copies of US cars, think again. We most certainly had our own owners manuals, and not all the specs are the same, even accounting for the missing fifth of a gallon you poor blokes suffer from.

No, nothing of ths sort.

It's blatant error, and I've pissed about it for years!

One error I can accept. Two is outrageous

My 914 is a plain & simple '72 with app grp. Nothing fancy, nothing unusual. So, I want trecord straight. So, I'm going after them. I'll be on them like stink on sh_t until the get it right. I won't accept a refund. I want it right!

I'll keep you up to date. The firestorm starts Sunday! Yeah, I'm a little perturbed.
Pat

Pat, your COA states optional equipment as Norwegian equipment and the center seat cushion. Okay, so I'm not sure of the base level for the car, but I suspect that the Appearance group is at least one option included in the Norwegian equipment. What about wheels; what was base then, 4.5" and you have 5.5"? Rear window defrost?

Detail exactly what the car has that we would, as judges, call options.
Let us try to reverse engineer this. What 'model' does the maintenance book say your car is, 473xxx?

Find the transmission number also. If you try to beat up on PCNA regarding the accuracy of the COA, be well informed first. Ask if the transmission number that you have corresponds with any entry in their Cardex. They don't list the engine code, that we have to determine from the serial number they provide, the year, and how it fits for that date for the years that had multiple engine types. Ask for the actual data recorded for your car, then let us try to decode it also. We have no real idea in what form the data is recorded, but I suspect there are a few serial numbers and a bunch of option codes. I'd guess that with a little more input we could do a better job of decoding the Cardex than they can.

My maintenance book lists only the VIN, but here the specifics for the car:

VIN: 4722918725
Chassis: 2349554
Engine: EA048898
Trans: 914/11HA0048848
Final Assembly: 06/72
Purchase Date: 8/21/72
Purchase Price: $4295.50
Colors: Bahia Red/Black
Options: Appearance Group, which included tinted windshield, deluxe carpeting, felt roof headliner, center cushion, chrome F&R bumpers, vinyl sail panel & trim, leather wrapped steering wheel, foglights, 5.5" steel wheels & 165 series tires.

How should I best proceed?
Pat

I don't suppose you have the window sticker?
No rear window defrost, and you live in PA?

Nope! Unfortunately, at that time (&maybe now), I lived in Kentucky. The window sicker was "confiscated" so that sales/use tax could be damanded. Think I do have the original dealers bill of sale, if that will help.

Wouldn't need the rear defrost in PA because I live close to the Delaware river - so our winter temps are moderate.
Pat

I'm out of touch with the "contemporary" Porsche happenings.

Can someone supply the name of the current CEO of PCNA, and the address?

I'm about to fire off my complaint about my COA, but am fairly certain Fred Scwab is no longer around.
Pat

OK, I know his name is Peter Schwartzebauer. Need his address. Not going to a flunky about this!

Pat, you should really acquaint yourself with a Google, or similar search engine

Your PCNA contact would be Peter Schwartzenbauer (It always helps to spell a dude's name right, eh Matt Garney?)

Address>>>980 Hammond Drive
Suite 1000
Atlanta , Georgia 30328

Good luck with this CoA odyssey, we'll be hoping you don't end up .


Paul

Peter Schwarzenbauer President and CEO

This is the spelling I have

Thank you very much for the spelling correction, as well as the address.

I "should acquaint" my self "with Google"? This, coming from the only 60 year old I know who just got his first PC? I've been using the web since (1983) before you even knew what a PC was. I took the easy way out because I knew a PC newbie would step in.

ps: for those unaquainted, Paul & I have been best bud's since the 70's & we slam each other all the time, so there's nothing personal here - even if he is a dinosaur!
Pat

Anyway, the letters go out tomorrow. They're kindly, yet demonstrative - I DID spend $100 for something nebulus!

As I said, I think I may have the correct spelling. I did find it a lot in my search using that name.

As I stated earlier, what we really need it to get the raw data from the cardex for at least one car. If they have the transmission # for one car, then they should have it for all. Maybe the data is there, and they just don't know how to interpret it. Get the actual codes that are in the cardex. I think C27 was Spanish equipment. See if they can tell us what codes exist, and what they are interpreted as. This would be very valuable information. I would like to see both the option code and the interpretation printed in the COA. Some, but very few, do so. If PCNA does not have answers, see it they can get the info from the factory. This lady was the contact for the COA. Get her (if she is still there) on our side.

