Finally got the old exchangers off. What a gigantic PITA. I figured they'd fall right off after removing the exhaust stud bolts, but noooooooo. It took about 1 hour of coaxing per side (and a ton of cursing) before they let go.

Here's the old:
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And here's the new (to me), courtesy of my friend Bill (porsha916). He also set me up with all the required parts necessary to complete the job. With just a bit more cleaning up these will look almost new.
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The first question I have regarding the install (I'm sure there will be more to follow):

From what I have read from other posts, the new gaskets should be heated before installing. Is this true? Can I use a torch, and how can I tell when they are hot enough? Also, assuming that the SS exhaust will be just as big of a PITA to install as it was to remove the old ones, how do you get the exchangers installed before the gaskets cool down?


Thanks!

I never heated the crush gaskets and had no sealing issues.

I would just make sure the surfaces of the h/e's a very flat.

I'd be interested to hear what difference the SS heat exchangers make in terms of power/torque. I also got a set like you and will be installing them this winter.


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heating the copper gaskets anneals [softens] the metal. this allows the gasket to form to the minor contour variations. you just have to get it hot and let it cool on a flat surface. then install.

I also got this exhaust with the heat exchangers. Anyone know what brand this is and anything about it? (Sorry to hijack this thread abit)

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I annealed my copper rings per this article-

http://www.ratwell.com/technical/Exhaust.html

It's only a one beer job. It may not be necessary, but it can't hurt. And they are definitely softer after. You can feel it if you twist them gently.

Also, be sure and support the back end, but don't tighten the fasteners to the muffler until it's on and torqued at the exhaust ports. On mine, the exhaust was about 1/4" too low relative to the hanger at the back of the transmission. So I took the hanger off and dragged the holes. Maybe I'm the only one that has ever happened to, but to bend it up to align the holes would leave the studs at the head stressed.

Those HEs were a nice snag. They look like the last version with stainless flanges at the muffler. The earlier ones were all stainless except for those flanges....

That's a Bursch muffler and collector. They're pretty good, but sometimes the muffler makes rattly noises like an internal baffle is loose....

Good luck,
Jim

Yup, did the magnet test, and it didn't stick to any part of those babys!

And thanks for the link, explains it all perfectly!

A couple of other questions:

1) Should I attempt to replace the exhaust studs, or just leave them alone? I am a little afraid to try and remove them for fear of breaking one off. I already have one that is stripped that I'll have to replace- a job I'm not looking forward to.

2) How much, if any, of the j-tubes/ductwork should I attach to the exchangers before installing? I was able to pull my old ones out with everything attached (thankfully because it was all rusted together), but it wasn't easy.

3) How tight should the exhaust stud nuts be- I thought I read somewhere that it should be tighted to 25lbs?

Thanks!

1.) I would leave any that are intact alone. Just be sure they don't rock from side to side. There may be other advice on this, as I am just working from a sample of one- my '76 that I backdated with SSIs.

The one you have to replace- you have options. Some are easier, but others may be better. When you say stripped, do you mean the stud stripped out of the head, or the thread stripped off at the nut?

2.) I didn't attach any of that stuff to mine yet. I hope it can all be attached after!!!!! I assume you have the early style ductwork? I don't think ANY of your late style will fit....

3. Believe it or not, it's only 14 ft-lbs. That's VW's spec, and it is also the limit for 8mm threads in aluminum. Unless you have a 1.8. They had 8mm/9mm step studs (according to the parts book anyway). A 9mm thread in the aluminum would probably be OK to 16 ft-lbs. If you go to the high teens or higher, there's risk of pulling studs from the head after a few thermal cycles. I guess others have gone higher and it's worked, but the engineering says stick to 14.

Also, save your nuts! My '76 had helinuts- a tall steel nut with helicoil threads inside. If that's what you have, they're reusable, and better than one piece nuts. The helicoil provides some flex to help accomodate for thermal expansion and contraction. They're more expensive, and you can bet VW wouldn't have gone with them if there wasn't an advantage.

