I want to do my cabin. Floors, interior firewall. Not planning on doing doors.

I'll use either Fatmat or Dynamat, but I don't know how much to buy.

Which of the two do people like best these days.

Zach

If you want your car to be dead silent, dynamat is what you would want. This is coming from my experience from using dynamat in a 71 vw bug. I have never used fatmat but i have used edead, which is a heck of a lot cheaper than dynamat and does the exact same thing. Dynamat is really thick stuff, so you will add a lot of weight to the car but will do more than edead since it is thicker. I plan on edead since i have some left over, or just leave the stock stuff in the car. But if you want the car totally silent, i would suggest dynamat.

On ebay you can buy a box of dynamat that has like 36 sq ft in the box. That covered the entire inside of my doors, the rear luggage shelf and then some further forward in my vw, also the inside the rear quarter panels, and i still have one sheet left over plus some scraps.
here are some pictures, i hope this helps.
Here you can see the dynamat covering the inside of both doors



Here is what i ended up with coverage wise with one sheet still left over. You can see the dynamat on the inside of the rear quarter panel.

I would use fatmat, it is better priced than Dynamat and it works just as well if not better. I have used Dynamat and it works great but is expensive. They sell only in either small batches or large batches.I do not know what edead is???
CCLINSHHHHH

i've heard there is a commonly sold material sold in harware stores that used under roofing in snowy areas. it is supposed to be way cheaper?? and very simular to dynamat

How much do I need to do the cab of my car, though?

I don't want to buy more then I have to. If 36 sq feet covered a bug interior, that should also do a 914 right?

Zach

I bought the FatMat bulk pack, I think it was 50 sq ft. There was enough to do my floor and interior/exterior fire wall. If you just wanted to do the interior, I believe 36 sq ft would be enough.

You could also check out Raamat. Its cheaper and just as good

http://www.raamaudio.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi

Wow. Here is a killer site for sound deadening comparison!

http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/products/

Fatmat is one of the worst products tested. It had nearly earliest failure on every test.

Looks like RAAMmat is the best option if you don't want to spent a ton of cash.

Zach

I noticed that RAAMmat is butyl rubber. Now this may be obvious and I am just

catching up But is not the whole point of removing the old sound material because

it became brittle, cracked and allowed water to get between it and the metal.

Causing Rust.

What is going to keep the same thing from happening under this butyl based

sound proofing?

I have never personally tried it but I hear that there is a cheaper solution....way cheaper. You can buy a roll of roof repair sheeting. It's about 12" wide, is designed to go under composition shingles to patch holes in the plywood, is adhesive backed and dense with similar composition to the deadening materials. I have one friend who tried it and said it was a big improvement at a fraction of the price. YMMV

Here is the type material I am talking about

I used B-Quite it is less then half the price of Dynamat and has better performance. Check it out.

Bill

A lot of people talk about using peel n seal, the roofing material you can buy at lowes, home depot, etc. I have never heard of anyone claiming how well it works, but its worth a shot if you trying for a budget. But then you could just buy edead which is as cheap as peel n seal, and designed to be put in automobiles.

I used 3 Dynamat Xtreme Wedge Paks (12 sqft) to cover the back firewall if that helps in estimating how much you need.

Butyl is supposed to be the way to go these days.

According to the site is posted that did testing, the asphault based products fail (ie - fall off your car) if it gets too hot or cold.

What surprised me is that FatMat, which gets a LOT of praise here, got really slammed in the reviews.

Testing was not done to see how the Butyl products stand the test of time. The implication is that they will last longer then asphault based products.

Peel and seal was mentioned in the testing. Appearently, FatMat is very similar to peel and seal.

Zach
Zach

I have been thinking about this also...tell me which you way you decide to go and how it works for you. I be very interested in the results..


Michael

I bought RAAMmat. It is sold in 62 sqft rolls. I should have enough for my 914 and maybe enough to do the cab of my m715. I will bump the thread once I see how things work out.

Zach

Me too. Does anyone have any photos of a 914 done up?

Since I'm working on getting my interior back into place (and other stuff) I'm rethinking the 'lighter is better' bit and may go with 'quiet is nice' instead.

its called ice shield. after i do my floor pans i plan on putting this stuff on inplace of that tar carp they have on

oh btw my neighbor works at the factory where they make this so i get it cheap. if it works im thinking about making pre cut pieces...

Is it asphault based? If it is roofing material, then it probably is.

If so, you might want to rethink it. All the better soundproofing is going away from asphault due to its failure rate. If your car sits in the summer sun, your solution may melt and come off the car.

Zach

I will try to be brief...but it gets harder as I get older.

Ice and Water shield (grace chemicals) is butyl based and its actually uncured rubber. This allows it to stretch around the nail heads and it sticks like glue and eventually is impossible to remove with a little bit of heat.

