Planning to put a SDS on a 2 liter engine. I intend to use a 2 liter manifold, fuel rail, etc. which I have. I want to put in new injectors as I install this. In browsing around, it looks as if the 2 liter injectors are becomming obsolete or unavailable soon. The 1.8 Ljet injectors seem to be the most commonly used ones on Porsches and other cars. For example, Advance auto has these for $46.00 new, made by Niehoff. Is anyone familiar with Niehoff injectors, and are they good quality?

It seems as if the time to upgrade for long term parts availability is now, as the new control system will be tuned in to the injector size. Is this a good choice? Will the 1.8 Ljet injectors fit the '73 fuel rails and manifold tubes? Are the connectors on these the same as the Ljet connectors being offered with the new aftermarket control systems. Your advice is greatly appreciated.

Or, does anyone have any better suggestion?

Thanks in advance, JoeO

L-jet injectors have a very low flow rate, they will fit, but I'd say no even on a stock 2.0.

Stock 2.0 injectors are almost too big, but they do work good.

You don't have a whole lot of choice if you want to stick to stock style, Ford red tops are high impedance and will need a fuel rail made.

Do you have the flow rate for the 1.8 injectors?

I found in the "d jet fundamentals" documentation that the 1.7 injectors are 265, and the 2.0 are 380 cc/min. this would be roughly 26 and 38 pounds/hr. I read somewhere that the 2.0 injectors were in fact oversized so they could use the basic components of the earlier 1.7 control system. From the megasquirt data, 110 or so HP should only need about 170cc/min. I understood them to say that it isn't good to use too large of an injector. I was hoping that the 1.8's were somewhere in between.

Thanks, JoeO

Send your 2.0 liter injectors out for cleaning, resealing and flow matching.
They will last another 100k.

Rich

1.8 are even less than the 1.7 injectors. I've had this disscussion with Ross at SDS so I know for sure L-jet injectors are a poor choice. If you google it you will find a couple of sites with flow rates

Rich is right, if you have a good set of 2.0 your fine, I think the 1.7 would also work OK on a stock 2.0. Just remember that they are low impedance so you need the resistor pack. You can remove this pack if you wanted to go to high impedance at a later date.

Is there a difference in impedence between L-jet and D-jet injectors?
Is there someplace to look at the data regarding all the injectors?
RIch

On our cars the impedence is the same, low.

Google is your friend Rich...type in "injector flow rates"

Here's one http://users.erols.com/srweiss/tableifc.htm

1.8 190cc/min

Thanks for the info. I have been doing some digging, and found the following:

I have found a major parts supplier that has Bosch injectors #280150007 for $56.95. I think this is for a new part, but need to make completely sure. Says this part is for the VW 411 and 412, years around 73. Checking out the specs on the witchhunter site, it says that this injector has a flow of 340cc @4bar, and 2.1 ohms resistance. Checking witch hunter for a 280150009 (the number given by the bird for a 1.7 injector), it gives a flow of 340 @4bar, and 2.5 ohms. Note, other references give the a flow of 265 at 29psi for the 009, but this is at a lower pressure than the flows on witchhunter, so I assume that the 340 flows are equal for the two injectors at equal pressures.

Is there any difference in the manifold mounts between the 914 2.0 and the 411's?

So, I am thinking this would be a good buy to get 4 for a new SDS injection system. Am I missing anything?

The cheapest I have seen the 1.7 injectors new is about $195, and it would hurt to buy 4. I wanted to have new ones as opposed to having mine rebuilt (actually all they do is cleaning) as mine are 35 years old.

Another option is to get a set of the accel 24# injectors for about 240$, for 6. This would require reaming out the manifolds and making a fuel rail. No big deal, but just another thing to do. The accel brand comes highly recommended in the hot rod circle, but I am not sure of their reliability. I also found some on the net that were new made by Carter for about $50.00. I haven't found the exact flow on these, and I also do not know the reliability of the Carter units.

Any comments and advice are greatly appreciated.
Thanks, JoeO

why don't you go with a different inj. all together?

with a little modification, I used ford prob. inj's ( 21lb's/hr) and ran the FP up at 43 psi.

I got the inj's at pick and pull for 10ea.

They are high imp., readilly avail. and cheap.

I have had them installed with NO prob's. for about 4k miles. They worked great with the MS system because of the high imp., no resistors.

got pics. if interested., just my .02

Joe, if you are staying w/a stock motor, the stock 2.0 injectors will be fine. Good enough for the factory, should be good enough for you. See post #4. Have them cleaned and checked out, re-install, put all new rubber fuel lines in the system from tank to injectors if you haven't already, and order your SDS. You're making this harder than it needs to be.

While having the Inj's cleaned is a good thing, the internal parts might be worn and cannot be replaced or fixed.

Most of these inj's are at the end of their service life. Even if they are cleaned they are still 35 to 40 years old.

Usually with an aftermarket EFI there is a learning curve and a trouble shooting period. You don't want to have to second guess anything.

My .02 ( again) if you have the $ to get new Inj's, do it, it's good piece of mind.

Yes, I would like to see a photo of the Ford Injectors if it isn't too much trouble. I considered having my old injectors cleaned and checked out, but decided that they are 35 years old, and I wanted to put new or newer ones in so that 1) maybe they would be more reliable, and 2) in the future if they crapped out I would be able to get good replacements without having to go through the selection process again. This is the same logic that I am using to decide not to purchase rebuilt components for the Djet system (my pressure sensor is leaking, and the throttle switch is about worn out). I figured that in the years to come, these parts will be hard to get.

The Accel injectors I found at Summit at 24# flow are ones that I think are for a Ford. I think that to use these, I just have to ream out the mounting holes on the manifold pipes a little to accomodate the larger diameter. A fuel rail for these would be pretty easy to make.

However, if the 007 injectors would work, it would be very easy to get new injectors to fit all the old hardware. This would be the easiest way, for very little added cost over having the injectors cleaned and checked.

Thanks for all the help. JoeO

You may want to give these guys a call.
they would know about loads of injectors, be able to advise you on a good path forward, and may or may not agree with you about discarding the old injectors.

http://www.witchhunter.com/

Many have used them for the 914 injectors and everyone seems very pleased with the results.

Rich

A low impedance SDS system comes with the resistor pack, a $40 value. Remove the resistor pack (cut and spice 4 wires) and you have a high impedance system.
If you order a high impedance system you don't get a resistor pack.

Check with Ross to make sure, but I'm pretty sure I'm right.

Thanks for the help.

I found some of the basic info that I was asking for afer a new search. I had searched earlier , but must have looked for the wrong words. In case anyone later following this thread is interested, Jeff Bowsley had posted some info on the different injectors a while ago at: http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...or++replacement. Thanks Jeff.

Looks like SDS sells a 300cc high impedance bosch for about $70. I believe this will fit into the stock manifolds with minor modifications, and maybe just a spacer to allow the original clamps to hold the injectors to the manifolds. I'll post photos when I finally decide what to do, and get it done.

cheers, JoeO