Jim

all stainless, nice. enjoy the heat. the up side to switching out the late versions is you only have to do it once. mine were in alot more pieces when i was finished.

k

The heater stuff all bolts up after you get the exchangers and muffler on the car.

--DD

Thanks Dave, glad to hear this as it will make it easier to get the exhangers in there.



Hey Jim, thanks for the reply. It's the stud itself that is stripped. When I was trying to tighten down one of the nuts on the exhaust studs it started to pull one of the studs out. I haven't pulled it out all the way yet, but either way I believe I'll have to replace it. Which leads me to the end of your post- I don't know if the original nuts are 'helinuts' but if they were lossening up on their own, then they can't be worth keeping. I ordered new ones from Pelican, along with the gaskets.

Glad you gave me the 14lb spec. Now I just need to go get a torque wrench as the one I have is for much larger torque applications.


Also, I do have all the necessary early style ductwork, it just needs some serious cleaning. Not sure how I'm going to do that- the insides of the ductwork have a lot of grease & grime. I got the outsides of the ductwork cleaned up but they need some paint now to rustproof 'em. I was thinking letting the stuff soak for a day in some degreaser, cleaning it up the best I can and then painting with hi-temp paint.
Is there another way I should go?

rob, if you go to costco, they sell a product named Oil Eater. go with a weak (as in not so much water) delution in a 5 gal bucket and let it soak. what's left of the grime will wash of easily and actually the old paint will lift off. not fumy/explosive like lac thinner, mek, brake cleaner, etc. a gal jug is cheap, $10ish or so and it goes a long way. just the way we like things. you might find it easier to install the 2 branch elbows on the hes first. they won't be in the way. the rest of the ducting has to be done after the he's are installed.

k

Excellent! Thanks Kevin!

Good idea to test fit the ducting before installing the HEs. On mine, the small elbow heading tot he cabin was so tight I had to remove the HE after install to get the leverage and alignment to get that sucker on there. Some sanding and a little bending were needed. For cleaning the ducting, I used my shop vac to suck out some scum in both the ducting parts and in my heater tubes at both ends of the car (dust and crap in there!!), then old rags soaked in simple green pulled through. You can fish line some string through, then pull the rag through and it scrubs the inside of the tube. Oh yeah, I soaked them first too, the grime was caked on there good. I totally reccomend that you tighten everything 90-100%, then drive, then re-tighten 100% approach for this project. Between road and engine vibration, the parts tend to wiggle into their final resting places. Good luck

If you're feeling frisky, mount the 2 HEs loosely to the muffler on the bench, then with some extra stands, postion the whole thing under there and bolt it all on at once! Even without the muffler, I think I used an extra stand to prop up the HE during install to make sure there wasn't 20 lbs resting on one rusty exhaust stud during the instal.

Another tip: if the exhaust stud comes out of the head it can be replaced with a new one! I was super nervous about my rusty studs, and replaced almost all of them during the HE instal. Some wouldn't budge out of the head, so I left them in. Not perfect, but better in my book.

i did his same conversion except with non-ss HE's and I felt a difference in performance. I do have a small exhaust leak on the driver side. can't seem to get rid of it. am wondering if maybe the head surface is compromised because i can't get it to seal correctly even with new copper gaskets. I did have to helicoil one stud because one of the old studs came out with the threads...
those ss HE's are nice!!

Just curious, is your leak on the side where the helicoil is?
In my searches here I've seen both negative and positive posts regarding going the helicoil route.

I hate exhaust leaks!

Yes it is, but I don't think it has anything to do with the helicoil. My exhaust was already leaking on that side with the stock exhaust and it's what drove me to change it out and throw on the older 2.0 setup. Out of all eight exhaust studs on there right now, I have no doubts about the new stud with the helicoil. After seeing their condition, I was tempted to helicoil all of them!