Sound deadening is done with two approaches.
One is to thicken the base metal and therefore elimintate vibration noise that is transfered via the panel. This is why trunk floors and floorboards are not just flat...they would vibrate to much. This is also why most door panels have some thickening done in the middle of the panel to negate the vibration.

The second thing to stop is sound waves. Sound waves travel at a certain frequency like waves. These waves have certain spacing between crests. Certain waves can be stopped by certain materials. Not all waves will be stopped by one material...
So, use rubber to not only thicken the base material, but this will also stop a certain number of waves...so it halts a certain sound spectrum.
Now, use aluminum glued to the top of the rubber.
This stops certain waves that the rubber wont stop.

Its not perfect, but by using both rubber and aluminum foil you will stop more sound waves.

I have used Ice and Water shield and it really does work fine, but I am not an audiofile guy looking for a setup for audio system that is smoking hot.

Use Ice and Water shield for simple sound deadening, it works great.
It has no aluminum layer, so it will not block the additional sound waves that aluminum does block.

There is alot more to look at, but you can cover both sides of the firewall with ice and water shield and it will be very very quiet.

Rich

Tis what your wife said last time she dropped by....

Thanks for the down-low on that Ice and Water seal.

Zach

On the asphalt melting issue...car companys have been using it for years and still are.
I'm going to look at the ice and water stuff when I do the bug floor.

You live in Canada. It does not get warm enough there to melt water, let alone asphalt.

Zach

Mark...

Two types of rubber (you may not be able to get Grace Chemical stuff)
Its easy to spot.

Cured rubber is what an inner tube is...its dry.
Uncured rubber is soft and can be rolled into a ball, made into any shape you want...then once cured...hold that shape.

The Ice and Water shield is just uncured rubber...with a significant glue on one side that makes it stick to air, you, your hair (that one sucks) or pretty much anything...its really sticky.

Touch one sticky face to the other stick face and you will learn what the work sticky really means....it fuses together instantly.

One way to get it to work is freeze it...(leave it outside)
Put it on a frozen surface (cold car, no heat in shop that day)
You will buy a little bit of time to move it around.
Then use a heat gun and it will fuse with the panel forever...

I have a porch roof I built that I used the stuff on.
I changed a portion of that roof and no matter what I used I could not get the stuff to seperate from the wood substrate...its amazing stuff.

Same treatment goes for Dynamat...but I suspect the glue is more forgiving with Dynamat given its intended application.

Rich

I went into Home Depot today just to see if they carried a similar product. Surprise, surprise, they carry Quick Roof. Packaged in a roll that is 6" x 25' or 12 1/2 sq ft per roll, out the door for $15.00 at $1.20 per sq ft. Cheap! And, it does have the aluminum top sheet so you are getting a multidimensional product. I'm going to install it in my '74 2.0 and the '95 Chev dually.
Allen

Zach,
Here is a picture of the firewall (engine side) that I did in Dynamat super, I had good results with it. Of course it does not look original any longer.
Dominic

well i tried looking for you, but the search function has always returned 8973 pages of results for me so...

there's a member with a beautiful orange 914 (flared) that has pictures with dynamat installed.

the title of the thread was something about (how low can you go).. don't remember exactly, but it was showing it rolling out of the shop in the sun!

im sure somewhere here knows and can post the pic or link!

I am finally getting the hang of the search function. The link was the second one on the page if you entered the phrase in parenthesis
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...how+low+can+you

you > me

thank you sir!

I'm going to do some type of sound deadener as well. I just don't want to get back into the rusty postion I was before with water trapped below the tar paper or whatever was in place before. So I see as my options as epoxy priming and using some catylzed paint to really seal the floor before I put anything over it or... I really think I'm going to do spray-in bedliner to the floor which I think will both deaden sound and create a nice fish pond for me.

I coated my whole cabin with POR-15 before I put the sound deadener pain (water based) on the floor and fire wall.

Zach, Did you get your Raamat? I ordered some after reading this thread Aug 22nd and still haven't gotten anything.

T.C.

I got it, but it took about 10 days to get to me.

I'm about 3/4 done installing it - assuming I don't break down and do the doors. It is really sticky stuff.

Zach

In the 60's I redid a 39 chev and made a floor covering from asphalt 30lb. roofing and tin foil in layers, glueing it with black mastic, it really made it sound a lot quieter. It was the best I could come up with at the time. In texas it wasn't any cooler then than now.
I wonder why you would add a roll cage and also put in sound proofing which must add a lot of weight?
How much did the raamat kit weigh?

I don't have a roll bar. ???

