Ford Freestar VS Toyota Sienna:
Can a for really compare to a Toyota in quality, reliability and durrability? There are zero deals on the Toy while Ford is offering some nice deals plus can be ordered to our liking. What would you do? Any other vehicles worth looking at that can hold a fair number of people and stuff?

Mustang VS Porsche:
I really want a 911 (after the mini van purchase but I also have to consider the costs. There are a lot of fun cars out there for the money. While looking at the Ford vans last night, I took a peak at the mustangs. They offer a lot for the money. Hell, this dealer even had a 2003 left over Cobra Convertable for very low $20s. I can't touch a 964 for that!! For a daily driver, can an older Porsche be as realiable as a new 'Stang? I don't know if I'm a Mustang type anyway, but that's a lot of bang for the buck.

Sorry for wasting bandwidth but I trust your honesty over say a Mustang board.

Cheers!

I don't know about the Freestar vs Sienna, but I've owned a few Mustangs. An 83 GT, and a 91 LX 5.0L convertible. I like the older Fox body 'Stangs, but I find the new ones to be cheaply built.

I looked at a couple 2003 GTs last year. I found them to be cheaply built, heavy, and not very quick. It didn't seem much faster than a 2003 Golf Gti 1.8T that I had just driven. One of Mustangs had 100kms on the odometer, and it already had a squeak coming from the back somewhere. The other Mustang's headliner was falling down around the back window, and it had around 1000kms.

Also, the interiors looked cheap, the climate controls didn't look like they fit, the door panels stick out and intrude into the passenger compartment, and for the size of the car, the interior was just plain cramped.

I'm sure a Cobra would be a little nicer, better put together, and more powerful, but if it were me, I would go for the 911. I'd prefer an older SC to a new Mustang, but thats just me. For what the Mustang sells for new, you could get a lot nicer car.

Of course, these are all my own opinions. Go out and drive them, and decide which one you like more.

When it comes to family transportation I have owned a number of Fords, including "corporate cruisers" Taurus’s for my business transportation and Explorers for my wife and daughter. All of them have been reliable and cheap to own. The technology and quality in today’s new cars have gotten so good that the top four or five auto makers are all on an even playing field. The Toyota would probably hold its value better due to lack of incentives and lower volume in the market. The minivan market segment is a competitive one- there are lot's to choose from. I read that Ford has put a lot of effort in the new design of the Freestar so it could be a big hit.

Now for a sports car - that is a personal issue. The current Mustang's design is very old and even with all of its updates its fox based platform is 30 years old. You can buy a new one, with a factory warranty and forget about any major costs in maintaining it for a number of years. You can buy a used 911 with no warranty- maintain it hopefully without any major costs and you won't loose much in its value. The 911 will offer a better driving experience than the mustang too.

When comes to the family car I boil it down to something that is practical, safe and cheap to maintain.

On the personal side of what to drive, and if the experience of driving a good responsive car is important to you, "it's money and emotions that drive your choice" I am partial to German cars for something I have to drive every day...go test drive a three or five series BMW. If you want to bang gears, try a used, late model M3.

Dave

the ford can be as good a quality as the toyota... but as Kargeek said... the toyota will hold it's value better and be worth more in the long run... something to consider since it's probably going to get a lot of miles and be kept a long time... also check EDMUNDS.COM and see what they and other people who bought have said about both...

I have 2 friends with mustangs... a '99 convertible cobra, and a '02 GT... fine if you want a muscle car(read: not great handling) that you can't drive in the rain... the Mustang is a daily driver type car, not an enthusiasts wet dream... but fun in the straight line... can a used 911 be as reliable... probably not... if $20K is the range of 911s you are looking at... then you are looking at a quite bit older... from what I've seen anyway.

the late model M3/M Roadster(my pick) is a good suggestion... or a used boxter... or a used MB SLK (if you like them, but they aren't "all that" in performance) ...

but I would sooner have a WRX or a lancer Evo as a mustang.... hands down. ricer's are a blast to drive for little $ and can be very quick! There I said it! Flame on!

I don't know enough about the Sienna vs Freestar (Ex windstar?) to comment.

The mustang however is a nice ride, but it isn't the same sort of car an a 911. That is not bad it is just that they are apples to pears. I happen to think the MACH 1 is the performance car of choice for the money. Its basically a NA cobra 4 cam motor with a live axel and some nice retro touches. The Cobra has about 100 more horsepower now and IRS. SVT also tunes its suspension in a more European manner, so its going to be the most similar to the 911.

Low 20's sounds like a screaming deal for a cobra convertable (assuming it is new). They must have some killer rebate because sticker on that car has to be 36-40.

You haven't lived until you've driven a fox body Mustang around for a couple years as a daily driver. Dependable, fast, cheap, fun. You can't beat the torque of that 5 liter engine. 1993 is the best and last year of that style.

those WERE fun... a friend had one when I was in high school.... man, he got the babes!!

I had ford trucks forever... then I got an escort GT in college... ot that car was fun... best value alive... I traded my old chebbie truck for it and $500... put 50K miles on it the first year and only did the brakes and changed oil... can't beat it!! hardly a performance car, but fun and cheap...

For vans, consider Dodge Caravan or Chrysler Town & Country.

We just bought a Town & Country Limited to use as a conversion van (wheelchair lift) for Hunter.

