I'm ashamed to say that in all the years I've been messing with 914s (geez, I've had four runners over the past decade) I had never actually had any of them professionally aligned until this last Tuesday. Last Sat Mark D, Dug and I replaced the rear bushings and bearings on one of my '74 2.0s. Since we had the trailing arms off I really had no choice but to get an alignment.

See this thread for details on the bushing and bearing replacement.

I had to drive down to Mountain View for business earlier this week and Custom Alignment came recommended highly by a Porsche shop in the area. They were very professional and asked me all the prudent questions like, "what's your weight?", "do you normally drive alone", "what's your driving style" etc. Hooray!

This is my mellow 914, so I told him that the most abuse it would get would be frequent spirited back road outings, no auto-x'ing or racing. Anyhow, the alignment completely transformed the driving characteristics of the car (duh!!!!), but I never expected such drastic changes. Below are the alignment numbers, before and after for reference.

How often do you have your 914s aligned? Every tire change? Ever? Do you do it yourself?

Oh yeah, the toe out on the rear wheels made for an interesting drive down 101 from Santa Rosa to Mountain View. Yikes!

That's great news.... I'm in the same position. The car I'm finishing up had the compelete suspension removed and I've contacted the local Porsche dealership to arrange the alignment. They've quoted me $220, which is (3) hrs of work. I'd be interested in your cost....

-- Rob

Chris and Ed (Tangerine Racing) did mine last summer. I couldn't believe the difference. Night and day. Got rid of the bump steer completely. Granted, my alignment was way, way off to begin with but if you don't know when it was last aligned, probably a good idea.

The last time I had an alignment done like the one Randy described on a 914 by the only shop around here that I would have do it, was about 4 years ago. It cost $125 or so at that time and it was worth every penny. I would not hesitate to pay $150-175 for a great alignment if that was today's cost. Maybe even $220 if it were done my the right shop and a custom alignment. I could be way out of touch with regard to current labor rates as I haven't had a car in a shop for quite some time.

$220 at a P-car dealer? Not sure I'd let a dealer do an alignment on a 914 at this point in time. And it would likely be factoy alignment at that. My $.02

I just had one done Wednesday. The guy was shooting for -2.5 degrees on the front and could get a little less than -2.0. The rear were at -1.5. Front caster was 6. 1/8 to in in front 0 at back. He suspects it will push a bit. Corner weights were spot on. The total time was 5 hrs. Corner balance and alignment was $401

Balanced Performance did an alignment and corner balance on my car last year. Best $150 upgrade ever.

Gint, I thought the same thing, except Steve Gaglione highly recommended the dealership and the specific mechanic....

-- Rob

Randy,

Twitchy isn't it... it takes some getting used to but soon you will love it. When you go into corners it just dives!

By the way, when you get into a true corner balance with crossweighting and such it can be a lot more expensive. If you only have the three positions to adjust on the rear you don't really have enough adjustment to bother with the corner balancing. But once you have adjustable spring perches, you can get perfect crossweights on these cars. But... Don't be shocked by $500+ invoices.

Dave, Tim would do it for much less and he sets up 914 allignments somewhat regularly.

0 in the back? If anything I would imagine you would want close to 0 in the front and 1/16th in the rear.

Hey Rob,

Yeah, it had toe out in the rear before I had it aligned, not after. It was too hard to say how the handling was, as it only had toe out in the rear for a few days between the time we replaced the bushings and the time I had it aligned. It was rainy and I didn't take it on any back roads. Plus the rest of the alignment was totally jacked, so I'm sure it would have been pretty ass-hatty! haha. I'm totally going to try a more twitchy alignment on the yellow 2.0 and on the orange race car. Blue is just my freeway cruiser, so I'd rather have higher speed stability than have a lane darter.

We're talking about having a RoadGlue/World meetup and tour around the first week or mid April over here in the wine country. Want to combine meets? Geez, I'm hijacking my own thread.

I actually just had my car aligned and corner balanced last week by Jae Lee at Mirage Intl. He is a Porsche only shop here in S.D. who caters primarily to the race guys. My invoice for alignment and corner balancing was $450. Lucky for me we were able to trade work, and he ended up owing me money! Turbo tie rods and fresh alignment... what a difference! Now I just need to install the front sway bar sitting on the shelf in my garage!

The original quote was for $240 for all four corners. However they had to pull a torsion bar on one side and move it a spline to get more height adjustment because one was already maxed out one way or the other. That tacked on another $120. Not a cheap day, but I don't feel the price was out of line for the work that was done. It's strange to have someone else wrenching on my car though!

They charged you 120 for something that takes 5 minutes?

Randy,
Absolutely! I have heard moaning and groaning from lots of guys who used to go on the old hmmmm.... what was it? Then I say RoadGlue and they yell YES! I would love to come down. I may even be able to drive a clutch by then. Personally, I think I can now but Yopu gives me stink-eye everytime a mention it. Last time McMark had that BBQ at his shop I ended up throwing my fan belt and had to limp out to the drive-in to have lunch... I think I am ready for the back roads now though... Pick a date and we can start promoting it...