Anyway, the shipping weight was 36 pounds, maybe 40. I have no intentions of putting all of it on. Just the floor and firewall. It will be about 1/2 the roll, so between 18 and 20 pounds. Slightly more if I end up doing the doors (and I currently am not, but may in the future.)

Zach

The guy with pictures of the vw had the roll cage.
I just called a friend who does early corvettes and he uses 72 sq. ft. and says it cost 440.00 for dynamat. He said from Eastwood where he gets free shipping for a yearly fee.
It looks like the raammat and the ensolite with two cans of adhesive is about 170.00, Thats 1 roll of raammat 62.5 sq. ft., 3 yds ensolite 36.00 and two cans adhesive 16.00 not counting freight.
Thanks for the link

^^^^
unless you are sealing the doors, you don't need the ensolite or the adhesive spray. Raammat is seriously sticky stuff. Wear disposable gloves, and put on a fresh pair often.

I would suggest a roller, though. I am going to get one to go over my work. Its hard to get the mat to stick in all the nooks and crannies w/o one - even though Raammat says that you don't need one.

Zach

Ok I have kinda wasted a really cool day in sep. which is bad. I found a product called Damplifier Pro, made by second skin, kinda sounds raunchy, that many claim is the best. Two guys could split a order for 80 sq. ft. from www.3rdstrike.biz it's 270.00 not counting freight. They get 155.00 for 40 sqft. They also have a neat stuff called motor mat for firewalls. My friend reminded me that we have free shipping at Eastwood so the dynamat price is somewhat less but still costly.

While your on the 3rd. site check out the babe for the day, it'll be worth the trip. At the bottom it says the shipping wt. is 110 lbs.

HI Guys, I'm over in the UK and am just about to embark on a complete interior refit on my 914. I have bought a bulk pack of Dynamat extreme which is a foil backed sticky matt, then two rolls of Motormat, which goes on top. these two together combine to cut out a hell of a lot of road noise. I've ordered a carpet set from appearance and performance, so hopefully the interior will be smart when done. I'll do a thread over here for you if you like, so you can see what I'm up too.

Here's my new car -



And this is why I need to soundproof the interior

Im the one that put the dynamat in my vw. it has a roll cage bc it is a baja bug, so if i flip the thing off road i don't kill myself. the reason there is dynamat in the car is because i also use the car as a daily driver to college and work, so its nice to be able to listen to music and hold a conversation without yelling inside the car(same reason i am putting the sound deadener in my 914). the roll cage didn't add that much weight, the car doesn't need to be fast, thats why i bought a 914. Fun off road car, fantastic on road car. Best of both worlds!!

Rod, Your car is beautiful, but I'm partial as I have owned two Olympic Blue 914s

FYI: I talked to Rick at Raamaudio and they had lost my order. He was very nice on the phone, gave me a few tips on install which I will try and let everyone know about as I use the product.

T.C.

[quote name='turnaround89' date='Sep 3 2008, 05:29 PM' post='1074797']
the car doesn't need to be fast, thats why i bought a 914.



I take offense to that statement? As soon as I get all four cylinders running and my car off jack stands I am going to race you. move over.

Whoops, i should have added more to the sentence. The VW doesn't need to be fast(roll cage, dynamat, 60HP engine, big tires), thats why i bought i 914 because it is a quick/agile car. sorry!!

I am right where you are Heeltoe914, i drove my car for a week and it is now on jackstands. Im in the phase of replacing rusty floorpans and repainting, but it will soon be back on the road again. In the week that i was able to drive the car it beat the crap out of all my friends little ricer POS's, i haul around corners while they have to slow down. Its great, my 36 year old car sounds better and handles better and LOOKS way better than cars that are 3 years old(hon-duh). Gotta love German engineers.


X2, I love that color!!

I got my RaaMmat today, so will be starting to install tomorrow. I'll post some pictures.

T.C.

Another thing about RaaMmat or the owner. Great customer service. Rick the owner has sent me 2 emails concerning how to properly install the product.

Also there was a small mistake on my order; I got 2 cans of adhesive instead of 3. I emailed Rick the owner, got an email right back apologizing and gave me a bigger than deserved credit for his mistake.

T.C.

Here is a picture of what I ordered. I start as soon as I get my coffee fix.

T.C.

Click to view attachment

First, you only need a few tools; a utility knife, a small sqeezge, and I used a wallpaper roller. You need gloves, as this stuff will stick. I put a pair of latex gloves on then a set of leather gardening gloves over them. If you just use latex, the adhesive will rip them off your hands.

Second, take out your interior.

Third, make sure your surface is clean. I KaBOOM'd it. Then I started laying the RaaMMat. Pretty easy. You get used to how long of pieces to use. I laid down the mat, pressed it down with my hands, then used my sqeezge, then the wallpaper roller.

T.C.

Click to view attachment

Click to view attachment