Until March 1st, you can get up to $4K back or $2K back and 0% financing.

Plus they have an "unannounced" special of $1K back for owners/leasees of competing vehicles.

That makes for up to $5K back.

So far we are happy with the Chrysler minivan. (well, as happy as you CAN be driving a minivan).

Regards,

Karl

As far as an MV, check out the Chrystler Pacifica. Its not a real minivan, but I really like the looks and I heard it drives REALLY well for its size.

For performance car, I am kind of partial to Mustangs. They are easy to get power from, and sound great. Image is everything. If you want some 4 door subaru that is soft, then go for it, but if you want a GT stang that looks good, then go for that. There is something to be said for almost all porsches. My opinion for most since 1973 is that they are made for the Bill Lumbergs of the world (Office Space, kind of a corperate guy who wants a "sports" car). I would take a used Boxter over a 911 or mustang.

Mustangs can be very fast and can be made to handle very well. Saleen makes great stuff here in so cal, and so does steeda. You can search google for their stuff. Initial cost may be less for a mustang, but you are getting a new car with lots of performance potential. But a 911 is a 911...

I've had an earlier "fox chassis" 5.0, fun car, converted it from 4 lug to five lug, 4 wheel discs, 16x8's with 245/45's on on four corners.......I have not driven the newer generation cars, but I don't like the looks and for that kind of money, they are still a live axle rear end

My '01 ford truck has the newer generation engine with 122,000 miles and it's running strong.......

Performance wise, the new mustangs are okay, i embarrassed a Kenny Bell edition 'stang a few weeks ago in my Volvo (seriously, the guy was pissed) and just last week a brand new 'stang lost to the 964 across an intersection...no racing, just "testing" the rev limiter officer

You've got to drive 'em both, I'm sure a Mustang would make a better daily driver if you have a long commute.....mines 100+ miles a day and sometime driving the 964 gets tiring since it requires more attention while driving it

You will lose your A$$ on ANY minivan. Ask me how I know. I didn't have to buy a third one to learn my lesson.

Get an 04 Durango. I couldn't be any happier and it will seat 7 6 footers comfortably.

I just drove a '03 Cobra at the Stockton Ford dealership five days ago.
4.6 liter, 4-valve & Supercharged. Salesman said 390hp. It scooted pretty well.

sticker on windshield:
WAS $37,995
NOW $31,995

he told my friend, who was looking at it, they'd come down to $29,900

From what I can tell so far, the Ford is fairly comparable to the Toyota in everything except price. I would be able to buy a higher model Freestar with the money difference. I guess a test drive is in order. I will also look at the Durango. It's been on my short list since the new model hit. My worry is the typical Chrysler build quality. I've seen nothing but headaches with their cars. Nice looks, cool ideas, but they can't build cars worth a damn.

I really need to buy Amy a car first, but that Cobra is haunting me. A $40k car for under $25k is one hell of a deal. Plus, 390 HP!!!! Hmmmm, anyone fit a Ford motor into a 914?

I still want several other model Porsches though. I just don't know if a Mustang would tide me over. On the other hand, this car would only require basic maintenance while a 964 could need much more. And the money I save could be put into the 914/6. CFR would be able to be let loose to do any work deemed fit.

Oh, what to do; what to do?

The new Durango really is different. You can see some of the germanic influence to design. I haven't had any problems so far. No squeaks, leaks, etc...and it drives soooooo nice.

I want to chime in (again) since the "D" word and "C" word are being thrown about... Dosge trucks(durango included) etc are probably very good... always have been anyway... but a MV... I can tell you from personal Chrysler experience...my Chrysler is a POS... it was just in the shop AGAIN last week... god I'm glad I bought the extended warranty... if you go with either of them... get the extra warranty...

granted mine is a '99, before MB started making their presence felt... but damn... the little annoying shit gets OLD quick

I did the Bondurant Grand Prix Driving School in 1986 in their slightly prepped (different shocks and exhaust systems) Mustangs at Sears Point - my only exposure to Mustangs ever - it was the most fun experience I had with my cloth on !
However, everytime I went to test drive one at the dealers - I chickened out when the glove compartment ore something else was rattleing on the test drive.

djm,

For my $0.02 worth:

I notice your discussion so far has revolved around new MV's. I have owned a 98 Windstar Limited (with the 3.8 L V6) since 2000, that I bought used & saved 10K over new. We've put over 50K trouble-free miles on it, and bought it with only 38K.

At the time the Ford 3.8L had the most torque for its class. Also the crash tests were better on the Windstar than C & D & Chevy.

If you consider a used MV (two years old & under), add an extended warranty ($1500), and can save $10-12K - that start you on your way to buying a Porsche.

Happy hunting,

PS: If your hearts set on a Mustang - wait till they come out with the new "retro" body style. It looked totally cool at the auto shows.

Thank you all for your input. We'll test drive the Ford and Toyota vans very soon and add the Der' Rango to the must drive list too. My hearts really set on another Porsche, but getting so much power for so little money is interesting. I am, after all an honorary member of the CSOBONE. I've looked at several 'Stangs on the street and thought they were somewhat nice looking... then I saw my first Turbo Cab this morning. Porsche's have a different look about them. I like all types of cars, some even bordering on Rice. My Mom talks fondly of the Judge she owned, so I'm sure I'll buy a MC some day.

Thanks again,