Barbara Kurz
Certificate of Authenticity Department
Porsche Cars North America

Also:
Porsche Cars North America, Inc.
Certificate of Authenticity
980 Hammond Drive, Suite 1000
Atlanta, GA
30328 USA
Email coa@porschecars.com (preferred)
Tel 1-800-PORSCHE (option 5)
Fax 1-800-322-2436

Pat,
I'm sure if you mail anything stateside, you'll send it registered/certified, so the receipient has to sign for it. Also, it has been recommended to me that when I correspond to Germany, use lots of colorful, unique stamps in multiple denominations, as someones grandson, nephew, brother, etc. will probably want those stamps, and because of that, the contents in the envelope have a better chance of being reviewed and addressed. Lastly, if you mail something to Germany, it helps if the correspondence was in German. . It shows respect for their language and culture as well as being indicative of the extra effort that the sender went to.
I did all of the above many yeras ago when I wrote to the factory, and the response brought me a whole pile of brochures, literature, color charts, stickers and posters. I don't how the local (Atlanta) headquarters will respond, but at least you shouldn't need to send your correspondence in German.
Good luck in your quest.

Paul

there is non tinted glasas also, but from my limited exposure to the 914's it seems to me the plain is unusual? $90 does seems inline, when the marti report for my mustang was $200. the marti report is a much more detailed document however. i have to remind myself what most shops hourly rates are all the time. it helps bring me to reality of todays cost... unfortunately...
mike

Jeff,

Since I recieved my most recent (2003) COA from Ms. Kurz, that is who I directed my letter to, with a cc to Peter Scwartzenbauer (that spelling is correct for him).

I sent them every tidbit I have on my 914, and assured them I am the original owner. Also explained my problem with not having the windoe sticker. Asked her/them if it's possible to get the original cardex(Kardex) codes for 914's, as the group has a hunger to know. Went out today.

Let all know what I get in response. Not holding my breath, but if I get zero out of this, I'll go over thier heads. Fed up with this crap!
Pat

Dave,

I held my letter up because I have a conflict in mailing addresses. The letter I got from Ms Kurz in 2003 indicated here return address asountain Industrial Blvd, Tucker, GA.

Have her email addy, but emails get lost & unsaved, so I want somehting certified delivery. I'll email her anyway & let her know a letter is forethcoming. Your questions are also addressed.
Pat

I ordered my COA in Germany since that's where I am now. Had to go back twice and tell them to correct mistakes:

- at first they listed engine data for a 1.8

- on the second try they corrected that to show 2.0 liter data, but for the *wrong* 2.0 (looked like GA data instead of the correct GC)

- the total number of cars for that year ("Stückzahl") was mistyped and showed 14100 - but even the number it shows now, 4100, is a contentious issue.

We had a whole thread in here about the inaccuracies:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=64209

At least they were responsive and sent out replacements very quickly after the initial long wait for the first version. If you're persistent you can get what you believe is correct. However, people who don't have the knowledge to realize the COA is flawed are left with bad data for quite a lot of money.

Click to view attachment

so it seems that you've got a rare M471 car

Gustl

Except, the wheel issue is still a mystery

Yes Virginia, mine are orange.

I'd like to see a closeup photo of the lens. Then we can compare the fluting.

Here's a shot I already have. I'll take a close-up this weekend and post it.

While you are at it, please remove the grille and show the body of the lamp. Lets be sure it is a factory lamp with a factory lens.

No problem. I'll be removing the bumpers and other goodies to start the body work. I'll take whole assembly off and get close-ups.

It's been one month now, with no response from either party. I'll give it another 30 days & then I'm going to the factory. They sold us these cars - they had better support us.

Pat

[quote name='Pat Garvey' date='Nov 4 2007, 06:10 PM' post='963663']
Went out today.

Let all know what I get in response. Not holding my breath, but if I get zero out of this, I'll go over thier heads. Fed up with this crap!
Pat
[/quote]
It's been one month now, with no response from either party. I'll give it another 30 days & then I'm going to the factory. They sold us these cars - they had better support us.

Pat
[/quote]

Pat,
Have you heard from anybody in either PCNA or the factory about your CoA yet?

[quote name='1970 Neun vierzehn' date='Feb 16 2008, 05:17 PM' post='998628']
[quote name='Pat Garvey' date='Nov 4 2007, 06:10 PM' post='963663']
Went out today.

