Looks like the discussion is on again.

Short of ceramics, what is the least likely to fail lifter on a webcam, where do you get them, and how do you know for sure you got the right ones?

I think I read somewhere that Jake is selling sets now that he inspecs and gives his stamp of approval...but since he isn't going to open his T4 store anymore I don't know if he is selling them or not.

Tony

what? they type iv online store isn't gonna happen?

Last I heard Jake had his first dissatisfied customer in a long while and it was because of a small goof on his part. He might not want to frustration of this type of thing in the future w/ the type 4 store. It's playing out on the shoptalkforums board. I think the guys at L&N are thinking of running it for him though. Stay tunned for what's really going to happen, who knows...I sure don't

If you wanna see the latest and greatest, here is the thread on STF:

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=62237

Tony

I want to know what Brad thinks about the lifter situation. I didn't even know there WAS a situation until a couple days ago when I saw that post on PP. Then I did a search and found out all the dirt. I still don't know how big of a problem it really is. Jake obviously believes it is a huge deal.

I called Webcam regarding their mechanical lifters and webcam 494. They said there was absolutely no problem and nothing to worry about. The company line, I know, but the car has about 4500-5000 miles on it since they were installed and no problems.

Man I hate this.

That was my feeling, go with webs stuff and hope for the best..................

I wish I felt better about it.

It is always something.

Back in the mid/late '90's something changed and cams started going flat. Every manufacturer pointed the finger at the other manufacturers. Also one lifter manufacturer went out of business and it made an el-stinko batch of lifters just before they sank.

Web is now using a two-piece lifter (Scat?) but some guys and Jake are saying they're questionable. Of course if you call Web and ask them about their lifters they will say they work. You have to buy both the cam and lifters from them for them to warranty the set.

I don't know what kind John at aircooled.net is selling, but he stands behind his stuff as well.

Most recently Fat Performance I heard also had an engine where the lifters failed. Sad but inevitable truth. Although expensive, ceramics are the sure fire way to go.

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision Performance

Throw out those old technology cams and lifters...even the ceramic lifters are old school compared to this motor as seen in the picture.

Computer controlled valves....electronic valvetrain, one can change the lift and duration at will, it'll blow VTEC out of the water once perfected

Electronic Valve Internal Combustion Engines

Mike, put down the hairdryer, and step away from the little girl.


M

so if the darn things are still good at 4-5 thousand miles does one presume the lifters and cam are going to survive?

kevin

You sure hope so.

Most cams that are going flat do that in the first couple hundred miles, the question is, "has the mechanical sound of your motor change dramatically over a short period?"


M

Let's think of Joe Shmoe. He has no access to the internet and built his type IV in his backyard, without any knowledge of lifter problems whatsoever. Do you think his cams go flat? Maybe he wonders why but shrugs and builds another engine? Or are these just isolated cases of lifter failure and not a widespread phenomenon? Joe Shmoe does not know about ceramic lifters so he uses whatever looks good in the magazines. Is his engine destined for failure? Or in truth is it actually a small percentage of lifters that are going bad?

Screw it. I'm gonna get a Honda S2000.

Really? I hear those have some problems with FLAT CAMS.




M

You mean...frat?

This problem is also not VW/Type4 exclusive. Comp has had problems will improperly hardened cams and lifters failing. They have been good about warranty on them, from what I hear.

Some engine builders run very light valve springs and low ratio rocker arms although these are really only easy to obtain for Chevy engines.

What is funny to me is that if you buy a cam kit for an American car, it comes with very explicit instructions, a cam card, and plenty of cam lube as well as an oil additive. This was clearly not the case with my WebCam.

Too late to switch to ceramics. Kind of a bitch to do after the motor is assembled! Sense my frustration? If it blows it blows. Nice knowing you guys.

I have no problem with blown motors. If it's going to blow, I wish it would take me where it's going though..

Blown motors make you feel alive..

M

The lifters on http://www.type4parts.com are NOS made before 1985 when they shut down the shop.They have been sitting waiting to be used in your motor.Steve

Guess what- They have just the same possibility of going flat as anything else. especially with added spring tension.

They weigh 130 grams, at a minimum. The Johnsons weighed 96 grams.

These days the only lifters I have found that have not went flat , suffered from pushrod cups that fell out. They fall out before the engine ever runs.

Any lifter can go flat in any engine. No guarantees.