You guys do not want to miss something like this! Randy knows some amazing routes through some beautiful country. Bring your wife and she can ogle the scenary as you dive through curves that were made for 914's!

Jon,
Some torsion bars that have never been out can be a royal asshat to remove!

Yes!


As far as alignment goes, that's one thing that a lot of people overlook.
I've probably done 100+ by now (mostly on the 911) using the good old strings and scales.

At the track, we check (and reset if needed) the alignment after each run ...
Andy

Yeah, I should have raised a stink. I was beer buzzed and happy that they were going to have it finished that day (I called them that afternoon to have it done) and didn't give it much thought at the time.

Just got back from Dumont's here in OKC (picking up the trans seal for the angle drive) and in talking to Bob, the owner, he quoted me about 160 for the front and rear alignment.

Clay has talked about the string / scale method before and offered to help me align it down there back when. I've considered doing it on my GMs, but hadn't thought much more of it on the 914 until just now.

I know I'm bringing back the dead replying to this thread, but it is the only one I could find with alignment specs outside of stock.

I am looking for a good setup for spirited street driving. I am not very concerned about tire wear, but I will want to be able to drive on the highway as well as the twisties.

My setup is pretty aggressive, probably way too aggressive, but parts that I have accrued over time without necessarily knowing what I was buying. I have 22mm torsion bars, a 19mm Tarrett sway bar (currently not attached), Koni reds set on 1 and 195/50-16 in the front. Out back, 165# progressive springs with Koni reds on 1 with 205/55-16s. Perches aren't adjustable, so I can't really corner balance effectively.

A buddy tells me I should run a fair amount of toe-in in the back and as much negative camber as possible front and rear (making them equal side to side). What would be a good number for toe-in on the rear?

Up front, I was going to run as much negative camber as possible and 1/16th on the toe-in. I have no idea on caster. Planning to use what Randy posted above.

The car is at the shop now waiting for my desired specs. Would appreciate insight from anyone in the know.

I would this really useful for setting up my car. Spirited street driving and occasional track days: http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act...t&id=363723

FWIW,

- Tony

Some people don't get how important an alignment is. Buddy of mine was complaining about his 996 feeling "loose" in the rear end even after replacing the control arm etc. Took it for a quick drive and didn't even need to hit 30mph. So much toe-in the 996 was scooting around trying to find grip. He already ruined his tires as well. Scolded him and sent him on his way.

Good on you for aligning your 914.

Randy's numbers are pretty good for a mild mannered street car.

I think I would have toed in rears in 1/16" for better turn in on his setup vs out. I run 1/8" toe in on the rear but have 50% more tire than most people.

The real key is to find a shop that actually knows what a 914 is and has done 914 alignments before. And not 30 years ago when some guy named Joe worked for them.

My car was aligned by a shop after it was first running and they completely screwed up the alignment and it apparently drove like crap as a result. Then, Jim took it to a highly recommended shop that knew what they were doing and they dialed it in the way it should be. Car rides nice and straight, turns in nicely and I do not get shredded rubber all over my rear fenders. Jim said the difference was so dramatic, he took his Six in to have his alignment re-done.

The same can be said for wheel balancing. Who would think it is that hard to get it right with all of the machines being computer driven and providing a digital readout after the wheel is balanced. Yet all 4 of my wheels, when I had them balanced at a shop near my home, ended up being out on average of 1 ounce. I took the car to Roger Krause Racing in Castro Valley and they are now perfect; the car rides like it is on glass now.

So, yeah.... I paid for 2 alignments and 2 wheel balances. Yes I am sure I could have challenged the charge and prevailed, but the shops that did the "work" spent the time and thought they were doing it right. I felt they deserved something for their effort. I will just never return to them for any additional work on any of my cars or refer anyone else to them.

Something like a visit to the chiropractor? Funny how that works, having things where they should be?

I will be looking for one local to Buffalo or will attempt the old fashion methods

You can corner balance with the front torsion bar adjustments. All you are trying to do is avoid the car bearing most of its weight on a "diagonal", i.e. left front and right rear vs. right front and left rear.

You can't get a perfect left to right balance without relocating weight in the car. And front to rear balance is a function of vehicle design.

What’s the best shop in the Southern Calif area ?

Ask Jim Hoyland

It is crazy.

Quick story to that effect: I have a buddy who does tires on the side (funny in that his day job is as a engine dynamics engineer at a jet engine company). He claims people are worse at balances now that everything has a readout because they just go with it and don't think about what they are doing. I had him rebalance the newly replaced tires on my wife's car and he literally removed 3 strips of weights on each wheel and replaced with a few oz's here and there; with dramatic driving quality improvement.

There is a formula to calculate ideal corner weight for any cars dynamics
We use a worksheet to fine tune our corner balance

Can usually get it tuned with in a pound of the ideal calculation
Brant

Thank you for this thread, Randy.

I need to make the switch from Bilsteins to Konis at some point, and raise the front spindles. Then I think it's time to make a trip to Custom Alignment.

You are so right about a good alignment, and a good alignment isn't quick or just a few bucks—but it can transform the way a car handles and feels...and few cars are more about feel and handling than the 914.