Let all know what I get in response. Not holding my breath, but if I get zero out of this, I'll go over thier heads. Fed up with this crap!
Pat
[/quote]
It's been one month now, with no response from either party. I'll give it another 30 days & then I'm going to the factory. They sold us these cars - they had better support us.

Pat
[/quote]

Pat,
Have you heard from anybody in either PCNA or the factory about your CoA yet?
[/quote]

Nope!

Sent emails & snailmails to Ms. Kurz, with no response from either. On the back burner these days though.
Pat

Hey Pat - that dealer color change possibility is exactly the "mystery" I'm trying to track down on my 73-2L. I don't have the COA in hand yet, but I've been talking back & forth with the gal there & she says it's an L80E Light Ivory, which I could always see was under to the floor mats & in the nooks! However, it was a Gold or Bronze Metallic when I bought on 12/26/75 - about 38 months after first delivery on 11/9/72 - but it didn't look like a fresh paint nor an incomplete/incompetent color change. And perhaps either the original buyer wanted another color the the factory white, or the dealer may have thought they could sell if better in Gold???

Any-hooo - in doing my resto, is it best for value and correctness to:
1 - Go Back to the White as it left the factory?
2 - Go Back to the Gold as it was sold(if I can somehow verify that)?
3 - Or Go Back to Either White or Gold??

...if it's 1, then I won't stress over trying to verify how/when the color go to Gold!
...and if it's 3 then I also have to mull over which I prefer to repaint & verify it!!


As to your difficulties on the COA - I'd suggest that you call PCNA at the 1-800-PORSCHE & Option #5, then ask for Kristen Bissonette-???? (can't recall her married name) & say I referred you, as we've developed a rapport.

She's been very helpful to me, and has at least read the "raw" code numbers from their spreadsheet to me, which I then cross checked on the rennlist webpage noted herein with her. So she may read you what shows up on hers, if you're real nice & don't unload on her, but do explain your frustration & problems. ...ditto for others out there.

And for EVERYBODY - Kristen told me that you only pay ONCE for the COA, and then any updates or lost/damaged replacements are FREE! It may be different if you go via PCA, since I downloaded the form off of the Porsche website - not PCA;s & faxed to PCNA in the Atlanta Area.

This came up because she wanted me to email her photos of my engine number before she would include it on my COA - i.e.: by verifying it as a match to hers as (GA)...000424, which she did tell me over the phone to look for. Apparently they can only see the last 6 digits & therefore can't tell which engine without your pix!
Probably the same for the transaxle numbers too, and why they put not available or whatever. So they should be matching your engine/trans number in a pic with the last 6 digits in their file to establish the match.

As to errors in their records - well she couldn't tell me the actual "stock upgrades/options" for my fairly early "914S"/914-2.0 VIN 4732901954, and said it only showed the US Equipment & tinted windows as the only 2 options. That 2.0 baseline is what I was trying to verify with the COA, because someone at sometime removed the fog lights & switch, Center Console & 3 Gauges, & the Fuchs 2.0 Alloys (had/has Rivieras instead). I have been able to verify that the first 2 were there by finding the old mount points & wiring, and most of what I've read says that ALL 73 2.0s came with the full Appearance & Performance Groups' options, with `74 starting to charge extra for some. So it sounds like it's correct once corrected as the 2.0.

However, in discussing the battery/fuel line recall campaign with the customer service person to whom Kristen referred me, I found out that their records show that it was supposedly sold in 9/73 in Connecticut!!?? .....almost a year AFTER my California DMV Registration cards say it was first sold/registered on 11/9/72 and having been built 9/72! How could a 2.0 sit for a year & get resold new (again) back east??? So I sent Kristen a pic of my reg. card & asked her to fix their records, suggesting that perhaps somebody mis-keyed that sale, possibly supposed to be 4742901954 !?

Both Kristin in COAs & Jolene in Customer Care said that their records that far back are not perfect, and have a lot of errors, so they're happy to change the if you supply them with documentation.

Hey Pat, you might see if KY (the state not the jelly!) still has a microfilm of your window sticker. I just found out that Acl. DMV will do a search for $20/year requested & send you a copy. That's under an "Information Request" at their ca.dmv.gov website for those out here. Maybe KY can do the same for you, if they retained paper or microfilm records - which they might because we're talking about tax revenues?